41 replies to this topic

[Sable]

Whats with people wanting to compare e-pens all the time. I don't think there should be any way for others to view my rating or stats or anything. Its bad enough i got the NSA all up in my business, but now some nerds want to shove their e-pens in there too? No thank you. If you want a way to measure progress wait til community warfare and then the ones who control the most territory will be the better ones. Until then keep that garbage out of MWO.

If there's one thing League of Legends and Starcraft have taught me its that esports ruin games. Which is why i don't play either of them anymore.

Edited by Sable, 25 September 2013 - 01:19 PM.

[Olrikus]

Sable, on 25 September 2013 - 01:10 PM, said:

Whats with people wanting to compare e-pens all the time.

It's not about e-*****. It's about improving game experience so everyone has an opponent and teammate of the same skill. And there are not the people who make you sad, but your own skill. So work on it or accept it as it is.

I'm not in a Grand Master league and I'm totally okay with it. With ladder system I can always find an opponent of the same level and just get fun from the game.

[Roland]

Sable, on 25 September 2013 - 01:10 PM, said:

Whats with people wanting to compare e-pens all the time. I don't think there should be any way for others to view my rating or stats or anything. Its bad enough i got the NSA all up in my business, but now some nerds want to shove their e-pens in there too? No thank you. If you want a way to measure progress wait til community warfare and then the ones who control the most territory will be the better ones. Until then keep that garbage out of MWO.

If there's one thing League of Legends and Starcraft have taught me its that esports ruin games. Which is why i don't play either of them anymore.

Turns out, competitive games involve competition.

[Khobai]

Well if players figure out how ELO is calculated they can alter their playstyles to manipulate their ELO. Quite frankly its information the players dont need and theres no real benefit to giving players that information.

[Eddrick]

It would be nice to see your own ranking. But, I'm a little against making it public. I think a good middle ground is to give the player the option to make theirs public. That way, the ones that want to show off their ranking, they can and the ones that don't want to have their ranking on display. Don't have to deal with what may happen from it.

Edited by Eddrick, 25 September 2013 - 03:23 PM.

[Kaspirikay]

OP I agree with you

[Naja]

All for league system, 100% against visible ELO.

Visible ELO is bad because as soon as you give people a reason to disregard an opinion, most people will.
Why does it need to be seen? To create better game balance? That can be achieved without seeing other people's ELO, but that's another discussion.

The main reason it should remain hidden is because it's better for the community to keep it hidden. Ever tried talking on the WoW arena forums with a sub - 2500 rating? Your opinion instantly doesn't matter, regardless of how valid it may be, and that's just bad community management. Also, people with high ELO's aren't always the best and brightest the community has to offer. I have seen some face-palmingly stupid mechanics suggestions from some of the better players of the game. They can pilot well, but that doesn't instantly make them experts on game play balance, and nor is the inverse true.

TL;DR Visible ELO gives people and arbitrary number in which to judge the validity of a comment or suggestion that is entirely unrelated to the ability to play well.

[Mystere]

Olrikus, on 25 September 2013 - 01:46 PM, said:

It's not about e-*****.

Of course it is. Anyone saying otherwise is in denial.

Roland, on 25 September 2013 - 02:42 PM, said:

Turns out, competitive games involve competition.

Well, MWO does not have any, not right now anyway.

[Agent 0 Fortune]

Olrikus, on 25 September 2013 - 10:06 AM, said:

Since ELO system works like a broken toilet, I suggest to make ELO visible for everyone and make leagues like in Starcraft. Bronze playing with Bronze and so on. It will provide smooth progress experience for newbies and free experienced players from low level games.

The problem is there are only enough people playing to put everyone in engorged epeen league.
So you can consider the problem sovled. League populate > total population.

[627]

Naja, on 25 September 2013 - 07:46 PM, said:

All for league system, 100% against visible ELO.

Visible ELO is bad because as soon as you give people a reason to disregard an opinion, most people will.
Why does it need to be seen? To create better game balance? That can be achieved without seeing other people's ELO, but that's another discussion.

The main reason it should remain hidden is because it's better for the community to keep it hidden. Ever tried talking on the WoW arena forums with a sub - 2500 rating? Your opinion instantly doesn't matter, regardless of how valid it may be, and that's just bad community management. Also, people with high ELO's aren't always the best and brightest the community has to offer. I have seen some face-palmingly stupid mechanics suggestions from some of the better players of the game. They can pilot well, but that doesn't instantly make them experts on game play balance, and nor is the inverse true.

TL;DR Visible ELO gives people and arbitrary number in which to judge the validity of a comment or suggestion that is entirely unrelated to the ability to play well.

Reminds me on the battlefield 3 forums. Everytime you post something, your stats will be analyzed to death by those 12-14 years old leet play0rz and the whole thread ends in a flame war.

Just think about public stats here... if someone posts here, there'll be at least one smartass who checks the age of the account and use it against the op. And now give those people insight on stats like K/D ratio which means nothing in this game. You won't be able to disscuss anything objectively. And after that, make ELO public? No thank you. Too much leet forum warriors here...

[Sharknoms]

It is a super bad idea to make everyones ELO puplic.
When I think back at the time I played SC2 more or less competitive... Ugh!
The community is super bad and unfriendly. In every Topic (even the one not about balance) people go like a
calculator. Like

Ranking < X = Argument Auto false

In some cases these "high" ranked players don't bother ready the what the so-called Noob wrote. Because people look at first at the ranking and go "Oh your that league so your argument MUST be false."

[Kaijin]

The ranking system is Elo, named after it's creator, Arpad Elo.

This is ELO:
http://youtu.be/z9nkzaOPP6g

Edited by Kaijin, 26 September 2013 - 02:34 AM.

[Hexenhammer]

I think the ELO should be made public but it our score should be tied to a random color or animal on a daily basis.

"Dude! What's your ELO score?"
"Lavender. What's yours?"
"It says Pink Dolphin."

And the best part is its totally random so two people could have the same ELO scores but different descriptors!

PGIshould do this immediatly. And if they do I want "Spatula" as my Public ELO score.

[Almond Brown]

Roland, on 25 September 2013 - 02:42 PM, said:

Turns out, competitive games involve competition.

True dat. Turns out that the 8 man game play was apparently competeive as well and the best apparently went there to fight the other best. Guess what happened. Many soon figured out that they weren't so good and went back to farming the PUGS in 4's (with sync'in) and remain there to this day.

It is fervently hoped that when CW does come online, that the Dev will make the 2,3,4...12 man group option CW only. If you don't play team based CW, you get to go it alone, (or with the odd lucky buddy sync in) in the PUG division.

If not the CW League will suffer the same fate as the 8 man's. The supposed Leet will run back to the Underhive seeking their fame and fortune while killing of any new players and undermining the game as a whole. LOL!

Edited by Almond Brown, 26 September 2013 - 10:20 AM.

[Roland]

Quote

Turns out that the 8 man game play was apparently competeive as well and the best apparently went there to fight the other best. Guess what happened. Many soon figured out that they weren't so good and went back to farming the PUGS in 4's (with sync'in) and remain there to this day.

The bigger problem was that you needed EXACTLY 8 pilots.

This created a ridiculously stupid process of trying to get folks together to play in that queue for a ton of small units. Someone made a great flowchart showing the process of trying to play in the 8 Man queue.

Those problems were exacerbated by now requiring exactly 12 men.

What they need to do is make it so that you can drop in a group with however many people you want, and get matched against anyone else. Then it removes this "dead zone" between 5-11 men, where you are basically screwed into splitting into smaller groups... because that just makes people not play the game.

If you want a totally separate solo only queue, that's totally fine with me. But the limitation that prevents playing with 5-11 people is just crushing this game. When there are 4 guys already on, and that 5th guy shows up, half the time someone just leaves the game and goes to do other stuff, rather than futz around trying to reform smaller lances, or having someone play by themselves.

Edited by Roland, 26 September 2013 - 10:49 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Roland, on 25 September 2013 - 02:42 PM, said:

Turns out, competitive games involve competition.

Competition. You bring yours, I'll bring mine, We'll fight. Competition!

[Kensaisama]

627, on 25 September 2013 - 09:35 PM, said:

Reminds me on the battlefield 3 forums. Everytime you post something, your stats will be analyzed to death by those 12-14 years old leet play0rz and the whole thread ends in a flame war.

Just think about public stats here... if someone posts here, there'll be at least one smartass who checks the age of the account and use it against the op. And now give those people insight on stats like K/D ratio which means nothing in this game. You won't be able to disscuss anything objectively. And after that, make ELO public? No thank you. Too much leet forum warriors here...

Yeah pretty much why I stopped playing BF3.

[Wispsy]

Khobai, on 25 September 2013 - 02:56 PM, said:

Well if players figure out how ELO is calculated they can alter their playstyles to manipulate their ELO. Quite frankly its information the players dont need and theres no real benefit to giving players that information.

Elo is calculated by winning...why is a player altering their playstyle to win more something we should avoid? The score itself just lets them know how well they are doing at it relative to everybody else. Not really that harmful..

[Sir Ratburger]

I like the idea

[Olrikus]

Naja, on 25 September 2013 - 07:46 PM, said:

Visible ELO gives people and arbitrary number in which to judge the validity of a comment or suggestion that is entirely unrelated to the ability to play well.

Better ELO means that this player plays better. That's the entire point of ELO. And many of you argue that players with good ELO aren't always reasonable. Well, be social and learn to listen to others, your opinion is not the only one. It's hilarious to see advice from people who don't play that well but keep bragging on forums that they are the best (saw that multiple times in multiple MMOs). Most of the people who hate open score systems actually are ones who are too self-centered, have psychological problems or just have to be internet warriors.
And if someone with high ELO is acting like a jerk, well... He will act like that regardless of visibility of ELO. Use your social skills to put him in place or just ignore him. Internet is full of jerks, nothing could fix that.

Edited by Olrikus, 30 September 2013 - 11:28 AM.