48 replies to this topic

[MoonUnitBeta]

Even if there is a particle effect, it's very lack luster. No sounds that I have noticed either. I go for the legs very often, and I always look for a potential ammo explosion once one leg is removed. Once a leg goes off, I wait. The only indicator that I go by to tell if it's turning into an ammo explosion? It's the "Component Destruction" notification in the bottom left corner of the screen. I of course get one for destroying the leg, then it turns into two, sometimes three, and death.

The points system is better at telling me what's going on than the visuals of the game itself.

Also, let's clarify something too. I SEE PARTICLE EFFECTS for when the torso gets destroyed, but THEY ARE PARTICLE EFFECTS FOR COMPONENT DESTRUCTION, and NOT for AMMO EXPLOSIONS. I'm not sure what the testers are looking at, maybe they are just seeing particle effects and say, "yep, he died from ammo explosion and there was particle effects."
What we are saying is, "No, there are no particle effects special to ammo explosions."

How Can You Improve On Ammo Explosions?
I'd like to hear shells ricocheting around, heck, maybe even OUT, blasting out through obvious weak areas like out through armor plating near joints, vents, etc. Loud crackles and tings for ballistic explosion with a very smokey and several dozens of small explosions. And booms and bangs for missiles with big wafting flames fizzing out through all the crooks and crannies with black smoke billowing out. After confirmed death from ammo explosion, keep it rolling! Let the mech fall and have a few more popcorn kernels rattle and explode inside the death mech.

An ammo explosion being so rare really should be something that is exciting, thrilling, and spectacular to see. New players ought to see one happen and howl at their screen in celebration, asking later, "WHAT WAS THAT!!!???!!!" in complete awe and amazement.

What Do Ammo Explosions Mean To Me?
Edit: One thrill for me with ammo explosions is getting the sick satisfaction of the mech crumbling apart into pieces as I stand and watch, holding my fire. I really enjoy being that small tiny David mech that knows exactly what's happening, and instead of lining up my next shot, I'm lining up a better view to watch Goliath inevitably come crashing down. I took your leg, and here I sit - reciting Fifth Element:

Quote

There you see now how all your so called powers counts for absolutely nothing? How your entire empire of destruction comes crashing down, all because of one little cherry.

Edited by MoonUnitBeta, 10 April 2014 - 11:34 PM.

[Danghen Woolf]

I was running around on Alpine yesterday with an AC/10, took a hit that critted the ammo, got the "Autocannon ammunition destroyed" voice over, didn't lose the arm I don't think though. Maybe it just critted out and did not detonate?

[DjPush]

I wanna see that shock wave you used to see when a mech blew up back in the old days.

[LiGhtningFF13]

Ok, I just shoot away someone's leg and killed him instantly. Reason ammo explosion! Was a LRM stalker. Yeah, what should I say hided ammo is nowhere save as soon as I appear !

[Mahws]

Danghen Woolf, on 15 April 2014 - 12:15 PM, said:

I was running around on Alpine yesterday with an AC/10, took a hit that critted the ammo, got the "Autocannon ammunition destroyed" voice over, didn't lose the arm I don't think though. Maybe it just critted out and did not detonate?

There's only a 10% chance of destroyed ammo actually exploding.

[Danghen Woolf]

Mahws, on 16 April 2014 - 10:44 PM, said:

There's only a 10% chance of destroyed ammo actually exploding.

Well, that is just silly. I feel like ammo should go off anytime it is hit. It will make the crit-chasers much more dangerous. As well as reduce people doing silly things for the meta-builds like 10 tons of ammo.

[Tiamat of the Sea]

I'm going to commit a little heresy here and mention the tabletop game.

Why? Because things for that game were balanced on the basis of the way they worked, and ammo per ton, crit slot, tonnage, et cetera was balanced specifically for that.

In this game we use the crit slot, tonnage, and critical hit chances (roughly) from the tabletop game, so there should be a roughly equivalent risk to any given piece of equipment. Not identical, because this isn't tabletop, but something comparable.

The risk/benefit of ammunition was based on ammunition always exploding for the full unexpended damage amount when broken with a critical hit- any critical hit from any weapon. Further, the cost of and restrictions on CASE were set up with this same effect in mind. So we have a few things folding together here.

Clearly, the 10% chance of ammo exploding instead of jamming when broken was intended to increase battlefield longevity (Particularly since any of the ammo in a given location [arm, leg, side torso, etc.] detonating causes all of the ammo in that location to explode). However, changing that intrinsically changes the value of CASE and the risk inherent in carrying ammunition in any given quantity and location. While this is partially offset in some cases by the changes to ammo quantity (ballistic weapons currently get roughly 150% the ammo per ton/crit slot that they do in tabletop) making a given ammunition explosion even more dangerous (although that's a relative thing- given that a non-CASE ammo explosion in tabletop is pretty much always fatal thanks to no full ton of ammo outside AMS and NARC ammo dealing less than 100 damage to the 'mech), the fact of the matter is that ammunition is nowhere near as risky, increasing its relative value.

It seems like ammunition ought to be more risky than it is currently, to come up with a comparable risk/reward system to the original intent of the original game (and to help make CASE as valuable and XL engines as risky as they both are intended to be). That said, one would have to be careful not to go too far (as XL engines are already more risky than originally in one respect thanks to location-targeting weapon precision), but I would think ammo explosion rates should really be higher than they are.

Danghen also has a couple of good points- one of the main things making crit-seeking weapons (especially the LB-X autocannon) dangerous originally is their chance of breaking things and setting off ammo explosions. With each pellet no longer individually able to destroy a piece of equipment or detonate an ammo bin, the effect of these weapons in that regard was severely softened (as demonstrated by the 'LB-10X autocannon are useless' crowd), and their other benefits are just not worthwhile for players who aren't good at leveraging the pellet spread or want a weapon that can be used with good effectiveness in the earlier parts of combat, rather than having to wear the armor off an enemy before really making use of them. It's not as crippling as some people would have you believe, but it's definitely blunting the impact of the LB-10X and will likely have a similar effect on the -20X.

It also helps limit or reduce the use of non-gauss ballistics (which at the very least were king of the hill until this Tuesday's patch and may well still be king of the hill) without actually making the weapon itself less effective, which is really a preferable balance adjustment to reducing the weapon's stats in a game that not only already has gone live, but also has many players who swear by (and up and down and sideways) ballistics.

-QKD-CR0

Edited by Quickdraw Crobat, 17 April 2014 - 07:15 AM.

[Omi_]

I'm going to chime in to say that I never really notice ammunition explosions. At least, nothing that is different from a conventional component death. If it's happening in my games, it's never grand enough to let me know that something special has happened.

This is from my perspective when viewing other players dying.

[Sh4nk0h0l1c]

Thomas Dziegielewski, on 01 October 2013 - 11:15 AM, said:

Our testers just took a look at it and there is nothing wrong .

Popcorn damage still happens and particle effects play as intended.

Listen at the sounds that Dragon makes while his ammo cooks off! Its about the 20th Second!



Like an old ship-diesel-engine thats about to explode =D

We want it back! Why was it removed in the first place??

PS: The sounds when the armor is hit sounds awesome too! I miss that =(

Edited by Sh4nk0h0l1c, 14 June 2014 - 05:51 AM.