32 replies to this topic

[Wispsy]

KhanHeir, on 09 October 2013 - 06:40 AM, said:

As mythical as the 3 second jenners guys.

Lol shows what you know

[MuKen]

I like the direction they took last time, and am already using more pulses than I did in the past. I think they should just take it further: leave everything else alone, but improve the duration more. I'd say 0.25s for SPL, and 0.4s for MPL and LPL would be appropriate. That would make them hands down better for brawling than normal lasers, be a fair trade for the range and heat penalties, and give them an appropriate role.

Edited by MuKen, 09 October 2013 - 10:52 AM.

[Artgathan]

Zyllos, on 09 October 2013 - 06:24 AM, said:

Well, technically, looking at your target shouldn't mean your playing bad. That is a whole can of worms that PGI needs to fix.

The basic idea should be that you look at your enemy to fire and you look away to control where damage comes in. But it should be that if your not looking at your enemy, your not dealing damage. The issue with that is that there are weapons and builds that emphasize the torso twist meta while pin point accuracy exacerbates the problem, making it where facing your target is considered a sign of a bad player. Since when is MechWarrior been about not facing your target and firing weapons?

This is limiting the viability of many weapons (the ones that deal good DPS) while procreating the torso twist meta and those weapons that help in that respect. It is also leading to mechs mostly only taking CT damage, making focused fire much more deadlier than it should be.

Torso Twisting IS what separates good pilots from bad pilots in this game though. If two mechs simply face eachother and exchange shots, whichever deals the highest DPS wins (assuming both pilots stay on target).

DPS weapons should be reserved for fire support styles of play (AC/2, AC/5 are great examples of this). Brawlers rely on distributing damage to stay alive. Burst DPS is more valuable for brawlers, whereas pure DPS is borderline useless for them.

[KhanHeir]

Wispsy, on 09 October 2013 - 06:59 AM, said:

Lol shows what you know

[Grym]

I believe many of you are getting PLs wrong.

They can be effective with the right builds/pilot style. I have no desire to see PLs as the next FOTM.

They do not need a unique mechanic. Its a laser...that pulses. It is what it is.

Damage increase and people start boating them.

Heat decrease, people start boating them.

Weight decrease...people start boating them.

The only real adjustment to be made without unnecessary buffing would be small increase in range/drop off. That i could support.

In reality weapons are very balanced atm. (except ecm...not really a weapon but w/e)

[DocBach]

mwhighlander, on 09 October 2013 - 06:05 AM, said:

The issues is that they have the same exact firing mechanic as standard beam lasers

Pulse Lasers will NEVER be good until they give them a unique firing mechanic.
( Kinda like giving them an upfront high continous rate of fire deal. Laser Machineguns, like they are described in canon )

"Pulse lasers differ from traditional laser weaponry, in that instead of firing one powerful beam, they maintain several laser beams fired off in quick succession. While offering an overall increased rate of fire, the heat output also increases accordingly. Pulse lasers increase damage because they allow vaporized armor to dissipate from the location of damage. This allows subsequent pulses to reach the target area without being diffused by the vapor."

So a laser has to remain with the emitter - so the wub wub we got now is sort of similar to how they are describe in cannon. What the need to do is front load the damage much more than standard lasers, so they concentrate their damage better. Make them in between a PPC that's full on burst damage and a laser which is DOT - like the initial hit does half its damage up front then the duration is quicker to concentrate more of it in one location.

[KhanHeir]

DocBach, on 09 October 2013 - 03:20 PM, said:

"Pulse lasers differ from traditional laser weaponry, in that instead of firing one powerful beam, they maintain several laser beams fired off in quick succession. While offering an overall increased rate of fire, the heat output also increases accordingly. Pulse lasers increase damage because they allow vaporized armor to dissipate from the location of damage. This allows subsequent pulses to reach the target area without being diffused by the vapor."

So a laser has to remain with the emitter - so the wub wub we got now is sort of similar to how they are describe in cannon. What the need to do is front load the damage much more than standard lasers, so they concentrate their damage better. Make them in between a PPC that's full on burst damage and a laser which is DOT - like the initial hit does half its damage up front then the duration is quicker to concentrate more of it in one location.

That doesn't explain the +2 to aim.

REMOVE THE SINGLE FIRE, otherwise the standard laser will beat it every time.

[Psikez]

Please don't give it some awful continous fire mechanic that requires 100% face time.

Front loading half the damage would make them more attractive

Edited by Psikez, 09 October 2013 - 03:29 PM.

[DocBach]

KhanHeir, on 09 October 2013 - 03:26 PM, said:

That doesn't explain the +2 to aim.

REMOVE THE SINGLE FIRE, otherwise the standard laser will beat it every time.

sure it does - the blast is more concentrated to a single location, ie more accurate then a standard laser which is spread all over.

[KhanHeir]

Psikez, on 09 October 2013 - 03:28 PM, said:

Please don't give it some awful continous fire mechanic that requires 100% face time.

Front loading half the damage would make them more attractive

DocBach, on 09 October 2013 - 03:32 PM, said:

sure it does - the blast is more concentrated to a single location, ie more accurate then a standard laser which is spread all over.

No, not at all.

When it turns into a Burst fire instead of DOT it becomes much akin to an accuracy based weapon with none of the advantages of range.


In all of the mechwarrior games PL's have been DPS and fast repeated firing, EVEN MECHASSAULT. What you are suggesting would still put them BELOW standard lasers. Currently STD Lasers have +2 to accuracy because of being DOT and allowing a player to adjust his firing mid-cycle. A player may not land the full 5 damage with his medium laser, but he can adjust and still get 1-3 damage out of the deal.

Thats how the +2 mechanic works.


If we were to do what you said, it would turn the pulse laser into what the laser was in previous games and make it a poptart weapon. It would also make it inferior in chance to hit compared to the standard laser.



People like you are the reason why it took a year for machineguns to finally be fixed.

[DocBach]

KhanHeir, on 09 October 2013 - 03:39 PM, said:

People like you are the reason why it took a year for machineguns to finally be fixed.

If your hung up on the +2 accuracy from the board game, tell me which rule gave the machine gun the ability to do exponentially more damage to internal structure?

Front loading half the damage of the largest pulse laser would only be 4.5 damage to a single location, less than an AC/5 shell. Players would still have to keep the beam on target for the remainder of the duration, just there would be less spread. If you miss the initial shot, you miss that front loaded damage making it a tradeoff. It gives it a niche from standard lasers which are purely damage over time.

[JigglyMoobs]

I bet lots of people would be using the pulse lasers if they were exactly the same range as their normal counter parts.

Trading heat and weight for damage and firing in bursts seems fair, adding drastically reduced range on top of those tradeoffs make it a non-starter.

[Xmith]

LPL are fine except for distance. 2LPL and an AC20 are a deadly combination on my D-DC. Unfortually there are 4 hardpoints that are not being used. SRM/SSRM are a watse of heatsinks and ammo because of the low hit rate from these 2 items I tried 2ERLL/AC20 to get the extra distance but the 2LPL/AC20 by far is superior in dealing out damage.

With any loadout, success is partly due to a persons playstyle. This 2LPL/AC20 loadout suits my playstyle very well.