36 replies to this topic

[Gorgo7]

I've read the heat-sink mechanics and am disappointed by them.

a) all heatsinks intrinsic to the engine are:
Standard= 1 heat-storage and 0.1 heat dissipation per sec.
Double = 2 heat-storage and 0.2 heat dissipation per sec.

all optional heat-sinks (including engine space) are as follows:
Standard= 1 heat-storage 0.1 heat dissipation per sec.
Double = 1.4 heat-storage and .14 heat dissipation per sec.

With all the heat penalties associated with boating my Awesomes are hurting more than ever.

Why must double heat-sinks occupy three slots yet be only 40% more efficient? It would be nice to fire each of three ERPPC's twice at max rate of fire and not explode.
That's right, twice.
Not as an alpha just at max rate of fire.
You know, a standard load-out on an upgraded AWS-8Q is three ERPPC's and lots of double heatsinks. Alas the machine is not capable of supporting them. The 8Q model, the 9M model sure seems to showcase PPC though. That's why I put so much into them. And now they are all laser boats and still suffering from heat.

Am I the only one feeling like a punching bag?

Gorgo7

[Roughneck45]

Gorgo7, on 05 October 2013 - 10:53 AM, said:

Am I the only one feeling like a punching bag?

You pilot Awesomes, so you are a punching bag.

But yeah, I feel your pain. I'm hoping we get mech quirks eventually and Awesomes get some serious advantages with PPC's. Maybe increased cooling and raise the max alpha limit to 3.

[Lightfoot]

Yes, been complaining since the AWS-9M came out with DHS 1.4 instead of the promised DHS 2.0.

Even before Ghost Heat the AWS-9M stock loadout shutdown for 10 seconds or more on the fourth salvo with it's DHS 1.4s. Battletech states it could fire 9 salvos before missing a turn to cool down. Not shutdown, just cooldown.

Now with Ghost Heat it blows up on the second volley. That's just not acceptable gameplay for a game linked to MechWarrior. MWO is just broken even if it can still hobble along.

[SirLANsalot]

The AWS chassis need a different set of pilot efficiencies. Due to there large mass, allowing JUST that mech to ignore the ghost heat system would be a good start.

But oh no...then AWS's would be walking around with the old 6 PPC again...right? Well ya....they would BUT remember how easy it is to KILL an Awesome. It would be the proper balance of RISK vs REWARD, an easier to kill mech but carrying a more powerful payload. A prime example of Glass Cannon (even at full armor it still is).

[Alpha087]

I switch between dual ER PPC and single ER PPC builds on my Orions quite frequently. With the single, while also firing two med lasers I almost never overheat. With the dual build I have to exercise a little more trigger discipline to keep myself from overheating, but usually it's not a big issue either.

A thing to note is that ER PPCs are virtually the same as regular PPCs, just with higher heat generation for longer range. If you -have- to you use 3 at once (though I wouldn't recommend it...), you should consider just switching down to regulars. ER PPCs seem to be more geared towards precision, long distance firing, not constant fire.

As for Awesomes, those mechs are just in an overall bad place now. Pretty sure in the last Ask The Devs, they even confirmed that they were going to make another pass at heavies/assaults to see what they can do about making mechs such as those more viable again. Willing to bet those changes won't bring us back into the PPCwarrior Online era again though, so you're better off adapting however else you can.

Edited by Alpha087, 05 October 2013 - 12:28 PM.

[FerrolupisXIII]

the heat system sucks for everyone, it's just most obvious for super high heat weapons. LRM's surprisingly suffer from this, with the high heat per launcher + ghost heat as well. AC-20 isnt much better off either.

In Battletech i should be able to fire all 4 mediums on my C1 cat without building any heat. good luck with that in MWO

[Gorgo7]

Thanks for all the support!
I don't feel that the Awesome is unworkable as an Assault. I do get good scores piloting them as laser boats. It's just that their primary purpose as an assault PPC platform has been crippled. I hope that the developers don't forget and improve the Heat-sink situation.
Dakka machines have little trouble coping with heat...so there is no reason to fix them.
Again, the anti boating rules don't bother me, I just shoot around them as it were...what bothers me is the lack of heat security for the machines designed to use only energy weapons.

If any developers happen to read this keep it in mind!

Gorgo7

[Darvaza]

Just one of several reasons I am not spending any more money on this game. Shame. since I really enjoyed it and it has so much potential.

[Captain Stiffy]

You guys are hitting on the 2 different ways to do a game like this

Free-for-all (which MWO is) just gives you tools and lets you configure whatever you want.

The "H" named mech game that is witch-hunted by the complete tards stalking around here...
has roles like an MMO. Medic. Tank. Etc... and that's what you are hitting on with the different heat management, etc, between mechs.

[General Taskeen]

I use 3 PPC's, an ER Large, and 1 Small Laser on my 8Q, since pgi decided that its "cool" to add in 0 Damage below 90m in a real time Mech Warrior game. Not only do I contend with its poor hitboxes and scale, but now I can't do jack when getting facehugged.

Driving my Awesome with PPC's hardly feels like I am intimidating anyone, its frustrating, and hardly useful for its intended build which actually did work in other Mech Warrior games - They should give the Awesome a neon Sign with C-Bills flashing all over it.

Edited by General Taskeen, 05 October 2013 - 04:56 PM.

[Karandor]

Why don't people just run 2 PPC + 2 ER LL or something?

No ghost heat and stil totally effective.

[General Taskeen]

Karandor, on 05 October 2013 - 05:04 PM, said:

Why don't people just run 2 PPC + 2 ER LL or something?

No ghost heat and stil totally effective.

Because the Awesome uses 3 to 4 PPC's. Its canon. the Stock 8Q with 3 PPC's and 1 Small laser was basically close to heat efficient with just single heat sinks. It could fire 3 even at the same time and barely have any generated heat in the next turn.

Here is a record sheet to look at: http://bte.battletec...te/pdf/4957.pdf

[Gorgo7]

I couldn't agree with you more General.

General Taskeen, on 05 October 2013 - 04:55 PM, said:

I use 3 PPC's, an ER Large, and 1 Small Laser on my 8Q, since pgi decided that its "cool" to add in 0 Damage below 90m in a real time Mech Warrior game. Not only do I contend with its poor hitboxes and scale, but now I can't do jack when getting facehugged.

Driving my Awesome with PPC's hardly feels like I am intimidating anyone, its frustrating, and hardly useful for its intended build which actually did work in other Mech Warrior games - They should give the Awesome a neon Sign with C-Bills flashing all over it.

[aniviron]

Karandor, on 05 October 2013 - 05:04 PM, said:

Why don't people just run 2 PPC + 2 ER LL or something?

No ghost heat and stil totally effective.

It sounds like a pretty decent build on paper, and indeed, it was one of the first things I tried after ghost heat, and I tried again after the PPC nerf. It turns out that the PPC and the llas are good at very different things, and therefore have very little synergy. It builds tons of heat, and leaves you kinda okay at sniping, decentish at midrange, and bad at close combat.

What winds up happening is that you either have to fire both groups at once, which means your PPCs will miss behind the target, or the llas will be too far ahead and miss, or you fire as separate groups and the firing + reaim time means you never get to torso twist to spread damage- and now with an added hot running bonus!

[Mycrus]

Meh... I run 4 ERPPC - dual / single fire on my 8Q...

[Taemien]

FerrolupisXIII, on 05 October 2013 - 12:31 PM, said:

In Battletech i should be able to fire all 4 mediums on my C1 cat without building any heat. good luck with that in MWO

Fire them once every 10 seconds, not on their faster than a Btech turn cooldown they have ingame.

I took a Awesome into Forest Colony and fired 2 ER PPCs with 15 DHS, they cooled off in about 9.8 seconds. So I think the DHS are working well enough, you just get diminishing returns past 15. But that shouldn't matter too much, at 100 tons they don't diminish enough to make certain configs unusable.

An Awesome can mount 4 PPCs and be viable. You just can't fire all 4 at once, but you can allow a .5 second delay between one side and then fire the other for good effect.

The problem the awesome is that its wide. Has nothing to do with heatscale. Revert the heatscale change and the awesome is still outclassed by other mechs, especially the stalker.

[Alistair Winter]

Well, PGI has explained that the Awesome is supposed to be some kind of beginner assault mech, and that you should eventually progress to the 'high end' Atlas. So it's bad and it's supposed to be bad, by their logic.

I'm not quite sure why they want us to spend 6000 MCs (28 dollars-ish) on a beginner hero mech (Pretty Baby) that you'll eventually abandon in favour of real assault mechs, but I'm sure they have very good reasons. Oh yes. Definitely.

[Mycrus]

The pretty baby is the most heroic of the hero mechs..

The pilot has to be heroic to make it work...

[General Taskeen]

Taemien, on 06 October 2013 - 12:12 AM, said:

Fire them once every 10 seconds, not on their faster than a Btech turn cooldown they have ingame.

Has nothing everything to do with heatscale.

Nope.avi

[oldradagast]

I tossed this idea out there a while ago, and while I sadly expect it'll never be implemented, it would help the Awesome a bit:

Any mech that can use only one type of weapon (energy, ballistic, or missile) has the "ghost limit" cutoff point for all weapons of that type raised by one.

So, if normally 2 PPC's of any type is max you can do without ghost heat, the Awesome 8Q would now be able to use 3 PPC's of any type before triggering ghost heat.

This would not only allow stock builds to be more viable, it helps balance out a huge drawback - being limited to 1 weapon type - and makes the Awesome 8Q fill a niche role as being the PPC king, which makes sense since that's the whole reason the mech was made.