16 replies to this topic

[tucsonspeed6]

So double Xp weekend is here. I've elited everything I own and I don't want to let this weekend go to waste, so I'm thinking of buying something.

As for my play style, I'm pretty much a solid medium pilot: I like to hit and run/ provide support for heavies. I like speed, but I'm not good in lights. I'm not good with missiles, so the kintaro and treb are out. I already own cents and bjs, and I've owned/ elited cicadas before (and stupidly sold them to free up mech bays). Also I primarily solo pug, so I'm not worried about meta game as much since pugs have a little more variety I think.

So... Hunchies or dragons? Which is your favorite? What do you like about one over the other? Are the dragon heroes worth the mc cost? Is one vastly superior to the other?

[Adridos]

Dragons have more "bad" variants. Basically, you want to keep 1C or Flame and just grind out the rest as soon as possible.

Hunchbacks do not have a similar problem as they've got quite an efficient roster of viable alternatives.


So from a simple XP grind perspective, I'd probably suggest going with the Dragons... provided you're aiming to master both of the mechs.

[DONTOR]

Yep I agree do dragons. I really like light hunting in them. 2 Streaks-LBX10-2 medium pulse and 360XL

[N a p e s]

Both are pretty fun mechs with the advantage of having a little more hardpoint variety with the Hunchbacks. For the Hunchbacks both the 4H and 4G are fun if you like ballistics. The 4SP is great as well since it trades the hunch for two smaller missile stubs and a second pair of arm lasers. This might be less to your liking if you are really keen on avoiding SRMs. The 4P is also a lot of fun but you're gonna need some good heat management for that one. If you're looking for a cheaper mech to run this is definitely the better option between the 2 you've proposed since you want to avoid expensive XL engines.

The Dragon on the hand really shines with a big XL engine and personally, I'd recommend at least an XL325 for these. That nets you 87.8kph (pre-speed tweak which makes you speedy for a heavy. You also take advantage of the weight savings for some decent weapons payload. I'm a big fan of the Flame and its the only Dragon that I've kept but the others aren't bad either. Keep in mind that the arms on this mech are pretty low slung so it doesn't make a good ridge humper. Also, the 5N with triple AC2 is pretty fun.

Overall, in your position, I think I'd go with the Huncbacks

[Roughneck45]

Both are a lot of fun.

One thing to remember for Dragons is that you have to sink some money into them to make it worth it. Obviously everything benefits from Endo and DHS, but you must use an XL with the Dragon too, because you cannot get nearly enough firepower to contend with other heavies without it.

Hunchies are great too, I'd go with the 4p, 4sp, and the 4h. Laser boat, SRMs and lasers, ballistic and lasers. All quite a bit of fun.

[Equalizer]

I'm currently mastering the Hunchbacks and while they are fun, I find them a bit too fragile and that's with standard engine, which is a must. Of course, there are some pros as well, short summary of the variants I have below:

- HBK-4G - high mounted 3 ballistic slots that can fit either AC20 or dual (U)AC5 or triple AC2 or Gauss configs. You can even cram in triple AC5 there but that's not very practical. The weapon pod is HUGE and easy to hit and it counts as right torso even when shot from behind (the actual back right torso is tiny and seldom hit), so you need to frontload ALL available armor points. I usually do 47/1 for front/back.

- HBK-4P - the weapon pod is high mounted as well and just as easy to destroy, but has 6 energy slots instead of ballistics. I tried mounting ERLLs or PPCs there along with a bunch of MLs for close range but it didn't seem to work very well. The optimal config for me is the 9 ML one, but you need to fire these 6 and 3 at 0.5 sec intervals. Even then, heat build up is massive and 18 DHS can hardly support any sustained firing. This kinda forces you into hit and run tactics where you volley once or twice and duck into cover to cool down. Actually this is valid for all Hunchies.

- HBK-4SP - arguably the best variant and less than stellar in the current meta - I'm running 4 ML, 1 MPL in the head and SSRMs with BAP. Tried it with ASRM6 but these barely work half of the time while building a lot of heat (unloaded 5 volleys into a Kintaro CT with no apparent result one game and that basically did it for me trying to use SRM). Major strength of the variant is the ability to shoot directly behind it due to it's awesome twist range and good horizontal arm angle, which is very helpful against lights - you can pretend to run, twist and unload 4 MLs dead on, as they tend to pursue you in a straight line most of the time.

As for the Dragon - the 1C is my favourite mech, followed close by Flame. All Dragons are much more durable than Hunchbacks, even with XL engine, have worse torso twist range and just as good arm horizontal angle. Summary of the variants below:

- DRG-1C - this one is pretty cool - might not look like much on paper, but just take it for a spin and you'll be in love... provided you find a build that you like. It has the best high-mounted energy hard points of any mech and I usually put 2 ERLLs there, backed up by 2 MLs and LB-10X. This config allows me to snipe, defend against lights, skirmish, brawl if necessary and so on.

- DRG-5N - arm mounted ballistics and energy, which used to work very well with 2 ERLL + Gauss. Haven't tested it since the Gauss nerf, but I see no reason it shouldn't work just as well now. Feels somewhat mediocre compared to 1C and Flame though.

- DRG-1N - haven't actually played this one, although it seems somewhat more thrilling than the 5N. It has a single high mounted energy point that screams ERPPC, with a ML, LB-10X and 2 SSRMs for close range.

- DRG-Flame - very nice variant that has a single high mounted ballistic hard point instead of energy. If you put AC20 there, you need to use STD engine, making it the sole Dragon that does that. It actually feels very much like HBG-4G this way, but much sturdier since you don't have the hunch. Also the 4 MLs in the arms give you a little more firepower with better accuracy. There are a variety of other builds as well that work quite nicely (most based on the 350XL engine).

- DRG-Fang - don't have this one but considering to buy it lately - seems possible to turn it into pretty decent brawler with decent long range punch.

Hmm, post came up a bit on the long side, hope I've not bored you all to death

[Red squirrel]

tucsonspeed6, on 11 October 2013 - 12:00 PM, said:

As for my play style, I'm pretty much a solid medium pilot:

So... Hunchies or dragons? Which is your favorite? What do you like about one over the other? Are the dragon heroes worth the mc cost? Is one vastly superior to the other?

I recommend the Hunchback then.
As you already have experience with the Cent:
The Hunch is less durable but has deadlier alphas than the Cent.
Also there are 3 very different decent variants.

HBK-4G
AC20@89KPH

HBK-4P
Hit and run alpha monster@98KPH (9 medlas before ghost heat)

HBK-4SP
More durable because of symmetrical layout.


I never planned on getting a Hunchback, but got it with the founders package and it quickly became one of my favorit mechs up to date. You cannot play it Zombie like the Cent as you are more fragile. With its strong alpha strike you are more in a hit and run role. (Especially in the 4P Swayback - get in two alphas and retreat) To master the HBK you need to protect your Hunch (right shoulder) But if you are already used to the shield arm of the Cent that should come natural to you.
Finally, the reviced engine cap gets this baby up to 98KPH!




About the Dragon:
One of the more difficult heavies. Like the Cicada is rather a light, the Dragon is rather a heavy medium. But with a giant CT. (okay the Quickdraw is even worse). Personally I only liked the Flame variant with 4LL. But due to ghost heat that is not viable anymore. So I must say although I have 3 Dragons I almost never use them after getting through the XP tree.
But in case you do not follow my recommendation to get a Hunch I would start with the DRG-1C.IMHO it's the best variant to start with. Many pilots first get a 5N because the 3 Ballistics sound cool, but it is actually the most difficult variant to find a good layout (try smurfies mechlab). The only thing that really works is 3xAC2
or if you use 2 energie waepons as main armament and add 3 MGs. The 1N on the other hand has 2 Ballistics and 2 missles in the CT.

My tip for Dragon variants: 1C, Flame, 1N - and always use the largest XL engine you can fit.


Edit: Although I had lots of fun with this build: DRG-5N
The enemy always gos for the MG arm because they think it is the main weapon arm and MGs are just fun.
I used this before the MG buff and it was hillarious how you can drive people mad with MG fire.

Edited by Red squirrel, 11 October 2013 - 02:22 PM.

[Red squirrel]

DONTOR, on 11 October 2013 - 12:18 PM, said:

Yep I agree do dragons. I really like light hunting in them. 2 Streaks-LBX10-2 medium pulse and 360XL

I might try this DRG-1N.
But generally I do not like 1 energy in arm, 1 energy in torso setups so I might exchange 2med puls and 1 DHS for a LL DRG-1N.
It's more heat efficent and you have at least one long range weapon. Of course the 2med puls are better to hit lights.

Edited by Red squirrel, 11 October 2013 - 02:28 PM.

[Red squirrel]

Should have read your post before posting. You pretty much summed it up.
Just two points:

Equalizer, on 11 October 2013 - 01:24 PM, said:

- HBK-4SP - arguably the best variant and less than stellar in the current meta - I'm running 4 ML, 1 MPL in the head and SSRMs with BAP. Tried it with ASRM6 but these barely work half of the time while building a lot of heat (unloaded 5 volleys into a Kintaro CT with no apparent result one game and that basically did it for me trying to use SRM).

4ASRM6 is huge - depending on the patch.
So I recommend to try it again after another MWO patch.
Unfortunately patches can mess up valid builds quite badly.

Equalizer, on 11 October 2013 - 01:24 PM, said:

- DRG-1C - this one is pretty cool - It has the best high-mounted energy hard points of any mech

Have you tried the Cataphract yet? You will love the high energy mounts in both side torsos.

Edited by Red squirrel, 11 October 2013 - 02:39 PM.

[tucsonspeed6]

Thanks guys. I think I'm going to get both eventually. This thread was way more help than I expected and I have a good idea of where I want to go with each type. I ended up going with a Flame since it will likely generate a ton of cbills for me over the weekend.

[Equalizer]

Red squirrel, on 11 October 2013 - 02:39 PM, said:

Have you tried the Cataphract yet? You will love the high energy mounts in both side torsos.

Yup, had them for ages - one of my first chasis to master... don't play them much though - Ilya and 3D feel like cheating and the 4X doesn't dakka as well as the Jags

Edited by Equalizer, 11 October 2013 - 02:46 PM.

[Red squirrel]

Equalizer, on 11 October 2013 - 02:45 PM, said:

Yup, had them for ages - one of my first chasis to master... don't play them much though - Ilya and 3D feel like cheating and the 4X doesn't dakka as well as the Jags

That's true - especially the 3D
And I'll never forget the week the Phract came out and servers were filled with 4AC5 and 2UAC5 2AC5 4X builds.

tucsonspeed6, on 11 October 2013 - 02:44 PM, said:

I ended up going with a Flame since it will likely generate a ton of cbills for me over the weekend.

Enjoy your new ride. I think the Flame looks gorgeous.

[operator0]

tucsonspeed6, on 11 October 2013 - 02:44 PM, said:

Thanks guys. I think I'm going to get both eventually. This thread was way more help than I expected and I have a good idea of where I want to go with each type. I ended up going with a Flame since it will likely generate a ton of cbills for me over the weekend.

You chose wisely. Nearly all Dragon pilots agree the Flame is the best Dragon.

This is what I run. The super high mounted ballistic really lets you play the sniper role well. Practice with that Gauss mechanic so you can use it in a dogfight too.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5a940c5859beebe

[MisterPlanetarian]

Flame is OK but be careful with the Gauss in side torso w/ XL Engines. AC10 is a much safer alternative and easier to use in high speed skirmishing.

[MisterPlanetarian]

Alternative fits to the Hunchie:

HBK 4G: 82kph AC20 with Speed Tweak.

Probably the best all around AC20 Hunchie. Works on the 4H aswell if you have one. 4Tons of ammo is plenty for a 50t mech as long as you use your 3x ML with every volley and are a decent shot. Avoid shooting out past 300m to get the most out of your AC20 Ammo.. Use your speed to get shots into vulnurable Side Torsos and Rear Torsos.

HBK 4SP: SRM 6 is Overrated.

Std275 Build with Decent Heat Efficiency. SRM4 Won't need artemis and with the Rate of fire upgrade they are a decent alternative to the SRM6+A if you need the extra weight.

[CDLord HHGD]

Before I moved on to other mechs, my 4G was known as the Dragon Slayer.

[Ryokens leap]

OP, I've run Dragons since cb and at this moment my Flame is borked by gauss nerf and my 1c with erppc build is borked by heat nerf. My 1n is now my prime- 300xl, 2 ac5, 2 mlas, 2 ssrm2, BAP, target decay( May buy Fang to run this build with bonus) or 330xl, ultra5, ERLLAS, 2 ssrm2, BAP, target decay. Since crit seeker buff the 5n is great with 330xl, lbx10, 2 mg, ERLLAS, mlasers, BAP.