15 replies to this topic

[Zordicron]

So, was in a Locust thread and someone mentioned maybe getting a C-bill bonus for using AMS on the duel AMS locust. Problem is, AMS doesnt require any real action, so getting c-bills just for equipping it is problematic.

This lead me to think about how AMS could be given some kind of active management, and i dont mean an on/off switch(why dont we have this yet?) I was thinking more like ECM, with a dual mode.

SRM targeting
LRM targeting.

Gives the AMS a significant boost to one type while hindering the other. Consider it like maybe calibrating the targeting range for the AMS. This would make the AMS actually useful against SSRM and SRM volleys( while making it pretty bad at LRM) in one mode while basically leaving it as it is now for the other. honestly, not sure I have ever seen an AMS do anything against an SRM volley, and only on great rarity a SSRM.

This would benefit lights for defense, and also give everyone a way to counter streak boats in general, or at least take the edge off. Heavy SRM volley mechs really have no counter(besides terribad hit detection LOL) and this would allow a defense besides more firepower or evasion. IMO, anything that can be added to the game mechanics that is "not guns" (like info warfare, tech stuff etc) makes it closer to it's roots as a "sim" instead of a FPS is a win, and this type of AMS control would do that.

[Krivvan]

I'd appreciate the ability to turn off the AMS when not needed.

[Aym]

They mentioned they were open to the idea of AMS toggle WAAAAAY back in maybe CB or early OB, but, you know, stage 1 or 2 of their 7 point development process means it's a dream at the moment.

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

Krivvan, on 17 October 2013 - 08:08 PM, said:

I'd appreciate the ability to turn off the AMS when not needed.

iv been waiting 4 this for a long time.

[AZA311]

That is a fantastic and original idea OP. This game needs more defensive capabilties for mechs to survive longer in battle.

The option to equip specialized ams to target either lrms or srms or even an 'all arounder' brings value to mechs that sport dual ams and brings tactical warfare considerations more into the game than measly thread hijacking on/off toggle

Edited by AZA311, 18 October 2013 - 06:28 AM.

[Cereal Killer]

I like this idea quite a bit. It creates a nice niche job for someone if they want to do it but it is also not a game breaking necessity.

[Wolfways]

Reduced damage to one type to affect the other type as it currently does, yes.
Improved damage to any type of missile, no.

[Zordicron]

Wolfways, on 18 October 2013 - 06:59 AM, said:

Reduced damage to one type to affect the other type as it currently does, yes.
Improved damage to any type of missile, no.

Not sure I follow you on this....

I would say the toggle would work:

SRM ON- targets SRM and SSRM with increased effectiveness= shoots down more SRM and SSRM more reliably. In turn, shoots down less LRM. Not an increase to the missle itself, but a decrease to the LRM defensive ability of the AMS. Better then no AMS, but the priority is going to be on SSRM/SRM so the system will not be as effective at LRM defense.

OR

LRM ON- priority LRM. I think this is sort of how it functions already in game, does pretty well at LRM defense, but SSRM defense is sparse at best and SRM defense is poor. Again, not a buff to the actual missiles, just an effect on the defensive value AMS provides against them.



I hadnt thought about splitting the AMS types for equip purposes(posted above). This would make deciding which AMS to equip a tactical decision( factor your loadout, which map after the lobbey is actually in place, etc) and would for sure make dual AMS mechs have an extra advantage, you could do both LRM AMS, both SRM, or one of each.

[Navy Sixes]

Eldagore, on 18 October 2013 - 02:33 PM, said:

Not sure I follow you on this....

I would say the toggle would work:

SRM ON- targets SRM and SSRM with increased effectiveness= shoots down more SRM and SSRM more reliably. In turn, shoots down less LRM. Not an increase to the missle itself, but a decrease to the LRM defensive ability of the AMS. Better then no AMS, but the priority is going to be on SSRM/SRM so the system will not be as effective at LRM defense.

OR

LRM ON- priority LRM. I think this is sort of how it functions already in game, does pretty well at LRM defense, but SSRM defense is sparse at best and SRM defense is poor. Again, not a buff to the actual missiles, just an effect on the defensive value AMS provides against them.



I hadnt thought about splitting the AMS types for equip purposes(posted above). This would make deciding which AMS to equip a tactical decision( factor your loadout, which map after the lobbey is actually in place, etc) and would for sure make dual AMS mechs have an extra advantage, you could do both LRM AMS, both SRM, or one of each.

OR

Anti-Energy Chaff that soaks up 5-7 points from each incoming energy beam.

OR

Anti-Ballistic Explosive rounds that soak up 5-7 points from each incoming ballistic round.

It is already useless to field anything less than LRMx15, and LRM pilots already have to spend tons and hundreds of thousands of cbills just to get their weapon systems to work as advertised, and that's after they've already bought the weapons and ammo. Could we devote less time and energy asking the devs to nerf them further and more time in-game figuring out how to use cover, ECM, group-AMS tactics, or any of the other dozen ways to render LRMs a joke already in the game?

[LauLiao]

Krivvan, on 17 October 2013 - 08:08 PM, said:

I'd appreciate the ability to turn off the AMS when not needed.

Love to use dumb-fired LRMs to find enemy mechs. Just fire into an area you think some mechs may be then just follow the AMS trail to their location.

[Wolfways]

Eldagore, on 18 October 2013 - 02:33 PM, said:

Not sure I follow you on this....

LRM's are already badly nerfed. They need a buff, not another counter.

[Nathan Foxbane]

Probably become moot if they ever get around to making manufacturer variations. The LFN Lindblad Shotgun AMS if I remember my fluff right works like an automatic shotgun and would be more useful against SRMs by putting up a wall of flak than the MG style systems we use currently.

Still need the on/off toggle. More than one perfectly good ambush has been ruined by stray LRMs. I have even used them for birddogging ambushes.

[BeardedGlass]

I don't think the OP is suggesting to nerf LRMs, as the toggle vs LRMS would just be the AMS we have currently... this toggle would just make it so if a mech has anti-SRM/SSRM it would nab more of those but if the pilot forgot to toggle (There should be a 6 second delay between toggle types, so you don't just switch on the fly) they would get dumped on by LRMS or SRMs *If their registration gets fixed* Also, I think the ANti- SRM mode should use more bullet as per the Shotgun flak mentioned above. that would make it so you actually have to choose if you are going to be good against LRMs for a long time, or higher damaging SRM/SSRM for a while.

Edited by BeardedGlass, 18 October 2013 - 05:03 PM.

[Jman5]

Aym, on 18 October 2013 - 05:55 AM, said:

They mentioned they were open to the idea of AMS toggle WAAAAAY back in maybe CB or early OB, but, you know, stage 1 or 2 of their 7 point development process means it's a dream at the moment.

I get the feeling that they looked at the data, saw that players almost never even get close to running out of ammo, and just decided it wasn't worth the effort.

[xe N on]

I don't see any reason why SRMs or SSRMs need any counter. In fact, I rarely see people use SRMs at all. I once tried a CPLT-C4 with 4 A-SRM6 ... it didn't even pass through testing fields.

At the first glance, the number of damage of 4 x A-SRMs looks huge ... but the damage is spread over at least 3 parts even at an assault mech. Not even to mention that the range of < 300 with no extended range quite sucks.

In comparsion, a dual AC-20 build will tear things apart in seconds at equal range. Even my CPLT-K2 with dual UAC/5 and 4 med lasers shreds thing much faster then the SRM build.

People asking for nerfing weapons that already are quite niche ...

[Nik Van Rhijn]

The only change I'd like to see to AMS is that only mechs equiped with it get an incoming missile warning.