54 replies to this topic

[RichAC]

Oh ok that must be an old thread i was reading.
I should of waited for your reply before buying it lol.

[Kazairl]

RichAC, on 19 October 2013 - 07:51 PM, said:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...90a721db748919e

I've tried to strip everything but it still won't let me add endo steel. what are the slots needed for endo steel? I think maybe somethign is wrong. because on smurfy i can add the endo steel no problem?

I'm actually not doing so bad now, i have a positive ratio. still don't know how to aim the srm6 well but getting better.

EDIT: i figured out what iw as doing wrong. I had to save the mech with standard structure first, THEN add endo steel. But it really doesn't change anything at all i don't believe. I can't add anymore stuff, so is there any benefit to using it?

OK I just read on forums somewhere that percentage of your winnings goes to repairs? And endo steel saves more on repairs?

You can free up 8 tonnes by switching to Endo. That weight can be used for either more engine or swapping to harder hitting weapons, like large lasers.

Also move the ammo to your legs to reduce the chances of internal ammo explosions when you take damage.

[MavRCK]

Buying your first mech is one of the most important things you'll do - check out my tier list (link in signature). With regards to your atlas, I think you're trying to do everything with it... maybe try specializing into a role..

Edited by MavRCK, 20 October 2013 - 12:00 AM.

[Taemien]

Otto Cannon, on 19 October 2013 - 04:17 PM, said:

Nah, that's not really true. Back then we had instruction manuals and the single player campaigns to learn from, so you only needed units to tell you the best PvP builds and tactics. You could at least learn the basics yourself. I don't doubt that PGI will put in a good tutorial at some point in the future, but it would have been better to have it in place for all the people who tried the game when it was 'launched', along with UI 2.0.

Umm.. MWO has that too:

http://mwomercs.com/...raining-grounds

Our instruction manuals didn't have videos. Wasn't any youtube or mp4/flv back then either. And by the way, they are putting in tutorials, there's already a movement one. Single player in those days taught you everything NOT to do. The only way you learn how to configure your mech is by playing multiplayer.

Can you imagine a new player going through a single player campaign and modding a mech to do well there and then coming on here? At least the OP is trying to match one of the champion mechs for a good start.


On another note. Too many of you think that its on PGI to hold the hands of new players. When its actually on the new player to have the gumption and the grit to stick it out and learn from their own mistakes and that of others. There is a ton of guides and and videos on this site and these forums for them to get all of the information they need.

And the best thing for them to do, and the reason I give our OP here so much credit is to simply ask when they have questions. Thats when it becomes our job to guide them and not simply troll. It would also be great if one of the units came on here and tried to pick him up. There is nothing better for a new player to the franchise then to have a group to guide them along and make teams with.

[MisterFiveSeven]

RichAC, on 19 October 2013 - 07:51 PM, said:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...90a721db748919e

I've tried to strip everything but it still won't let me add endo steel. what are the slots needed for endo steel? I think maybe somethign is wrong. because on smurfy i can add the endo steel no problem?

I'm actually not doing so bad now, i have a positive ratio. still don't know how to aim the srm6 well but getting better.

EDIT: i figured out what iw as doing wrong. I had to save the mech with standard structure first, THEN add endo steel. But it really doesn't change anything at all i don't believe. I can't add anymore stuff, so is there any benefit to using it?

OK I just read on forums somewhere that percentage of your winnings goes to repairs? And endo steel saves more on repairs?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...8e94bdd83d03876

Just to give you some pointers, this is (roughly) my founder's atlas.

1. Ammo in legs first and always. Fill legs and head, then arms as necessary. Never torsos unless absolutely necessary.
2. You will need ~30 rounds of AC20 ammo for a good length engagement. I always try to make sure the big gun never goes quiet, but you could switch out some of that for SRM ammo. Pretty sure mine runs a STD360 so that's where my extra tonnage goes.
3. You will most likely not be proficient with more than 3 weapon groups. Keep it simple and you'll find that you're using all of your weapons more efficiently and effectively. Removed the LRM20 for another SRM6.
4. Removed AMS (personal preference).
5. STD 350-360 is pretty much a must on atlai. The extra speed might not seem like much, but I promise you, it is. It also gives you way more room to pack in double heat sinks (every 25 rating is another heat sink that doesn't take up crits.

Hopefully this gives you a good flavor. You're definitely on the right track with your design, there's just a few things you can change to make this variant shine.

One other important note: your ac20 does damage WAY past 270m. You can use it effectively out to almost 500m if you're a good shot. You should have used almost half of your ac20 with ranged plinking before you start chewing through your SRMs.

Good luck!

Edit :: It is also important to note that the Atlas has way more tonnage than it can effectively use due to crit space. That tonnage should be going into your engine.

Edited by MisterFiveSeven, 20 October 2013 - 12:01 PM.

[Otto Cannon]

Taemien, on 20 October 2013 - 11:43 AM, said:

Umm.. MWO has that too:

http://mwomercs.com/...raining-grounds

Our instruction manuals didn't have videos. Wasn't any youtube or mp4/flv back then either. And by the way, they are putting in tutorials, there's already a movement one. Single player in those days taught you everything NOT to do. The only way you learn how to configure your mech is by playing multiplayer.

Uh, I think you missed my point a bit there.

I know we have limited tutorials for movement, and also the training ground- I just think PGI would have done better to have a more comprehensive full tutorial running in UI 2.0 at the time of launch.

Also if you notice, I actually specifically said that players needed advice from units for how to build mechs competitively when playing multiplayer. Having the single player mode allowed you to understand how modifying a mech worked though, even though you probably wouldn't build the best ones for killing other players based on fighting against AI. OP was having trouble understanding real basics like Endo which would work the same in singleplayer or PvP.

Hope this makes it clearer.

P.S. When it comes to new players finding information out themselves, it doesn't matter whether they 'should' have the common sense to look for it - at least from PGI's point of view. From a purely commercial perspective the company who want to make money from as many people as possible need to hold the hands of anyone who might pay them, regardless of whether those people are gormless sheep or not. Any newbs who pay money instead of leaving because they're too lazy to read a forum will help the game we all play to keep going.

[Riptor]

This entire topic shows why MWO fails at keeping new players. The utter confusion of the OP is what i imagine almost all new players who have no extensive knowledge of Battletech have to face.

New player retention up my ***

[Taemien]

Riptor, on 20 October 2013 - 12:13 PM, said:

This entire topic shows why MWO fails at keeping new players. The utter confusion of the OP is what i imagine almost all new players who have no extensive knowledge of Battletech have to face.

New player retention up my ***

In PGI's defense. Many 'newer' players (with the exception of the OP), tend to have the attention span of a chihuahua. Do we want many flaky players to stay? Or do we want fewer dedicated players?

Quality or Quantity?

I personally want Quality opponents. Opponents that will rotate their torso after firing to protect XL engines or CTs from my concentrated fire. So far, this community (not limited to new players) hasn't even done that. Opponents that will ignore the silly balance complaints and adapt to an ever changing game. Opponents that can maybe pose a threat 1v1.

[Phra]

MisterFiveSeven, on 20 October 2013 - 11:58 AM, said:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...8e94bdd83d03876

Just to give you some pointers, this is (roughly) my founder's atlas.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...dbd265db479674b

Wasting tonnage is bad mkay!

Or keep the 4 MLs, and equip 2 AC5s in place of the AC20.

[RichAC]

Phra, on 21 October 2013 - 02:00 AM, said:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...dbd265db479674b

Wasting tonnage is bad mkay!

Or keep the 4 MLs, and equip 2 AC5s in place of the AC20.

I think i'm going to keep it stock weapons.  Really like having the lrm instead of two srm6's.   Starting to get a feel for it now. have a good k/d now.but whether i have standard or endo it doesn't seem to make a difference, Because I still can't add anything else to the mech even with endo? I wonder if I wasted a mil on it lol.

Edited by RichAC, 22 October 2013 - 07:55 AM.

[AlmightyAeng]

Rich,

Equipment on your mech takes up 'critical slots,' the amount of rectangles, and 'tonnage,' the actual weight. If you look on smurfy's, it tracks it for you. Endo-steel takes up 14 slots and gives you tonnage back to use. Ferro does the same, but gives you LESS tonnage back, so it's always a bad idea to take it over Endo, and VERY few mechs take both, since it would cost 28 critical slots (which is a lot).

If you feel like you're easier to kill, look in the armor tab (the one shaped light an atlas) and make sure your torsos are all maxed out.

Your heat is a variable, depending on what weapons you load up. They all have different heat. If you take Endo and still can't add stuff, that means you are out of slots, but now have extra tonnage. Try switching out some of your weapons for heavier ones with the same slots, or upgrading your engine to a bigger one. That helps with both speed AND how fast your torso moves.

I'm sorry the new player experience has left you confused, please feel free to keep asking questions!

[Arend]

RichAC, on 22 October 2013 - 07:54 AM, said:

I think i'm going to keep it stock weapons. Really like having the lrm instead of two srm6's. Starting to get a feel for it now. have a good k/d now.but whether i have standard or endo it doesn't seem to make a difference, Because I still can't add anything else to the mech even with endo? I wonder if I wasted a mil on it lol.

I guess the problem is that you added ferro armor and endosteel, which means you used to much slots, therefore you should get rid of that ferro armor to free slots, as a rule of thump ferro armor is usually just usefull on light mechs, a common misunderstanding is that ferro armor is better than standard armor, its not, its just lighter at the cost of 14 slots, endosteel saves alot more weight also for 14 slots, therefore its usually superior to ferro armor!

[Kraven Kor]

Yeah, a few things (some repeats.)

1. NEVER use Ferro unless on a mech that can use BOTH Endo and Ferro. It is just plain terrible, and they need to fix that so that Ferro is an option somehow, someway. Right now, it is not.

2. Endo steel gives you weight for slots. But builds with "big guns" like the AC/20 and LRM/20 and such, or builds that need entirely too many double heat sinks, can't benefit from it - they need the space more than the weight.

3. Ammo. Ammo total x damage of weapon = total potential damage for that weapon. I would not launch into a match with less than 4 tons of AC/20 ammo.

4. Where ammo is placed is important. In the AS7-D, people are going to be gunning for your RT, which houses that big cannon. You don't want ammo there. You also don't need to scrape armor off to fit more stuff, so you have nearly-full leg armor. While some will go for the legs, they generally only do so if they find your armor is light there. With full armor, they are better off aiming at your torso, so you can probably get away with having ammo in the legs. Note that ammo is depleted in a certain order; so the one ton in the RT will get used up first, then the one in the LT, then the ones in the legs - meaning you should have burned through all the torso-housed ammo before your armor on that location is gone and you risk death to ammo explosion.

Here is your build, without Ferro Fibrous, and without Endo Steel:

AS7-D

More ammo for the AC/20, ammo is in better places, and I somehow added more heatsinks.

[King Arthur IV]

HAHAHAHA

the trail mechs "currently" are fully decked out with Double heatsinks, nice weapons and all the nice things. when you purchase your first mech it has squat! and you will feel the pain of slow engines, single heat sinks no artemis etc.

you need to upgrade that shizzz

another thing is after your 25 cadet games, you get thrown into the deep end with all the veterans of the game. they have nice mechs and armor values and better everything because they have had more time to make cbills to upgrade.

this is a huge problem that mwo thought they fixed. 25 games is too soon in my opinion to get thrown in the deep end.

[RichAC]

I already got rid with of ferro armor and added endo.

Wasn't able to change much except, 4 medium lasers... to 2 medium pulse and one large pulse. I could upgrade engine slightly but not much. dam but i just realized they go a shorter distance. using 2 medium pulse and one large laser now.

Edited by RichAC, 22 October 2013 - 07:37 PM.