24 replies to this topic

[Secret Chicken]

Since this forum is meant to be a about the MetaGame and there is no such feature yet released I thought I would give my two cents.

First of all I want to congratulate the devs for a wonderful game. You’ve managed to really makes us feel like were at the command of a real battlemech. The simulation is compelling and is clearly the best I’ve seen so far in any game in the series, and I’ve played the BattleTech: the Crescent Hawk inception! (I think this was the name of the game anyway)

In fact my first exposure to BT was the very first boxed set for the table top game. Since then I have seen the BT universe grow a rich and complex story which should be a wealth of inspiration to any designer that has the privilege to work on this franchise. You’ll understand if I feel rather found of it and very demanding of anyone that messes with it!

Sadly I don’t see any of that in the present game.

Instead I see a game where the main point seems to be to grind (or buy) enough C-Bills to buy different variant of the same mech in order to unlock slight performance improvements, that don’t fundamentally alter or improve my game play experience.

Even if I do manage to buy a new chassis I’m still playing on the same 5 smallish maps. I think they are gorgeous and intricate playing field but they make the games very repetitive.

For what it’s worth here is what I would love to see in the game.

• Give life to my pilot
  
  • Give me a Career three. Start me up as a Second Lieutenant and allow me to rise to the top spot my faction.
    
  • Reward my effort with heavier mechs and better tech. Make sure that when I see an Atlas on the field I’m facing a bad dude that knows how to handle his mech.
• Allow me to join a faction in game and make it matter.
  
  • Faction specific Mechs and Variants and tech
    
  • Create an instant network of allies when I set up a match
• Make what I do matter
  
  • Show me a map of the inner sphere. Allow me to travel from planet to planet fighting people that are also on that planet.
    
  • Give me more varied battle types. Assault/Defense, convoy protection, Drop assault to secure a spaceport. Just make it so that I’m not fighting the same tired death match all the time. There's nothing I would love more than to see the color of Hesperus II change from Steiner Blue to Kurita Red after a concerted effort by players coordinating to achieve a goal with real effect in the BT universe.
    
  • Allow me to fight for my faction in battles that determine how a planet’s resources are harvested. To the winners faction/group/pilot goes the spoil
• More inspiration from the Universes Cannon.
  
  • Assault mechs are rare! Extremely Rare. You wouldn’t know that by the number of Atlas encountered in a typical game today.
    
  • Solaris VII is the gladiatorial world. Why wasn’t this used for the current setting of the game?! It’s perfect for duels, lance and Company level matches on a restricted number of maps. This is a great opportunity to set up tournaments and leader boards in a way that immerses me in the games universe. Who doesn’t want to be the Solaris Champion? This was one of the best features of MW4 in my opinion.
    
  • Yen Low Wang was piloted by Kai Allard-Liao! The best pilot the inner sphere has ever seen. His father is turning in his grave when he sees the number of people that use his old mech! What I mean by this is Hero mechs may make sense if you want to sell more stuff to people but don’t mistake them for content. They are simply a way of gaining a slight edge on your competition by paying real life money. More on that at the end.
• Integrated Voice chat. It’s been said before but it’s just essential. Plus if ECM could be used to jam the other team’s comms that would be great. Sure some people will cheat using Third party VOIP apps but so what. I guarantee that you’ll resolve 100’s of players issues with this (probably not so simple) feature. With one stroke you’ll have increased the tactical depth of the game tremendously. Just ask the people that use team speak.

What I want from this game is something that keeps me coming back for more instead of just a grind.


I’m happy to pay a monthly subscription if I can live the life of a MechWarrior with new missions and rewards every week. Where I feel I am part of a community that affects a living , evolving universe. Where sometimes I have to deal with an incompetent officer or follow a famous one. I want to be given a reason to turn mercenary or join the ComGuards! I want organized campaigns and events.

I want to know that the designers have actually read about the universe and that they care as much as me about it. That is not currently the case at all.

I am not happy to pay money to get an edge on my competitors, to get a new paint scheme or a pair of fuzzy dice. I am not happy to have to pay to get a new mech to play the same match I’ve just played a 100 time. Once again mechs are NOT content. No matter how much hard work has to go into developing them (and they are gorgeous, I love the rethinking of the phoenix package mechs). Sadly a new mech does not extend my enjoyment of the game. It’s not a goal that will sustain my involvement in the game for months on end.

The metagame is what will keep me hooked. It will keep me involved in the forums planning with my faction mates a daring raid on the NAIS in the middle of the Federated Suns. If I can work towards that promotion that will give me my first heavy mech or command of a Company I will log in every night and happily shell out 10-15 USD a month.

What I’m saying is that IGP has the possibility to create a game that innovates and gives thousands of fans of the game the experience they have dreamed of for so long.

I understand that funding is crucial to development but the current model simply feels like the only goal is to squeeze as much money from the fans by doing the absolute safest thing. For my part I’ve invested 0$ so far. I won’t invest a penny because doing so wouldn’t fundamentally change my experience. At the end of the day I can have a very similar experience with a MW4 death match. At least with that game I got a campaign.

I’ve got the money to spend but I need more. I need a complete game. This is still a tech demo in my mind. Although a very fun one. It just makes me cringe to see the wasted potential.

Edited by Secret Chicken, 20 October 2013 - 08:53 AM.

[Novakaine]

Here's to hopefulness.
But sadly I think PGI is just riding out the storm until the founders and veteran players give up in expiration.
And before the PDF piles on me, I play this game everyday and still throw a few pennies at it every month.
For a stompy mech shooter is doing well.
For a game with more depth it just isn't there yet and whens it coming nobody really knows.
Of course if they would just implement lobbies until they got their stuff together it would be a hit.
The community could in fact do their own thing until community warfare was ready.
Then hit us with the good stuff.
I've lamented about my own experiences in previous posts, but to summarize.
1. 96+ players started playing MWO
2. Less than 5 on our TS server at any given time as of this date.
Take from that what you will.
Fire away PDF.

[xhrit]

Novakaine, on 20 October 2013 - 11:58 AM, said:

I've lamented about my own experiences in previous posts, but to summarize.
1. 96+ players started playing MWO
2. Less than 5 on our TS server at any given time as of this date.
Take from that what you will.

This is typical behavior. Did those 91 people go back to playing MW4?
No? They are playing netmech?
No?

[Roadbeer]

Novakaine, on 20 October 2013 - 11:58 AM, said:

I've lamented about my own experiences in previous posts, but to summarize.
1. 96+ players started playing MWO
2. Less than 5 on our TS server at any given time as of this date.
Take from that what you will.
Fire away PDF.

YMMV.
We've seen a 50% nightly increase on our TS server over last month and 3 new people signing up every day on our site... sooo... /shrug

[Kiiyor]

Roadbeer, on 20 October 2013 - 07:08 PM, said:

YMMV.
We've seen a 50% nightly increase on our TS server over last month and 3 new people signing up every day on our site... sooo... /shrug

Indeed. Many of my contemporaries with their own organised factions have also reported similar player returns. The phoenix pack may be partly to thank for the renewed injection of interest. Personally, I think the recent game changes, though hated on the forums, have been good for the game.

My matches are all fairly competitive nowadays as far as fights go, with steamrolls a very rare thing indeed. A couple of new friends are reporting similar stories.

[Corvus Antaka]

good post!

[Novakaine]

N

xhrit, on 20 October 2013 - 06:53 PM, said:

This is typical behavior. Did those 91 people go back to playing MW4?
No? They are playing netmech?
No?

No ours is competitive group.
But since PGI has blindly taken league competition out of the equation.
They have moved on.
Occasionally some will drop, but just that.
If you like simple-minded mech mashing that's fine.
But now that all there is.
But keep on biting at the carrot.
Just why we don't have lobbies are beyond me.
One for the simple-minded lone wolves.
And one for the rest of us.

[xhrit]

Novakaine, on 20 October 2013 - 08:55 PM, said:

N

No ours is competitive group.
But since PGI has blindly taken league competition out of the equation.
They have moved on.
Occasionally some will drop, but just that.
If you like simple-minded mech mashing that's fine.
But now that all there is.
But keep on biting at the carrot.
Just why we don't have lobbies are beyond me.
One for the simple-minded lone wolves.
And one for the rest of us.

They have lobbies in Netmech. My point remains.

1) Game is in development, people want to play it.
2) Game is released, people play it.
3) Time passes, people stop playing it.

This is what is known in the industry as "Business as usual".

[Sug]

Generic comment about white knights.

[Sandpit]

why must people be so cynical and combative? A couple of players jump on here, make an articulate post and then basically get told they're wrong. They are right, this game stinks for longevity and depth. Angry birds has more storyline than this game does at the moment. It's ridiculous that after this much time you can't implement anything even remotely resembling depth to the universe and story we play in.It's always UI2.0, or some other reason. Of course there are people who are not happy

[Mawai]

Interesting post ..

.. but fantasy needs to meet reality.

1) I would love a more immersive game with greatly enhanced character ability development and a meta game so that the combat means something. On this I think we can agree.

2) However, perhaps unfortunately, this will never happen using the model you describe above since many people playing this game do no want a strict Battletech role playing game where you have to work for every mech ... where you start with a light and train and work up your character to earn a rank and a better mech. What you are describing is a Battletech MMORPG which MWO has never claimed to be or tried to be. It may be what you want to play but MWO has never been envisaged that way in any of the publicly available documents I have seen.

3) PGI is supposedly working on Community Warfare which is planned to provide a framework for giving greater meaning to the battles that are currently being fought. They have also said that they plan to enhance and revised the pilot trees and have mentioned they will be adding character levels (though what that can possibly mean or how they will be determined except by total experience ... I have no ideas ... it would be nice if the "levels" had some significance but they have not described what the levels will do). They also mentioned that flexible skill trees allowing a choice of enhancements (whether by player or by mech wasn't clear) was something they were considering but on a very long time scale.

4) PGI has to make money. They make money by selling unique mech variants that offer unique names and unique layouts without generally offering a significant in game advantage. They also sell mech bays, cosmetic items and premium time but hero mechs represent a significant revenue stream. So ... you can expect to see many copies of the hero mechs ... perhaps if this offends your lore sensibilities then consider that perhaps the mechwarriors who purchased one liked the mech used by the lore character so much that they just had to have one the same.


I guess the bottom line is that the game starts from its current state and will be developed from here ...

... the character skill system can be improved.
... tonnage limits can be implemented which may reduce the number of assaults in each match (however, this could result in unacceptably long wait times for assault mechs in the queue - is it fair to ask folks to play mechs they don't like to play just so the games can conform to some tonnage limit intended to increase the number of medium mechs in play?)
... community warfare, overall objectives, goals, corporations, factions, planets, drop ships, resource organization and allocation (these can be added and some of it is certainly planned).

BUT ... if you don't like the mech combat which is the fundamental basis of the game from which anything else will develop ... then you probably won't like whatever is built on it since I can't see the game ever being adjusted to match the blueprint you have described.

[Secret Chicken]

Thanks for the sobering thoughts Mawai.

I'm struggling to make sure I don't sound like a bitter old cook.

You're right in many ways. MWO will never be the MMO i want it to be. I guess that's my greatest disappointment.

Like you said their model is to sell mechs and fuzzy dices. Right now they get a nice injection of funds with every new mech pach they release. Rest assure that we will soon see the clan mechs. But what will happen when they run out of mechs to release. They'll create their own?

I hope someone realizes that the metagame is what will give this game some longevity. Sadly it will be hard to monetize this aspect of the game using micro (some would say macro!) transactions. Hopefully i'm proven wrong

And don't get me wrong I love the battles. There's simply nothing in this game that makes me want to spend my hard earned cash beyond what I get for free. Which is sad cause I, like many other fans I'm sure, am willing to spend quite a chunk of my disposable income on a MW game that gives me even just a fraction of what I described in my original post. BTW I would have probably paid to get the free content.

But don't think I'll get excited about a paint job and fuzzy dice? My money's there for the taking but it seems I'm not their target market. Sniff...

I'll keep playing for now but the search goes on...

Thanks again Mawai for the great comments...

[Novakaine]

Carrot Command Central Strikes again.

[xhrit]

Secret Chicken, on 21 October 2013 - 11:09 AM, said:

And don't get me wrong I love the battles. There's simply nothing in this game that makes me want to spend my hard earned cash beyond what I get for free.

You love the battles? Do me a favor and go to your profile page, click on stats, click on mechs, look at the 'time played' column.
Add it all up. How much total time have you played this game all together?
10 Hours?
20 hours?
40 hours?
80 hours?
120 hours? That is about where I am at... ~120 hours of gameplay, since last wipe.

Sure, I could have gotten everything I have in game for free.

But I personally have played this game for more hours then most retail games that I have payed 60$ for.

So I went ahead and bought some MC for extra mech bays, and a phoenix package to let everyone on the forums know that I am a light pilot.

The developers have more then earned it, at least in my opinion.

[oldradagast]

I am still baffled over the constant demands to start people in light mechs. Light mechs are the hardest class to play well. One mistake and you die. They are also horrible for older players with fading reflexes and those with high ping. Forcing people to start in Lights and preventing them from accessing heavier mechs that are probably more suited to their playstyle is the best way I can think off to drive players AWAY from the game. There are few things as hollow as being curb-stomped in a light mech while knowing that the rules prevent you from having any of the "fun mechs" until later... or never, if you're really bad.

That being said, tonnage limits if/when they show up will reduce the overload of assault mechs, although to be honest that seems to be in decline anyway. It's been a long time since I've seen a match full of assaults, with a few exceptions made for team drops all in Battlemasters (people just trying out the new toys.)

[Sandpit]

oldradagast, on 22 October 2013 - 08:19 AM, said:

I am still baffled over the constant demands to start people in light mechs. Light mechs are the hardest class to play well. One mistake and you die. They are also horrible for older players with fading reflexes and those with high ping. Forcing people to start in Lights and preventing them from accessing heavier mechs that are probably more suited to their playstyle is the best way I can think off to drive players AWAY from the game. There are few things as hollow as being curb-stomped in a light mech while knowing that the rules prevent you from having any of the "fun mechs" until later... or never, if you're really bad.

That being said, tonnage limits if/when they show up will reduce the overload of assault mechs, although to be honest that seems to be in decline anyway. It's been a long time since I've seen a match full of assaults, with a few exceptions made for team drops all in Battlemasters (people just trying out the new toys.)

I agree about lights being the hardest to play. They offer very little room for forgiveness if you don't know what you're doing and contrary to popular belief just running around at fast speeds isn't enough. I likes my Stalker and Bmaster personally though. I love running around in those things and cranking off as a sniper.

[Dreamslave]

Roadbeer, on 20 October 2013 - 07:08 PM, said:

YMMV.
We've seen a 50% nightly increase on our TS server over last month and 3 new people signing up every day on our site... sooo... /shrug

Probably the leftover players who's original groups have disbanded and needed a place to go.

[Fut]

oldradagast, on 22 October 2013 - 08:19 AM, said:

I am still baffled over the constant demands to start people in light mechs. Light mechs are the hardest class to play well. One mistake and you die. They are also horrible for older players with fading reflexes and those with high ping. Forcing people to start in Lights and preventing them from accessing heavier mechs that are probably more suited to their playstyle is the best way I can think off to drive players AWAY from the game. There are few things as hollow as being curb-stomped in a light mech while knowing that the rules prevent you from having any of the "fun mechs" until later... or never, if you're really bad.

That being said, tonnage limits if/when they show up will reduce the overload of assault mechs, although to be honest that seems to be in decline anyway. It's been a long time since I've seen a match full of assaults, with a few exceptions made for team drops all in Battlemasters (people just trying out the new toys.)

Yeah, if anything, it'd make more sense to start people off in the Mediums - you know, the "workhorse" of the IS. Then after they level (or whatever) they can decide if they want to stay put in the Meds, move up into Heavy Mechs, or move down into Lights.

[Tahribator]

The beauty of this game is in its pure, brutal mech combat. I've been playing since 10 months and I'm still mastering some of it's aspects. I couldn't care less about map count or gamemodes as long as they provide balanced fights.

[Novakaine]

Tahribator, on 22 October 2013 - 11:18 AM, said:

The beauty of this game is in its pure, brutal mech combat. I've been playing since 10 months and I'm still mastering some of it's aspects. I couldn't care less about map count or gamemodes as long as they provide balanced fights.

Aspects?
I don't see no stinkin aspects!