18 replies to this topic

[sosegado]

I mostly pilot Atlas's and quite frankly I've been impressed with the light mech tactic of hiding right in front of me just below the range of my weapons while they slowly pick me apart. If I was a light mech pilot I would exploit this also.

But that's really all it seems to be is an exploit.

True it's currently a viable one but I don't think it should be.

This game used to use the "knockdown" effect when mechs collided.

It was a mess.

And very frustrating.

But what about "knockback"?

When two mechs crash into each other they should at least be repelled backward a few meters.

Maybe this should be dependent upon tonnage.

I know light pilots are going to scream "NERF" but it really makes more sense game wise then just having you stand on an Atlas's toes and be danced around like a two year old on their daddy's feet.

If this has already been addressed I apologize.

[PapajIGC]

They used to have this 15 months ago in closed beta. But they removed it because their netcode was some of the worst in history. This would cause light mechs to upend themselves on basically anything not part fo the actual terrain (buildings, bike racks etc). And with the spotty netcode going 150+ kph in a Jenner...you'd lag into stuff even fi your rig and internet was more than adequate.

[sosegado]

What they had in closed beta was "Knockdown" and you are right it was a big mess.

I'm talking about "Knockback" where colliding mechs are physically separated from each other in opposing directions by a few meters.

I can't count the times a full speed light has run into my legs when I'm moving forward full speed and instead of my Atlas kicking them 100 meters away into unrecognizable pieces they stick to me like a tick.

Like I said before it is a usable tactic and it works when the light pilot has some degree of skill. I don't begrudge them using it.

But it really seems more like an exploit than anything.

[RandomLurker]

Collision damage alone would be enough to settle it with the difference in tonnage and armor, CC effects won't be needed. You do armor your Atlas' legs right? I've seen some hilarious moments involving Atlai trying to save weight...

note: in the TT, an Atlas did 20 damage when it kicked something (tonnage/5), the same as an ac/20. Collision damage would not be trivial.

[Taffer]

I like to park my little mech behind big enemy mechs that are trying to back away from my team. Stops them dead in their tracks. DEAD

[sosegado]

I do fully armor my legs. While I can understand some people trying to save weight by doing that, I'm not one of them.

I can see the merit in collision damage, and I support going that route.

Maybe there should be a poll:

Collision Damage or Knockback?

<do the developers consider polls when updating or patching?>

[Durant Carlyle]

Knockdowns and knockbacks (a.k.a. collisions) are the same thing code-wise. We will not be seeing either until they get around to the issue again after CW and the Clans are both fully implemented.

[sosegado]

Durant Carlyle, on 18 October 2013 - 08:58 PM, said:

Knockdowns and knockbacks (a.k.a. collisions) are the same thing code-wise. We will not be seeing either until they get around to the issue again after CW and the Clans are both fully implemented.

No offense friend, but how do you know this and where can I obtain such insider information?

[TheCaptainJZ]

A knockback effect instead of complete collisions sounds like a good idea. I think you should put this in suggestions. It might be easier to actually get working on the programming side if it's not as involved as collisions. Say, you run a jenner into an Atlas, the Atlas should get halted to a full stop with momentum, but the jenner should be pushed back a little with a no momentum or speed carried over. It should also have a stumbling animation of some kind, but not fall down. If two mechs are of similar tonnage, say, within 20 tons, then they should both be pushed and stopped like the jenner, but not as far back. i.e. the effect should be scaled based on tonnage difference.

I suppose this would have to be hammered out quite a bit to get everything working and looking right cause mech don't always collide head on. Probably would have to bring both mechs to a complete stop with no momentum. The difficulty with collisions, I'm guessing, is the fall down and the game didn't know where to place them when getting up not to mention problems with environmental objects as well.

[Durant Carlyle]

Stab Wound, on 18 October 2013 - 09:20 PM, said:

No offense friend, but how do you know this and where can I obtain such insider information?

Devs have said so, within the last month or two. Likely in an Ask the Devs, or maybe in one of the Q&As associated with Launch. It's probably going to be a year or so before they revisit the collision coding -- several things they consider important enough to get done first.

[CraysX]

i would also suggest air-burial (aka air stomp) for the highlander. highlanders are not so very popular, but because of the weight and jumpjets it would litterally bury a light circiling it. i think that would add variation to the game, but alo crying light pilots on the forum.

[Durant Carlyle]

Death From Above is one of the things the devs do want to add in, but would require collisions to be back, as well as other coding to be done. Any 'Mech with jump jets would be able to do a DFA. The "Highlander Burial" is simply the best-known DFA version because it's one of the heaviest 'Mechs with jump jets.

[Sowaka]

Forgive any ignorance on my part... But I always assumed this was intentional? I always thought it was easier to fight lights while using short stubby mechs rather than tall mechs, and if an enemy can get under your weapons then he ought to be able to make you pay for letting him get so close without allies around to peel him off your knees. To me this is sort of like a Catapult complaining about not being able to hit a light with SRMs when the light is just chilling under the shade of his missile boxes. If they didn't intend it then couldn't they just add a little 5m collision bubble around your mech that prevents enemies from getting THAT close?

[Durant Carlyle]

It is intentional, but you used to be able to have actual collisions with other 'Mechs. The light pilot had to be careful not to get too close or he'd get knocked down. Now you can get so close as to actually see the inside of the model of the enemy 'Mech and there's no penalty except for a tiny bit of leg damage.

[Adridos]

Sowaka, on 24 October 2013 - 07:48 AM, said:

If they didn't intend it then couldn't they just add a little 5m collision bubble around your mech that prevents enemies from getting THAT close?

The collision mesh is probably also used for calculating hits, so I don't think that would work.

And, yes, the game was originally designed with knockdowns in mind. Just take a look at how light mechs play when knockdowns are actually in the game:



It was more fun to fight against them and to fight as them, in my opinion (and this is coming from a CB light pilot, I was only on the receiving end of it).

[Durant Carlyle]

It was more fun, and took more skill. I miss those days.

[Phlinger]

If there was a way to turn down the collsions while adding in DFA and making it as devestating as it should be, I'd love to have it back. When I read Knockbacks, all i could think about was Mechwarrior Pong and an allied Atlas accidentally bouncing mechs into the water/open as it casually strolled into position. Everyone would hate that guy, everyone.

[Shaftronics]

With something along the same veins as this;

What about getting knocked off your feat if you recieve a certain amount of damage on your legs or torso dependant on your chassis?

I find it rediculous that a 20 ~ 30 ton mech would be running freely without some sort of repercussions (pun intended) after say, an AC/20 to the face.

[sosegado]

Ronyn, on 25 October 2013 - 06:52 AM, said:

When I read Knockbacks, all i could think about was Mechwarrior Pong

That thought has occurred to me.

Perhaps 'Knockback' would occur only after one or both mechs have reached a certain speed?

Perhaps only if a mech had 20 tons or more weight than its opposing mech?

Maybe only enemy mechs should be affected?

[ My personal favorite idea] = Maybe it could be an installed module that was a one time per match use, triggered by the mech pilot that wanted to use it?

Edited by Stab Wound, 26 October 2013 - 11:44 PM.