27 replies to this topic

[Torafugu]

I had a survey of previous threads on the topic. It seems like the biggest grievance against the idea is abuse.

Abuses can be prevented by making the self-destruct ability a consumable. It can be made expensive enough that griefers would only bankrupt themselves blowing up their own team.

It should have the same 5s countdown with the rest of the consumables (4s for premium and upgraded version). At end of the countdown, the mech explode, doing large amount of damage. However, If the mech casting it is killed during this time, it should explode immediately. The consumable is lost if the countdown is canceled by powering down.

Also the self destruct should not be usable by light mechs.

It should give players something to do if their mech get completely crippled and/or surrounded.

Edited by Torafugu, 26 October 2013 - 10:36 AM.

[Enzane]

No.

If this is so required... (which there is no real reason to end your life so quickly.) Then just power down. Chances are you'll be destroyed faster then a five second count if you do so.

However, Most would want to fight back, run and gun. Simply to gain that extra moments piloting experience. Learning how to fight while outnumbered and outgunned.

Self Destruct would only lead to teams using them in very annoying ways.

[101011]

So you want it to have a five second charge-up time...and if it's destroyed before those five seconds, it blows up? Wut?

[Zerberus]

^^ 1 all of that.

2. Excluding ANY mech class from anything like modules and weapons systems is blatant favoritism and would rightly earn a wave of qq...

Assaults and heavies are already the dominant meta, and you want to make sure that a tool that could be effectively used against them doesn`t end up in the hands of lights, do you want me to guess what you primarily drive?

BTW, your logic is somewhat flawed, because the person who wants to TK at spawn with the self destruct module will need someone to kill him to get it done. SO that would already take 2 griefers to pull off.

Edited by Zerberus, 26 October 2013 - 10:19 AM.

[Coralld]

Edited by Coralld, 26 October 2013 - 10:17 AM.

[Torafugu]

What exactly is the annoying ways you are referring to Enzane ?

I will go ahead and ignore all the unjustified "No"s.
What can be asserted without justification can be ignored without justification.

Edited by Torafugu, 26 October 2013 - 10:19 AM.

[Torafugu]

Zerberus: It's not a module. the griever must purchase the item every time he intend to blow up his own team. Where is he going to get the money or Cbill to do this ?

[Zerberus]

Torafugu, on 26 October 2013 - 10:17 AM, said:

What exactly is the annoying ways you are referring to Enzane ?

I will go ahead and ignore all the unjustified "No"s.
What can be asserted without justification can be ignored without justification.

Imagine getting rushed by 12 spiders, all witth your SD module.

Oh, right, you excluded lights (thereby guiaranteeing it will never happen).... But I can actually work around that...

Imagine getting rushed by 12 cicadas, all with with your SD module.

Torafugu, on 26 October 2013 - 10:21 AM, said:

Zerberus: It's not a module. the griever must purchase the item every time he intend to blow up his own team. Where is he going to get the money or Cbill to do this ?

Ok, then it`s not a module, still doesn`t really matter.

And he still needs a second, active griefer to blow up his own team.

Edited by Zerberus, 26 October 2013 - 10:45 AM.

[Torafugu]

if there is a team that wants to kill me at a cost of a million or more CB, be my guest
if I am rushed by 12 players, I am screwed no matter what they have.


It can happen as long as devs think it will make money, and it will because it'd be the most popular consumable ever

Edited by Torafugu, 26 October 2013 - 10:31 AM.

[Enzane]

Torafugu, on 26 October 2013 - 10:17 AM, said:

What exactly is the annoying ways you are referring to Enzane ?

I will go ahead and ignore all the unjustified "No"s.
What can be asserted without justification can be ignored without justification.

I just don't see the point.

As it stands blowing up doesn't damage the opponents. So the Self Destruct Module does nothing more then prevent someone from tarnishing your KDR. However, the Five Second Count down Ensures it would work only a handful of times, due to the situations you would use it in would kill you before the five seconds.

Or if you are implying (but Never stated) that this device deals damage to the opponents around you. That too would cause horrible gameplay. Suicide bombing is NOT good gameplay.

Overall I see NO USE for this item. It doesn't increase any gameplay. It doesn't make the game any more or less fun. All it does is add an option that no one would use for any gain.

[Torafugu]

Of course it would deal damage to the enemy. I specifically mentioned "Explode" not "Fall over"
LOL.

Nobody is going to "suicide bomb" with this thing. There is no way it will make enough money on its own to cover the cost. It's really useful to spite on enemies that cornered you, not making CB.

[Coralld]

Torafugu, on 26 October 2013 - 10:17 AM, said:

What exactly is the annoying ways you are referring to Enzane ?

I will go ahead and ignore all the unjustified "No"s.
What can be asserted without justification can be ignored without justification.

"Unjustified"? Have you ever played any of the Mechwarrior games where self destructing caused your mech to go thermal nuclear and heavily damage everything with in the blast area?
Now if it is just to end your self quickly with out damaging anything then it would be a wast of money because if I wanted to end my self quickly I would just charge their lines and die by a hail of gun fire or simply run out of bounds and die that way for free.

Torafugu, on 26 October 2013 - 10:35 AM, said:

Of course it would deal damage to the enemy. I specifically mentioned "Explode" not "Fall over"
LOL.

Nobody is going to "suicide bomb" with this thing. There is no way it will make enough money on its own to cover the cost. It's really useful to spite on enemies that cornered you, not making CB.

Problem is that griefers don't care about C-Bills.

Edited by Coralld, 26 October 2013 - 10:54 AM.

[Enzane]

Torafugu, on 26 October 2013 - 10:35 AM, said:

Of course it would deal damage to the enemy. I specifically mentioned "Explode" not "Fall over"
LOL.

Nobody is going to "suicide bomb" with this thing. There is no way it will make enough money on its own to cover the cost. It's really useful to spite on enemies that cornered you, not making CB.

So what you want is "Dead Man's Gernade" sort of thing. A final "Eff you" to those who beat you.

No, It's un-sportsman like, It doesn't fit into the battletech lore (You would not fit a Trillian dollar tank with a self destruct just because you want a final kaboom), And this is not Battlefield or any other FPS with Tea-bagging.

Overall I don't think this fits in anywhere in the game. Dealing with Self destruction would be just as annoying as Capping. Not to mention Stupid to try and balance.

What amount of damage should there be? How big of a radius?
If we are going from Battle Tech Lore, then the Engines are some sort of Nuclear or Fusion device. This means BLOCKS worth of Destruction. IE: you could take out the entire enemy team, if not most of the map.

[Torafugu]

Quote

"Unjustified"? Have you ever played any of the Mechwarrior games where self destructing caused your mech to go thermal nuclear and heavily damage everything with in the blast area?

If people likes to blob so much it's their problem, not mine.

Damage should be determined by testing. It would be a large amount at blast center (~300) and decay by square of the distance.

If people can defeat me without being 2mm from my face, Kudos to them. If people defeat me by surrounding me with five players standing 2 meters away ... well it's their problem not mine

Edited by Torafugu, 26 October 2013 - 10:44 AM.

[Prezimonto]

If it was a random occurrence when you take engine crits, I'd be more okay with it. You do not want something like this that can be used when ever. Griefers come in the wealthy variety at least as much as the poor. It would need to be a random event that you can make the best or worst of when it happens if it was going to be at all.

[Torafugu]

Prezimonto, on 26 October 2013 - 10:40 AM, said:

If it was a random occurrence when you take engine crits, I'd be more okay with it. You do not want something like this that can be used when ever. Griefers come in the wealthy variety at least as much as the poor. It would need to be a random event that you can make the best or worst of when it happens if it was going to be at all.

Fair point, however currently the wealthy griefers can just shoot their own teammates in the back.
The self destruct consumable is not any more abusive than friendly fire.

[Prezimonto]

Torafugu, on 26 October 2013 - 10:47 AM, said:

Fair point, however currently the wealthy griefers can just shoot their own teammates in the back.
The self destruct consumable is not any more abusive than friendly fire.

And so lets add more opportunity for griefing when there are better ways that don't contribute as much? Also in Ask the Devs they've stated several times that this isn't going in the game.

[Zerberus]

Torafugu, on 26 October 2013 - 10:40 AM, said:

If people can defeat me without being 2mm from my face, Kudos to them. If people defeat me by surrounding me with five players standing 2 meters away ... well it's their problem not mine

God I hoope you never get arrested, those poor LEOs

[Enzane]

Torafugu, on 26 October 2013 - 10:47 AM, said:

Fair point, however currently the wealthy griefers can just shoot their own teammates in the back.
The self destruct consumable is not any more abusive than friendly fire.

You get a negative to your final C-bills and XP for killing a friend. Plus it was the team that killed a friend. Not by your choice.

It isn't worth the time to be programmed in. There is no benefit to this item.

[Coralld]

Prezimonto, on 26 October 2013 - 10:40 AM, said:

If it was a random occurrence when you take engine crits, I'd be more okay with it. You do not want something like this that can be used when ever. Griefers come in the wealthy variety at least as much as the poor. It would need to be a random event that you can make the best or worst of when it happens if it was going to be at all.

I'd be fine with this, even if its not realistically accurate.

As for the self destruct module idea, no, just no, keep your illudium pu-36 explosive space modulator out of my BT/MW.