26 replies to this topic

[Bront]

Corison, on 27 October 2013 - 02:53 PM, said:

1.1 damage... against doubled armor.

Yes, but every other weapon is in that same situation, and LRMs can fire twice per 10 seconds (standard battle tech turn) , meaning they do (gasp) twice as much damage as TT.

[Corison]

True true... but then many weapons can fire 3 times or more... All in all their stats are a bit off but some day they may get a good balance in there... Perhaps once they get around to adding real heat effects.

[rolly]

shellashock, on 26 October 2013 - 12:58 PM, said:

Shouldn't they curve and fall like an artillery shell once they run out of fuel? I am not new to Mechwarrior Online, but this has always confused me. Is it for balance reasons? Performance reasons?

Well if you want to stretch it, it could be a safety issue. The last thing you need in the 31st century is unexploded ammunition's... Then again in the 21st century we're suppose to have stopped use of landmines...

[xengk]

rolly, on 27 October 2013 - 03:46 PM, said:

Well if you want to stretch it, it could be a safety issue. The last thing you need in the 31st century is unexploded ammunition's... Then again in the 21st century we're suppose to have stopped use of landmines...

Also to deny salvage of unexploded warhead by the enemy to be use against you later.

[Koniving]

Bront, on 27 October 2013 - 11:53 AM, said:

Actually, they do more damage per missile than TT, at 1.1 damage per missile vs the TT of 1.0

Damage 1/Missile (5) for an LRM-5 in TT.

We're currently doing 5.50 / 5 1.1. Yes, so "1.1" damage against double strength armor.

Go back and translate double armor in TT compared to the time to kill mechs in TT. We're doing 0.555 damage per missile. When a regular LRM missile would do 0.5 in the same ratio MWO's armor. Now fire it twice in 10 seconds and you kinda-sorta got a little bit higher than equal damage. Meaning you have to hit the target twice with each LRM launcher to get the same damage ratio.

Meanwhile SRMs do 2 damage per missile in TT against single armor, 2.5 in MWO against double armor (essentially 1.25 damage in the same damage to time ratio for just one firing). It's made up for by rapid firing rates.

So again I iterate, I'd rather them shoot slower and hit "once" to do a full and comparable damage. Do you know how hard it is to hit some things twice?

An AC/2 fires 19 times in a 10 second period. That's 19 times the TT damage in a ten second period against only twice the armor.
An AC/5 fires 6 times in 10 seconds. That's 6 times the TT damage in a ten second period against only twice the armor.
The list goes on.

The MG fires 500 times the TT damage in a 10 second period. Not counting the bonus damage. Damage of 0.02 per shot would come out to a TT's MG damage in a 10 second window. 2 damage. MWO's early version was 0.04, twice as much (fitting against double armor). Currently it's 0.1 per shot, 1 per second, and 10 per 10 seconds.

(And we wonder why we needed double armor?)

But LRMs have to fire and hit twice in ten seconds to get "0.1" damage more than their TT value. See an issue here? The damage isn't some insanely multiplied number like all the others but.. just 0.1 more than TT, against double the armor.

That's why LRMs feel so useless unless you spam the living {Scrap} out of them. SRMS are also significantly inferior without being carried in insane bulk and even then it can't outmatch an autocannon.
---------------------------------------------
Edit: A little more awake now than when I wrote this.

There's two ways to account for double armor when comparing the base rules versus what we have. One is to half the damage of all the MWO results and throw them at TT. The other is to double all the TT results and throw them at MWO. As Bront said "you fire LRMs twice to account for double armor."

Mkay, so we're going to sit here and double the damage for all weapons in tabletop to account for double armor (as it's easier and less confusing than the other way) and compare them to MWO's, remembering the time factor for each. Remember that both encompass the total damage done in just the first 10 seconds. For LRMs and SRMs we're just using the per missile damage.

Again, all damage is taken from a 10 second period, with tabletop's damage doubled to compete against the armor.

Spoiler

• Weapon.
  
  • TT doubled.
    
    • MWO.
• LRM
  
  • 2
    
    • 2.2 (except in case of LRM 5, then 3.3)
• SRM
  
  • 4
    
    • 5 (for SRM-6. For SRM-2 it's 7.5)
• S-Laser
  
  • 6
    
    • 9
• SPL
  
  • 6
    
    • 7.2
• M-Laser
  
  • 10
    
    • 10
• MPL
  
  • 12
    
    • 12
• L-Laser
  
  • 16
    
    • 18
• LPL
  
  • 18
    
    • 21.2
• PPC
  
  • 20
    
    • 20
• ER PPC
  
  • 20
    
    • 20
• GR
  
  • 30
    
    • 30
• AC/20
  
  • 40
    
    • 40
• MG
  
  • 4
    
    • 10
• AC/10
  
  • 20
    
    • 40
• LB/10
  
  • 20
    
    • 40
• AC/5
  
  • 10
    
    • 30
• AC/2
  
  • 4
    
    • 38

Now do you see a bit of what I mean? Compared to most pinpoint autocannons, LRMs and SRMs are drastically inferior in damage ratios.

Edited by Koniving, 28 October 2013 - 02:25 PM.

[Bront]

Koniving, on 27 October 2013 - 09:44 PM, said:

Now do you see a bit of what I mean? Compared to most pinpoint autocannons, LRMs and SRMs are drastically inferior in damage ratios.

Compared to any weapons, Autocannons are superior at the moment, which is a problem. They fire too fast, and heat is such an issue for other weapons while Autocannons get off mostly scott free.

Not to mention extended range issues with Autocannons.

I agree, it's an issue.

[King Arthur IV]

i guess what really should be happening is, they run out of fuel and then just hit and damage anything in its current path.
basically losing its ability to change direction and what not.

on the other hand i would be cool to see lrm go like 2000m..