287 replies to this topic

[KovarD]

Zerberoff, on 28 October 2013 - 07:10 AM, said:

Nice Clip, now did ya won the match ? and how much different would have been your playstyle in 1pv? how much dmg did ya made? ...or maybe you got steamroled since we didnt saw the end of the match?

Ask for DustMuffins, not me. When he showed us this video he told that he won, did the higher damage of the team (700 damage or so).

The advantage is obvious and evident. Its displayed on video and its in the video description. Don't need to explain if you already have 2 living brain cells.

Edited by KovarD, 28 October 2013 - 07:35 AM.

[Ghogiel]

pbiggz, on 28 October 2013 - 06:22 AM, said:

We already established that it basically has zero uses other than teaching new players how to move. The drone is a dead give away and the ability to see over hills slightly is easily outweighed by forced armlock among other things. Its more of a gimp then an advantage. And i swear if someone links that cicada video, it pretty much proves my point. The only reason anyone could hill hump like that is because the other team was filled with crack heads. THE DRONE GIVES YOU AWAY, ANYONE WITH HALF A BRAIN WILL PEG YOU AS SOON AS YOU POKE YOUR HEAD UP TO TAKE A SHOT.

That's the whole point of using it in the first place lol> you don't have to poke your head up.

Heffay, on 28 October 2013 - 07:14 AM, said:

Ghogiel, it is not a wall hack, essentially or otherwise. A hack implies something outside the normal features of the game that give you an inherent advantage. Since it's part of the supported gameplay it is not outside the game's features, and since everyone has access to it by default, there is no inherent advantage that someone else won't have.

Calling it a wall hack or even comparing it to one is disingenuous.

Playing those semantic games lol.

Point is it allows players to see over/around terrain while still being protected by it. It's like a wall hack in that regard, and the only regard I am comparing it to.

[Heffay]

Ghogiel, on 28 October 2013 - 07:28 AM, said:

Point is it allows players to see over/around terrain while still being protected by it. It's like a wall hack in that regard, and the only regard I am comparing it to.

What good is a hack that negatively impacts your game play? Wall hacks that don't give you any advantage while making it possible to be snuck up on aren't exactly the kind of "hacks" you want to use. But even then, it has a *legitimate* explanation on how it works: the drone. It protects the immersion instead of some mysterious floating eyeball that is never really explained.

If you want to get into semantics, then saying 3PV is like a wall hack is a flat out lie.

Edited by Heffay, 28 October 2013 - 07:53 AM.

[Bilbo]

I don't use it and I don't care if you use it. If you are worried about it affecting competitive games, stick to the competitive queue which only uses 1pv.

[Ghogiel]

Heffay, on 28 October 2013 - 07:49 AM, said:

What good is a hack that negatively impacts your game play? Wall hacks that don't give you any advantage while making it possible to be snuck up on aren't exactly the kind of "hacks" you want to use. But even then, it has a *legitimate* explanation on how it works: the drone. It protects the immersion instead of some mysterious floating eyeball that is never really explained.

If you want to get into semantics, then saying 3PV is like a wall hack is a flat out lie.

Just get a scooby.

[Coralld]

3PV should have NEVER been introduced, EVER!! Now I never use it and actually see very few people use it. From what I can tell when I am PUGing in the NGNG dropship channels and I run into new players, the first question I always get is "How do I turn off 3PV?" Yes it give you an advantage with out a doubt, but people hate it so much 90% of people don't even use it. Now, I still hate it for the peekaboo garbage you can use it for, and is really the only use for it, which is why I have always advocated to either remove it completely, which will never happen, or get PGI to change it so that 3PV works something like the 3PV does in WoT, if you can't see some one in 1PV then you can't see them in 3PV. This would allow people to play and see their pretty mechs with out giving an advantage.

[Heffay]

Coralld, on 28 October 2013 - 08:05 AM, said:

or get PGI to change it so that 3PV works something like the 3PV does in WoT, if you can't see some one in 1PV then you can't see them in 3PV. This would allow people to play and see their pretty mechs with out giving an advantage.

That would completely destroy the immersion of the game. It wouldn't be a mech sim then. It would just be a magic eyeball that mysteriously can't see objects right in front of it.

[Warge]

So... as I see.. most hardcore gamers just left the game. 3PV-lovers are new vocal minority.

[KovarD]

Heffay, on 28 October 2013 - 08:09 AM, said:

That would completely destroy the immersion of the game. It wouldn't be a mech sim then. It would just be a magic eyeball that mysteriously can't see objects right in front of it.

So a red blinking industructable weightless eye-ball that disappears on a mech back is simulation now?

[Ghogiel]

Heffay, on 28 October 2013 - 08:09 AM, said:

It wouldn't be a mech sim then.

[Vodrin Thales]

Ghogiel, on 28 October 2013 - 07:28 AM, said:

That's the whole point of using it in the first place lol> you don't have to poke your head up.


Playing those semantic games lol.

Point is it allows players to see over/around terrain while still being protected by it. It's like a wall hack in that regard, and the only regard I am comparing it to.

As long as it is disabled in 12 mans and future CW matches I don't care whether or not it is an advantage. If people want to use it in 4 man and pug drops they can knock themselves out.

Heffay, on 28 October 2013 - 07:49 AM, said:

What good is a hack that negatively impacts your game play? Wall hacks that don't give you any advantage while making it possible to be snuck up on aren't exactly the kind of "hacks" you want to use. But even then, it has a *legitimate* explanation on how it works: the drone. It protects the immersion instead of some mysterious floating eyeball that is never really explained.

If you want to get into semantics, then saying 3PV is like a wall hack is a flat out lie.

It's only a disadvantage for the individual using it. They can still use it to scout and spot for team mates, and that still constitutes a competitive advantage.

[Heffay]

Warge, on 28 October 2013 - 08:09 AM, said:

So... as I see.. most hardcore gamers just left the game. 3PV-lovers are new vocal minority.

No, we're all still here playing the game. More of us than ever.

Like I said, those who are still complaining about 3PV are doing so out of momentum and mock outrage.

Edited by Heffay, 28 October 2013 - 08:50 AM.

[Alex Warden]

i personally have cooled down slightly. i still think MWO doesn´t need 3pv and that it´s either OP or useless, depending on how it´s done.
but luckily, most players seem not to even use it, so i don´t really think about it anymore.

Edited by Alex Warden, 28 October 2013 - 09:05 AM.

[CrunchTheRobot]

3pv is really not that big of a deal. I don't see anyone using it very often, if at all. Honestly, the only time I ever use 3pv myself is to admire the colour of my mech or take screenshots. I never use it in combat, since it's just terrible to use during then.

[Krivvan]

Here's the thing. 3PV could theoretically be used to give someone an advantage, but it's only enabled in pug matches. Pug matches tend not to give much of an opportunity for you to use 3PV. The 12-man matches where it actually could be abused, it's disabled in.

You'd only ever use it in a few isolated situations. But it doesn't have enough of an impact for one to even notice.

[Thomas Covenant]

bump, clarified some points in the OP.

[Heffay]

Thomas Covenant, on 27 October 2013 - 10:33 PM, said:

I don't want it, even if it's totally fair.

So if it's totally fair and you can choose to not use it, what is the problem?

[Thomas Covenant]

Heffay, on 28 October 2013 - 10:06 AM, said:

So if it's totally fair and you can choose to not use it, what is the problem?

If by "choose not to use it" you mean 12 man premade matches, I haven't had interest in participating in that.

If both visions are fair, that's grand and all, though they are two different tools. I want to have an exclusively 1PV experience. In a mixed perspective mode, the best thing to do is learn the advantages of each of these "balanced" perspectives (more data vs more visual info). That is a different game/experience, one that is fine and dandy, though I could get from Hawken or a million other things, where 1PV matches, at this quality were unique to, and something I enjoyed about, MWO.

Immersion, put simply, and not at anyone's expense.

Edited by Thomas Covenant, 28 October 2013 - 10:24 AM.

[Heffay]

Thomas Covenant, on 28 October 2013 - 10:10 AM, said:

If by "choose not to use it" you mean 12 man premade matches, I haven't had interest in participating in that.

If both visions are fair, that's grand and all, though they are two different tools. I want to have an exclusively 1PV experience.

No, I mean that you said even if it was "fair" you wouldn't want it. You can have the exclusive 1PV experience by never using 3PV. If 3PV doesn't give the other guy any advantage (i.e. "fair"), why would you be opposed to them having it?

It seems rather irrational to hate someone else using something you don't want to use. Do you get mad when someone equips a UAV module if you never use it yourself?

[Sorrow42]

Just stop already. Everyone is so cemented in there views that this conversation isn't going anywhere anymore. So please just stop