16 replies to this topic

[Khobai]

The change to SSRMs is one of the few things PGI has done right with weapon balance.

Remember when SSRMs were unbalanced because they always hit a mech in the center torso? Obviously PGI realized it was a broken game mechanic to allow SSRMs to always hit a mech in the center torso. The question is, why hasnt PGI applied that same reasoning to other weapons? Why am I still getting hit in the center torso for 40 damage from PPCs and AC/20s?

Balancing weapons really isnt that hard PGI. Heres how to do it:

1) make autocannons fire faster and do less damage per shot so they spread damage like AC/2s.
2) make ppcs do splash damage, so they no longer do all 10 damage to one location.

Want to fix SRMs? Thats easy too. Streaks dont have hitreg issues so why not just use the Streak mechanics for SRMs too? Just have SRMs work like Streaks, but instead of automatically hitting, have each SRM roll to see if it hits or misses. Equipping Artemis would increase the number of SRMs that hit like its supposed to.

[CeeKay Boques]

Dude! You nailed it. Lets just take one more step, and Give each mech a Health bar, and we'll just whittle that down. Aiming is dumb.

[Khobai]

Quote

Dude! You nailed it. Lets just take one more step, and Give each mech a Health bar, and we'll just whittle that down. Aiming is dumb.

There is nothing wrong with aiming. Making autocannons fire faster does not mean you cant aim them. It simply means you have to have better aim to keep them on target.

[fandre]

I don't like the idea of losing the big guns. On the other side, I like the idea of splashdamge for the PPC spreading the dmg to several parts. IMO PPC as weapon with splash dmg would make the gauss the only hard hitting/sniping weapon of the game and justify it current nerfed status.

[Pwnocchio]

I think you probably don't want to nerf any of the energy weapons right now since they are already weak compared to their AC counter parts.

I think they probably just need to do some kind of balancing either with the rate of fire of AC's (slowing them down a touch) or making ammo explosions more likely (and costly).

I think most people love the idea of the AC20 (or AC *whatever*) doing all of it's damage in one location.

I don't really like the idea of all weapons behaving the same way (spreading damage like butter over bread).

[PropagandaWar]

Streaks are op and will be downgraded in damage the second their bigger brothers come out so I hate them damage wise. . Doing more damage than what their "I have to actually aim" SRM2 counterparts is silly, and takes away from the immersion. They also cause way to much shake for what they are. The only thing I like about them is they do hit everywhere. I totally disagree on AC weapons. these things weigh a gigaton and require some sort of skill to use and rarely do you get oneshotted. There is nothing wrong with a weapon doing 5-20 points of damage to one location. PPC's are fine where they are. If anything they should have the charge mechanic and the guass should go back to being a guass.

Edited by PropagandaWar, 13 November 2013 - 11:52 AM.

[fandre]

I don't agree with you in the comparison of balistic and energy weapons. For me, the look very balanced with the exception of PPC as a prefered sniper weapon.

Pwnocchio, on 13 November 2013 - 11:39 AM, said:

I don't really like the idea of all weapons behaving the same way (spreading damage like butter over bread).

I see it the same way.

[Khobai]

Quote

Streaks are op

No theyre really not. PPCs, AC/5s, and AC/20s are overpowered. Because those are the weapons everyone uses. Streaks are a niche weapon for fighting light mechs and thats it.

[Cactus In The Rear]

I dont think i could disagree with the OP more.

[skotsche]

That reminds me of the burst implementation of AC in MW3, especially with the recoil getting stronger for bigger AC. I would really love that in MWO.

[Khobai]

Quote

I dont think i could disagree with the OP more.

Then how do you suggest we fix pinpoint alpha? You may not agree with my solution but the fact remains that pinpoint alpha is an incredibly broken mechanic. Medium mechs are as big as heavies/assaults with half the armor; the only way medium mechs will ever be effective is to spread out the damage more, and since rescaling mediums isnt going to happen, the only other solution is to somehow reduce pinpoint alpha from PPCs and AC/20s.

Edited by Khobai, 16 November 2013 - 12:33 PM.

[Relic1701]

Give AC's a Cone of Fire when moving/jumping?

[Kataiser]

Khobai, on 13 November 2013 - 02:46 PM, said:

No theyre really not. PPCs, AC/5s, and AC/20s are overpowered. Because those are the weapons everyone uses. Streaks are a niche weapon for fighting light mechs and thats it.

I disagree with PPCs being OP. I think that they're right where they need to be. The problem is that they complement sub-AC/20 ballistics very well. The (U)AC/5 and AC/20 do need something to tone them down, though. I'll totally agree with that. The AC/10 is oddly in a good spot. Strong, but not back-breaking.

And Streaks are totally niche unless you have at least 5 of the little thing. So other than the PPC thing, this is spot on.

[Khobai]

Quote

I disagree with PPCs being OP.

PPCs are definitely OP because everyone uses them. From blackjacks to highlanders. If they werent overpowered they wouldnt be as prolific as they are. People use them because they pinpoint and weapons that dont pinpoint, like lasers, are garbage in the current meta.

PPCs need to do splash damage so they're less effective at pinpointing. For example, 40% of the PPCs damage could splash to adjacent locations. So like if you hit someone in the CT, the CT would take 6 damage and each side torso would take 2 damage. If you hit someone in the left arm, the arm would take 6 damage, and the left torso would take 4 damage. It wouldnt be random at all, because it would always spread the damage in the same exact way.

I havent heard any better solutions for making PPCs do less pinpoint damage. And im very against random cone of fire. My solution introduces zero randomness into the game.

Edited by Khobai, 16 November 2013 - 12:32 PM.

[Sug]

I don't see what would be so hard about adding a cone of fire/spreading reticle mechanic while your mech is in motion to the game.

You know, something that's been in almost every fps since the late 90's.

[Kataiser]

Khobai, on 16 November 2013 - 12:22 PM, said:

PPCs are definitely OP because everyone uses them. From blackjacks to highlanders. If they werent overpowered they wouldnt be as prolific as they are. People use them because they pinpoint and weapons that dont pinpoint, like lasers, are garbage in the current meta.

PPCs need to do splash damage so they're less effective at pinpointing. For example, 40% of the PPCs damage could splash to adjacent locations. So like if you hit someone in the CT, the CT would take 6 damage and each side torso would take 2 damage. If you hit someone in the left arm, the arm would take 6 damage, and the left torso would take 4 damage. It wouldnt be random at all, because it would always spread the damage in the same exact way.

I havent heard any better solutions for making PPCs do less pinpoint damage. And im very against random cone of fire. My solution introduces zero randomness into the game.

Everyone uses Medium Lasers, too, even when they're not meta-strong. I know what you're getting at, but that's a bad argument. And, honestly, PPCs are not very common right now. The only reason to use one is because you can't strap a ballistic on that hardpoint. Even then, they're very seldom used even when compared to Large Lasers. I've probably seen about 5 people out of the 100 that I've dropped with in LCAF use a PPC in the past month (myself included, because I have one PPC in one 'Mech). That's a mix of lance drops and 12-mans.

I mean, as much as lasers are trash right now, I still see laserboats crack 750 damage, and I honestly do not see that many PPCs right now. They're visible, but they're not mandatory like they were before. Blackjacks prefer ballistics to them now, you don't see Jenners with them now, the PPC Spider is infrequent compared to the mixed lasers one now, Stalkers are going back to mixed laser-missile, with exception... honestly, I don't know why you think they're everywhere. I see probably 1-2 PPCs per game on both teams combined.

(Excluding Highlanders. Those guys still totally rock PPCs.)

[Relic1701]

Sug, on 16 November 2013 - 03:30 PM, said:

I don't see what would be so hard about adding a cone of fire/spreading reticle mechanic while your mech is in motion to the game.

You know, something that's been in almost every fps since the late 90's.

I meant only for Ballistic style weapons only, lasers don't need it as you have to hold on target, and missiles spread the damage around anyway...I'm just thinking...you want to do pinpoint damage and aim at the section you want to hit with your AC's...you have to stand still.

Then there is all the technofluff, recoil, actuator damage etc.....

Edited by Relic1701, 17 November 2013 - 05:41 AM.