16 replies to this topic

[Star Captain Kristen Redmond]

I believe that we do not have a steady variety of weapons to choose from. Take missiles for example, when you want something dead but its just too far away for an SRM but too close for an LRM, MRM comes into the picture! Now here's just a list that I started myself, and other people can add to it and I'll put in here. But please post only reasonable ideas, no giant railguns that cant even fit on an Atlas, no Heavy PPCs that an Awesome can only have one of, get the idea?

[John Branon]

I'd like the delvelopers to work on balancing current weapons. If this process leads to the conclusion an additional weapon would be good for balance then I'd appreciate variety, otherwise adding more will only make balancing even more difficult.

[Sandpit]

I'm sure we'll get MRMs eventually. Just like we'll get ER lasers and such. Much rather other stuff get worked first

[fandre]

Voted yes.

IMO the number of offered weapon types is very limited and becomes more and more boring with the time I play the game. I am a casual player, maybe playing less then 4h a week, but I have tryed a lot of the available weapons and I see everytime the same weapons on the field.

[Corralis]

Tell me something, if a target is too far away for SRM's (which have a max range of 270 metres), how is it possible that the target is also too close for LRM's (which have a min range of 180 metres)?

[Farix]

Harlem Mavalon, on 24 November 2013 - 08:58 AM, said:

I believe that we do not have a steady variety of weapons to choose from. Take missiles for example, when you want something dead but its just too far away for an SRM but too close for an LRM, MRM comes into the picture! Now here's just a list that I started myself, and other people can add to it and I'll put in here. But please post only reasonable ideas, no giant railguns that cant even fit on an Atlas, no Heavy PPCs that an Awesome can only have one of, get the idea?

I'm not sure what situation you are describing because SRMs and LRMs overlap between 180m to 270m. And MRM doesn't appear until 3058, 8 years down the timeline.

[Durant Carlyle]

fandre, on 24 November 2013 - 03:29 PM, said:

IMO the number of offered weapon types is very limited and becomes more and more boring with the time I play the game. I am a casual player, maybe playing less then 4h a week, but I have tryed a lot of the available weapons and I see everytime the same weapons on the field.

The fact that some weapons are more popular than others would not be changed by adding more weapons to the mix.

Existing systems need to be fixed/reworked before any new weapons are added.

[fandre]

Durant Carlyle, on 24 November 2013 - 10:29 PM, said:

Existing systems need to be fixed/reworked before any new weapons are added.

This will not change the "fact" that MWO is in stagnation, becoming more and more boring and monotous.For me, it is more important to make the game more interesting than try to fix a system with buffs and nerfs were everyone has a different opinion on it.

To exaggerate this: Nerfs and buffs will lead to an endless cycle and with your reasoning, we will never get new content

Btw. proof your so called "fact". I guess you cannot and therefore, you should try to avoid such a kind of statement.

Edited by fandre, 25 November 2013 - 02:38 AM.

[Farix]

fandre, on 25 November 2013 - 02:36 AM, said:

This will not change the "fact" that MWO is in stagnation, becoming more and more boring and monotous.For me, it is more important to make the game more interesting than try to fix a system with buffs and nerfs were everyone has a different opinion on it.

To exaggerate this: Nerfs and buffs will lead to an endless cycle and with your reasoning, we will never get new content

Btw. proof your so called "fact". I guess you cannot and therefore, you should try to avoid such a kind of statement.

Adding more weapons is also not going to make MWO less "boring and monotous[sic]". What is needed is a campaign that the players can participate in. Hopefully, Community Warfare will bring that campaign.

Besides, we already have all the mech mounted weapons that are available in 3050. To bring in more weapons, you need to advance the timeline. There are still 29 more mechs that PGI can add before even dealing with the clans, but we already know from experience that the excitement from adding those won't last very long.

[Schrottfrosch]

Actually there are more weapons, way more weapons than you would imagine already in the fluff!

The makers of the tabletop just decided to keep it simple and to break down the variety of weapons into classes of weapons: An AC/20 is not really a certain weapon, but it is a replacement for a whole class of ACs that are capable of doing 20 damage within the turn period of 10 seconds.

If you read up on ACs it is said, that they fire a stream of bullets - the books always tell about the accompanying high pitched winding sound of those guns. Actually they use a cassette of bullets that is being fired - the amount of bullets per cassette differs from manufacturer to manufacturer - the Chemjet 185mm "AC/20" for example fires 3 bullets per cassette, while the Crusher SH Cannon fires 10 bullets per cassette...

I sugested to reinclude these differentiations in another thread already, but I will just leave this "gimped" picture here:

http://imageshack.us...s/690/2zln.jpg/

[Sandpit]

Schrottfrosch, on 25 November 2013 - 03:51 AM, said:

Actually there are more weapons, way more weapons than you would imagine already in the fluff!

The makers of the tabletop just decided to keep it simple and to break down the variety of weapons into classes of weapons: An AC/20 is not really a certain weapon, but it is a replacement for a whole class of ACs that are capable of doing 20 damage within the turn period of 10 seconds.

If you read up on ACs it is said, that they fire a stream of bullets - the books always tell about the accompanying high pitched winding sound of those guns. Actually they use a cassette of bullets that is being fired - the amount of bullets per cassette differs from manufacturer to manufacturer - the Chemjet 185mm "AC/20" for example fires 3 bullets per cassette, while the Crusher SH Cannon fires 10 bullets per cassette...

I sugested to reinclude these differentiations in another thread already, but I will just leave this "gimped" picture here:

http://imageshack.us...s/690/2zln.jpg/

yes and no. There are different types of ammo used. The traditional 3025 AC (the ones we currently have in game) fire a single slug. I COULD be wrong on that, it's been a while since I consulted source books, but I'm pretty sure that's what we have currently.

If it were multiple shots as you suggest then it would have worked like an LBX in TT, not a single shot and hit and location

[Strum Wealh]

Sandpit, on 25 November 2013 - 09:58 AM, said:

yes and no. There are different types of ammo used. The traditional 3025 AC (the ones we currently have in game) fire a single slug. I COULD be wrong on that, it's been a while since I consulted source books, but I'm pretty sure that's what we have currently.

If it were multiple shots as you suggest then it would have worked like an LBX in TT, not a single shot and hit and location

That's conflating two separate issues: the issue of single-shell vs burst fire, and the issue of standard munitions vs special munitions.

Standard ACs generally fired standard munitions in TT/canon fired in multi-shell bursts of varying sizes. there are even gameplay rules (on page 100 of Tactical Operations) for Standard ACs being able to walk their fire across multiple adjacent targets.

Quote

Multiple Targets: Rather than firing at a single target, any type of autocannon can be “walked” across two targets close to one another. An LB-X autocannon firing a cluster shot and Ultra and Rotary autocannons firing at multiple targets are a special case.
No matter what type of autocannon is being used, both targets must be in adjacent hexes and within range of the weapon. Determine the to-hit number for both targets and make separate to-hit rolls against each target, using the higher (more difficult) of the to-hit numbers and adding a +1 modifier for firing at multiple targets with a single shot. Note that this is not the secondary target modifier; that modifier does not apply to this type of attack unless multiple targets also are being attacked in the same phase. If the to-hit roll succeeds, the target is struck by a single hit that inflicts damage equal to half the normal damage done by the weapon (rounded down).

This is also supported by multiple statements from nearly all of the novels, wherein AC fire is described as a stream of shells, and several where specific ACs are described as firing bursts of specific sizes (e.g. the Marauder's AC/5 fires a 3-shell burst in the GDL saga).

By contrast, a description relating to Ardan Sortek and his Victor in the novel Sword and Dagger explicitly describes how the number of "rounds per ton" actually represents a number of cassettes/magazines, where each cassette/magazine contains multiple individual shells.

Quote

Ardan ran a hurried check on his Victor's main armament The right arm Pontiac 100 autocannon had the best chance of scoring a crippling hit on the Thunderbolt, but he was afraid that his swim in the mud might have fouled its feed mechanism.

The autocannon was a devastating weapon. It fired high-speed, rapid-fire streams of explosive, armor-piercing shells from cassettes or carousels fed into the gun one at a time by a complex and occasionally balky autoloader mechanism. Each cassette held 100 shells, and by a widespread but commonly accepted looseness of terminology, each cassette was itself considered to be one round. One cassette round was already loaded. Nineteen more were stored in the autoloader chamber high up in his Victor's right torso. He would have to use that single round carefully, because if the loader jammed, he would not get another chance.

As far as BattleTech is concerned, one ton of "AC/20 ammo" is five cassettes, where each of those cassettes might contain as few as four individual shells (as with the 185mm ChemJet Gun on the Demolisher tank) or as many as one-hundred individual shells (as with the 100mm Pontiac 100 used by both the Victor and the Yen Lo Wang) and firing one "shot" means emptying a cassette with each pull of the trigger (e.g. a 4-shell burst for the ChemJet vs a 100-shell burst for the Pontiac).
Though, the trade-off would be that each individual shell is weaker as the burst size increases - that is, the ChemJet would deal 5.00 damage per individual shell for a 4-shell burst (5.00 damage/shell * 4 shells/cassette = 20 damage per cassette) while the Pontiac would deal 0.20 damage per individual shell for a 100-shell burst (0.20 damage/shell * 100 shells/cassette = 20 damage per cassette).

LB-X cluster shells in BT, on the other hand, fire one-at-a-time (that is, one cluster shell is one "round") and fragment at muzzle exit (in much the same way as real-world canister rounds, or the shotgun shells to which both are so often compared). The use of LB-X cluster rounds against multiple targets in BT gameplay is also covered on page 100 of Tactical Operations.

Quote

For an LB-X autocannon firing a cluster shot, make a single to-hit roll against the highest to-hit number plus 1. If all damage is applied to the first target after a roll on the Cluster Hit Table, then no additional damage is applied to the second target. However, if some of the damage missed the target, use that “missed” Damage Value as the new number to roll on the Cluster Hit Table to determine what damage struck the second target. For example, a controlling player rolls a 7 on the Cluster Hit Table roll for an LB 10-X, resulting in six 1-point Damage Value groupings hitting the first target. That leaves 4 damage and so the controlling player would then roll on the 4 column of the Cluster Hit Table to see what damage is applied to the second target.

LB-X cluster rounds launch all of their cluster munitions at muzzle exit in an expanding cluster (like a shotgun shell or canister round) while LB-X slug rounds are fired in bursts (like the Standard ACs, or like a real-world assault rifle in burst mode).

Separate from that, a Standard AC firing special munitions also fires in bursts that can be walked across multiple targets, with the particular effects of the munition being an additional add-on; for example, the Marauder's AC/5 could fire either a 3-shell burst of standard munitions (each of which behaves like a normal AC shell), or a 3-shell burst of Flechette munitions (each of which behaves like a half-damage LB-X cluster shell), or a 3-shell burst of Precision rounds (each of which behaves like a guided version of a normal AC shell).

[990Dreams]

I think that some more weapons would be cool HOWEVER I think that more Mechs is also desperately needed (i.e Star League, Clan, and well, current IS Mechs). Also, the range coverage is fine as is (there is an overlap between SRM and LRM ranges, I have sniped with AC/20s before, etc.)

[Durant Carlyle]

fandre, on 25 November 2013 - 02:36 AM, said:

This will not change the "fact" that MWO is in stagnation, becoming more and more boring and monotous.For me, it is more important to make the game more interesting than try to fix a system with buffs and nerfs were everyone has a different opinion on it.

To exaggerate this: Nerfs and buffs will lead to an endless cycle and with your reasoning, we will never get new content

Btw. proof your so called "fact". I guess you cannot and therefore, you should try to avoid such a kind of statement.

It is a fact that some weapons are more popular than others.

It is also a fact that even if more weapons were introduced, some weapons would still be more popular than others. There will ALWAYS be some weapons that are more popular than others. Every game has them.

I will admit that MW:O has stagnated due to not having much content released recently. More weapons would only be a very temporary band-aid to that.

Giving us something to fight for would be a longer-term solution, and that's what Community Warfare is all about.

[Sandpit]

You're also qouting from a tech manual that was printed well after 1st edition which isn't the tech levels we're using. There's rules for clicky tech also.

[Arctcwolf]

new weapons will only go so far...and there is a ton of them that will be added over time. when clans come out...they will definitely come with clan weapons, thus just about doubling the current weapon selection.

What should be added in more depth is the electronic suites used in the mechs to improve them(much like the modules and skill trees we have). but instead of just earning them...make some of the purchasable. advanced targeting computers, command modules that actually work, proper beagle probes, ect.

Flamer srm's, long tom, and arrow 4 systems were developed in response to the clan threat, thus im sure we will see versions of them implemented, as well as x-pulse lasers. LBX 20's could come out, ultra ac2, ac10, and ac20's could come out, but those systems need reworking as it is. streak srm 4's and 6's could be added.

[Star Captain Kristen Redmond]

Well, I know what I should do next time I make a new post, check sources and wikis. Should've done that before I created my first post...