16 replies to this topic

[sunToxx]

I just bought a woodland pattern for 750, and of course expected to apply it to all my mechs, just like the colors. But to my surprise, i can not. When i try to apply it to another mech, the game tries to charge me again!?!

I hope this is a bug, because if its intentional, i'm realy baffled. The prices in this game are over the top anyway compared to other mmos. Way over the top. The game isn't realy trying to charge me again and again for the same single pattern, is it?

If yes, i would like to ask for a refund of the mc payed for this pattern, and will refrain from buying anymore patterns.

[Deathlike]

This is intentional.

I suggest you submit to support of your request.

Camos when buying the "unlimited" version is ONLY good for the mech chassis you bought it for.

So, if you bought the camo for a Dragon-5N, you can use it on ANY of the other Dragon variants (1C and 1N) that are not a hero variant (Fang and Flame). You CANNOT use them on a different mech, like the Catapult for instance unless you spend more MC on it.

I hope that clears things up.

If you want it cheaply, just buy the one-time use (which is usually a more reasonable fraction of the MC cost IIRC). Unfortunately, it would ONLY be limited to that mech AND variant until you change the camo on it again...

Camo MC pricing does not make much sense, but that's besides the point.

Colors can be reused anywhere... camos cannot for the most part.

Edited by Deathlike, 12 January 2014 - 02:49 PM.

[Hexenhammer]

Mech vs variant vs chassis

I wish there was an easier way to explain it so people knew exactly what was being talked about without having to go to a dictionary.

[Deathlike]

Hexenhammer, on 12 January 2014 - 03:01 PM, said:

Mech vs variant vs chassis

I wish there was an easier way to explain it so people knew exactly what was being talked about without having to go to a dictionary.

TBH, PGI doesn't make it clear enough in their ad... let alone putting that info in the game. We're left to that aging forum post about colors and camos... and that was a year ago IIRC.

[M4NTiC0R3X]

This issue bothers me greatly as well. (edit: which is why i have never bought more than a one time use, which is stupid silly anyway)

When PGI first came out with colors it was ridiculous, similar to how the patterns are now.

If we continue to submit our opinions to support it's more than likely PGI will re design or add additional purchase options such as a purchase pattern for 1,500 MC and have it forever on all 'mechs)



Then again it's more than likely they'll re design or add additional purchase options without us providing feedback because the system they have now is just junk and even a blind man could tell you that. Believe it or not, PGI feeds us junk and then fix it the way it should obviously be. They just do it on their own timeline. I think it's marketing, they want to do what will make them money but I won't pay for even single uses anymore because the fact is the game is not complete. Not even close.

Edited by M4NTiC0R3X, 12 January 2014 - 03:45 PM.

[Kjudoon]

Camo is bought on a per chassis or per one use individual mech basis only. It is only POSSIBLY worth it when discounted 50% or more. It should cost maybe 10% that of mech bays, and then I'd have bought a lot more of them for as limited a use as you get from them.

Edited by Kjudoon, 12 January 2014 - 04:00 PM.

[z00med]

Totally agree with you.

I would happily spend some cash on colours and patterns every now and then just for the fun of it, but the pricing simply results in me ignoring that feature (besides swappin a bit with the phoenix colours).
I bought a one time use for the Hotrod Pattern for my Cataphract 3D - but just because I had the colours already unlocked from the Phoenix Pack and exactly 125MC left.

PGI could make MUCH more money with customisations if the pricing wouldnt be that ridiculous.

I had one mech already equipped with a Virus Pattern in Reds, thinking about how friggin cool it looked, when I saw the price (one time use(of course) + 3 Prem Colours) - I just cancelled it thinking "Noooo way guys, not even if I could **** cash".

Maybe 10% of the Mechs I see have any colours applied. If they'd reduce the price to a level where a human brain is not screaming "RIPOFF" anymore (and I think of a 50% reduction minimum...) they could easily tripple their sales, therefore making more money.
But hey, all these market-theories our world is based upon, they are all on an island and the average "person-who-has-to-work-for-his-income" is clearly not the target group

Seriously, PGI should contact a buisiness administrator plus get some informations how marketing psychology works... theyd be surprised

[Veranova]

Email support and they can refund you the MC, as this was a mistake.

UI 2.0 will apparently fix the clarity, but for now just be really careful with MC purchases, as their policy is to only refund MC ONCE per customer. They won't budge on that.

[echohead]

The cost of mechbays and mech seems alright to me, but the cost of camo's and colors is so high that I have to laugh it off.

[sunToxx]

Thanks, i did write to support and got the MC back. They responded quickly and were friendly. They did try to justify the camo being sold for only 1 chassis type by the fact that they need to be redesigned for each type though. Might be true for some skins, but surely not for woodland camo imho.

Looking at the pricing and selling strategy used in this game, i got a feeling though that it is not an error that it is not mentioned in the mechlab that a camo is sold on a "per chassis" base. I suppose most ppl do not bother writing to support and complaining about it and asking for a refund. So they buy 1 overpriced "reusable" camo, and afterwards single use ones...

I like this game, but the way pricing and selling is handled i find quite appaling.

Colors are too expensive, although that doesnt bother too much. The simple reusable woodland camo would be ok priced, IF it could be applied to all mechs.

And the pricing of mechs is so far off, its almost funny. Selling a mech for 7k MC is simply a total joke. And even worse, it makes me not want to buy the cheaper mechs either. Going by the current price for MC, when buying exactly the mc needed for a single mech, no single Mech should cost more then roughly about 3250 MC for the fancy top tier ones (that would be 15 Euros). Then many ppl, including myself would probably fill their hangars. Although the game needs to leave beta state, so many ppl happily buy.

I dont mind about special skins and models, they can be way more expensive. In LoL i bought Blackthorne Morgana, Gatekeeper Galio, Eternium Nocturne and a couple other high tier skins, which for my taste are very expensive already netting about 10 Euros each iirc. And it doesnt bother me that there are even higher tier skins with complete remodelling, which i would never buy due to their prices.

Its a complete different matter though with items that affect gameplay. Sure, a bit different hardpoints here and there doesnt seem much. Still it crosses a line. Having gameplay affecting items which can only be obtained with real cash is something that many find appaling, to a point that they will happily play another game even though they like the mwo gameplay.

And mwo even potentiates that by making them insanely expensive. And i'm not saying that 30 bucks is an insane amount of money. I'm saying you get a full game that keeps you entertained for months, or in case of a first person shooter even years, for that money. And all you get here for it is a mech with serious design flaws (eg the hight weapons are mounted in, no back "mirror" etc etc) probably due to the fact that those bots were designed for a tabletop game and not actual use.

Add to that the severe beta feeling of this game. Matches start with players missing. You cant rejoin a game if you get disconnected. Very few weapons and items to install. Very few maps. No way to exclude map/gametype combinations that i do not want to play.

And after waiting for the matchmaker to find a match, there is a minute of doing nothing and waiting. And for a 5 minute match that means you have spend 20% of your time doing nothing, PLUS the time matchmaker needed. And thats only if you survived to the end...

Why not at least let us choose our mechs during the 1 minute wait? That would be such a major improvement, it would make my eyes water

The game is fun, but the combination of factors, on one side the ones that are bothering and are raising the chance of people getting sidetracked by other games and on the other side the insanely overpriced game items, is bound to be counter productive in terms of long term income imho.

I fear that the easy way of farming a very small group of battletech fans who are willing to pay the prices, in the long run harms as well the playerbase as also the income. And i'm not a leecher. Just as examples, in Planetside 2 i spent about 90 Euros and in League of Legends between 100 and 130 iirc. LoL does it pretty much perfectly. It realy lures the cash out of your wallet. I would recommend to try to copy their approach.

I realy hope they fix the pricing and the "beta flaws".

PS: And is it realy necessary that the gamelobby browser uses so much power? My gtx570's ventilators spin up like when playing when its running and gpu usage goes to 28%... . Maybe limit its fps or something?

Edited by sunToxx, 15 January 2014 - 01:28 PM.

[Durant Carlyle]

Front end FPS is already limited to 66.7 FPS. Your machine evidently needs to ramp up to achieve that. Will be changing when UI2.0 arrives next month.

As far as 'Mech pricing goes, be thankful you aren't playing World of Tanks -- they have tanks that cost $60. Not to mention Star Citizen and its pricing. I doubt the pricing structure will be modified for anything in this game.

Match rejoin is coming. Like all F2P games, this one will be evolving.

When you hit Launch, you move from the lobby servers to the match servers. That is why you choose a 'Mech beforehand. If you chose 'Mechs after Launch, it would mean ALL of your 'Mechs being locked out, not just one. They are working on a different way of doing this, but it won't be here until April.

The "very few weapons and items to install" is just BattleTech in this point in the timeline. Right now it's 3051, and in the Inner Sphere (which is what we are playing right now) there aren't any other choices of weapons available. When the Clan 'Mechs and tech come in June, there will be more choices.

The one-minute countdown was put in mainly for 12-man teams so they could rearrange their players into the desired lances before match start.

And your "serious design flaws" is called diversity and variety. Having all 'Mechs with shoulder-height weapons mounts would make them gunbags and the game would be MUCH less fun. Having super-sensors would make the game MUCH less challenging -- as evidenced by the Seismic Sensor module. Before they nerfed it, it was pretty much required on every 'Mech. Not cool. Also, why do you need a "back mirror" or rear-facing camera? You have no weapons back there, so it wouldn't help much.

And despite your "surely not woodland camo" -- the geometry of some 'Mechs is tricky, and making the skins look cool means modifying them specifically for each 'Mech.

[Doctor Proctor]

Only buy colors when they're on sale, and only buy single use camos for your mechs. Things get a LOT cheaper when you do it that way. The colors are still a bit pricey, but unlocking one of the 500MC colors for only 250MC (less than the cost of a mech bay) so that you can use it on any mech seems alright to me. And with the single use camos they're usually something like 1/10th the cost of the full camo, so you can paint 10 mechs with it (which is more than the number of varients of any one chassis) or change a single mech 10 times before you even approach the cost of the unlimited. It's just a much better deal unless you switch camo patterns CONSTANTLY.

[sunToxx]

Durant Carlyle, on 14 January 2014 - 09:51 AM, said:

Front end FPS is already limited to 66.7 FPS. Your machine evidently needs to ramp up to achieve that. Will be changing when UI2.0 arrives next month.

Not sure what you mean with ramp up in this context. Gtx570 is still a pretty powerful card able to handle any game at decent fps. 28% gpu load is incredible, especialy when only drawing 2D stuff. And on top, minimizing it only lowers the load to 22%. If it cant be optimized, maybe limit it to 25 fps. Or add an option for it. I guess i'm lucky it doesnt run on 120fps on my 120hz monitor;)

Durant Carlyle, on 14 January 2014 - 09:51 AM, said:

And your "serious design flaws" is called diversity and variety. Having all 'Mechs with shoulder-height weapons mounts would make them gunbags and the game would be MUCH less fun.

I would agree if there were some system behind it. But to someone not familiar with battletech universe it seems rather random. Also, why not add modules that add a "weapons view" to your cockpit. So you see what your weapon sees.

Its not about making the game easier and dumbing it down. Its about streamlining and making it a smooth experience. Fail cause you lost against the opponent. Not fail cause you lost against the gamemechanics. Make the game feel like a Mercedes, not like a Kia

Durant Carlyle, on 14 January 2014 - 09:51 AM, said:

Also, why do you need a "back mirror" or rear-facing camera? You have no weapons back there, so it wouldn't help much.

Because a lot of people seem realy surprised by the fact that sometimes you got to move backwards back into cover and block you. Happens all the time, especialy deathmatch gametypes.

Durant Carlyle, on 14 January 2014 - 09:51 AM, said:

Having super-sensors would make the game MUCH less challenging -- as evidenced by the Seismic Sensor module. Before they nerfed it, it was pretty much required on every 'Mech. Not cool.

I wasnt around back then. But now that you mention it. The way it is now makes sense for clan play. Highly organized teams playing against each other. But on a pub server, any enemy that is being seen by a teammate who is not locked down by ecm, should show up on radar. On radar, not that all can lock on and fire their lrm, obviously.

Many things in this game are good for clanplay, but bad for pub servers. A common mistake you encounter in many games. Somehow the fact that most matches played are actualy pub games in most Titles, is completely ignored. A realy unnecessary way to lose players imho.

Durant Carlyle, on 14 January 2014 - 09:51 AM, said:

And despite your "surely not woodland camo" -- the geometry of some 'Mechs is tricky, and making the skins look cool means modifying them specifically for each 'Mech.

Agreed on most skins. But not the simple woodland camo. I guess you could invest hours and hours optimizing it. But considering you never get a that close look at your oponents, that seems to be wasted time for this skin.

Still, having to modify the skins for each mech still doesnt justify the price. But if the mwo investors prefer to sell little for a high price, rather then more for a lower price, then that is how it is.

I too think though that they should hire someone familiar with the psychology of selling stuff. Because the way it is handled here shows clearly that they did not hire anyone for this purpose as its pretty much the opposite. Making ppl feel like, omg what a ripoff, does not get you a high number of sales.

[GoManGo]

In away its a rip off because its not explained properly in the item description of what the camo can be used on. But that's the way the MMO's market there micro transactions these days.PGI should do there camo and items and colors all the same if you purchased the permanent item option you should be able to use it on all mechs.World Of Tanks does the same thing as PGI minimal descriptive items that are not what you think they are or used for sometimes.

I bought a tank with credits/USD when I got said tank I was surprised the turret would not turn.So I asked on the general chat hey my turret wont turn on the tank I bought and the responding person LOL yes it sucks they don't put that in the description before you buy it. Needless to say I felt ripped off by WOT.But then again I did not research the tank before I bought it so its buyers beware. I have known since early beta PGI stole the core game design from World Of Tanks and made World Of Mechs/MWO.

Edited by GoManGo, 14 January 2014 - 12:49 PM.

[Tigreen]

sunToxx, on 12 January 2014 - 02:41 PM, said:

I just bought a woodland pattern for 750, and of course expected to apply it to all my mechs, just like the colors. But to my surprise, i can not. When i try to apply it to another mech, the game tries to charge me again!?!

I hope this is a bug, because if its intentional, i'm realy baffled. The prices in this game are over the top anyway compared to other mmos. Way over the top. The game isn't realy trying to charge me again and again for the same single pattern, is it?

If yes, i would like to ask for a refund of the mc payed for this pattern, and will refrain from buying anymore patterns.

In my opinion, ripoff. But then again who the hell am I? Some people are ok with it, but I'm not and most of my friends are of a similar mind set. At 50-100 mc I might buy colors and patterns. I might buy a few of them. 500 is more them a little steep.

I could see a few tiers 50mc stuff, 100mc stuff and a few 500 mc. But at 500 what ever it is needs to unlock for all mechs not just one style/variant.

But what do I know...

Edited by Tigreen, 14 January 2014 - 05:47 PM.

[cSand]

sunToxx, on 14 January 2014 - 12:01 PM, said:

Not sure what you mean with ramp up in this context. Gtx570 is still a pretty powerful card able to handle any game at decent fps. 28% gpu load is incredible, especialy when only drawing 2D stuff. And on top, minimizing it only lowers the load to 22%. If it cant be optimized, maybe limit it to 25 fps. Or add an option for it. I guess i'm lucky it doesnt run on 120fps on my 120hz monitor;)

Well, TBH it's actually all 3d stuff there with a 2d overlay looks like... you can rotate the mech and everything.. so 28% gpu load isn't really that bad, in fact I'd say that's right around a good level

[Fooooo]

cSand, on 14 January 2014 - 06:02 PM, said:

Well, TBH it's actually all 3d stuff there with a 2d overlay looks like... you can rotate the mech and everything.. so 28% gpu load isn't really that bad, in fact I'd say that's right around a good level

cSand is right, the mechlab is basically running the game on the mechlab map with an overlay to display all the mechlab info etc.

So it should use a fair bit less gpu than a normal match, but not nothing as if it were just running some 2d boxes with text etc.


BTW OP, you can limit the frames yourself by adding into your user.cfg or system.cfg

sys_maxfps = 30




However this will keep it locked to 30 during a match also, and you may not like that........You can get around it if you know how to setup a keybinding to run a cfg (like the user.cfg or any cfg you make etc) while in a match. (which lets you set it back to 60 once in a match if thats what you wanted.)

Its a little tricky to explain it, but you can lookup on the crydev site for info on how to do this. (in the controls or action bindings sections it should be.....that or you can find it on the crydev forums.)

Edited by Fooooo, 15 January 2014 - 03:19 AM.