17 replies to this topic

[Mofwangana Bogogono]

I've noticed that Alpine peaks is coming up more frequently in the map rotation.

As part of that, it seems like the starting locations for the assault game mode are...imbalanced. Here is the strategy that has evolved: the team that starts at the upper base moves to the plateau. From there they snipe at the other team, which has to fight an uphill battle--literally. Any attempt to cap by the lower team is easily thwarted, because the upper base is within sight of the plateau.

Since this strategy has developed, I have yet to see the lower team win.

Conquest, on the other hand, is a lot more variable. Concentrating the cap points near the center of the map has led to a lot more brawling than before.

Has anyone found a strategy that beats the plateau-camp?

[Slepnir]

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Conquest, on the other hand, is a lot more variable. Concentrating the cap points near the center of the map has led to a lot more brawling than before.

And totally wastes such a big beautiful map or the need for scouts to do their job, it was a bad move

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Since this strategy has developed, I have yet to see the lower team win.

Then you have not played with a good team. started and won many times from the lower side......although I wish the upper cap point was back in the back like it used to be instead of in the middle of the base.

[Deathlike]

The whole map literally devolves to "H9 or die". In Conquest, it's pretty much "defend and protect the area around Theta".

Alpine has lost any sense of strategy once the spawn point changes were made.

[Zerberus]

Deathlike, on 19 January 2014 - 06:14 PM, said:

The whole map literally devolves to "H9 or die". In Conquest, it's pretty much "defend and protect the area around Theta".

Alpine has lost any sense of strategy once the spawn point changes were made.

The spawn changes were OK IMO, I think it was the moving of most of the resources to a relatively small area that kind of took the depth out re:conquest.

[Spawnsalot]

It's a pretty simple tactic to counter - head to G9, approaching from the north, there's a ledge you can move out onto above the path to their base you can alpha people from before moving back into the cover of the mountain while other members of your team move round the other side of the mountain at the corners of G8, G9, H8, H9 and, using the mountainside as cover.

People behind the initial shooters should spread out away from the mountain (while still staying out of Line of Sight) to broadside any enemy that comes down to harass the shooters. Scouts can also observe them from cover - giving locks to LRM equipped mechs.

H9 affords the campers little cover and leaves them open to plenty of attack unless you blindly charge at them or the bases they're watching.

And before anyone starts - I pretty much PUG exclusively and I can normally get teams to do this.

Spoiler

[Magna Canus]

Hey Mof,
I agree with Spawnsalot's tactics. I have won often enough "PURE PUG mode" by taking H9 and I9 (the uphill battle) with fast lights followed up by LRM and finally by assaults. A good sniping team can win with a stand-off defense at H6/I6 but this is a lot rarer since you need patience.

I think I only saw it once, but a win was pulled off by our PUG team by taking H11/I11. It was a long treanch war that was won with LRM help and an ECM spider spotting from I9.

I agree that capping the upper base is really difficult, but again here a spider can hide behind the cap point to avoid fire. If you have cover on F/G/H11 it makes for a nice reverse kill box.

[Latorque]

If the upper base team has one or more LRM-heavy mechs, the team starting on the lower plains loses in a landslide. Since there are no serious counter weapons (except for extremely ECM-heavy teams) or real cover options, the map can well be removed for the time being.

[Corvus Antaka]

Conquest is ruined on this map with the new points. They really need to be further apart.

Assault & skirmish the mountain in the middle is powerful. But like in terra therma, you can use alternate strategies to defeat it, though difficult as people tend to gravitate to "Rush where the enemy is" even when it's not a good idea.

some tuning on the map would be nice though.

[Latorque]

If you start on the lower plains, you'll have to jog along the K9/J8/I7 divide; or take the pass at H10/I10. Both options are abysmal. There are two slopes at I10 that allow a part of the team at the lower starting point to climb the mountain at i9 pretty quick, but those are rarely used - and even if; the enemy can knock you down there pretty easy if they are coming in force.

I've seen some matches that had the southern team winning; but only if the guys starting up north were dumb enough to leave their ramparts on the mountain. in 4 cases out of 5; it's like shooting fish in a barrel for the team starting uphill. I've been the fish most of the time

[XMJM]

Take this:
I played this map FIRST TIME EVER and I started from south. During the battle I notice how the north team has a PRIVATE ACCESS to the largest hill in the map, ftw, has this map been here a long time? If this was wot, it would have been junked after first patch. This map is biased to the power of two.

[aniviron]

It's funny, because the exact opposite happens in Skirmish; I almost always see the low ground team charge directly for the plateau, and as they generally arrive there just as the other team is struggling up the steep back end of the mountain, it's fairly easy for them to hold. The only way to flank is a 2km hike around either side of the mountain, and the access to the start of both paths is visible from the plateau.

I really can't stand Alpine. The almost total lack of any partial cover makes for boring games. Either you're in excellent terrain with a whole mountain between you and the other team and nothing exciting happening, or you're in the open and exposed on all sides by at least a kilometer. There's almost no middle ground.

The map was also designed back when there were no movement penalties on slopes, and the terrain was never adjusted for the new movement, and it shows.

[Adamski]

Alpine is trash and needs to be reworked, more than just moving around spawn points for busy work and pretending its balanced.

The is nothing interesting on this map at all. No interesting landmarks or terrain option.Its all just grinding against hill sides.

PS:This forum software is garbage too,keep dropping characters.

[Faith McCarron]

I play assault almost exclusively. Interesting fact: since the stat reset, my W/L average is slightly over 2.0. My best maps are the two frozen city maps where I'm at roughly 10.00. My SECOND WORST map is TT where I'm at a 1.11. On Alpine, I'm at a 0.47. Those numbers are after 300 total drops. The fact that I have a losing record on only ONE map, and that map by a large margin, tells me something is slightly askew on that map.

[PhoenixFire55]

Nobody forces you to go up/down the big hill on Alpine. Unlike most other maps on Assault mode Alpine is just fine.

[Redshift2k5]

I've had very frustrating losses whle my team hold the plateau- most typically, the effective counter is to come through the north, use lots ofcover, pick off a few turrets, and kill defenders that come to face you. Generally the entrenched-plateau team will trickle over one at a time, never in force (for fear of losing their "advantageous" high ground) and can be pulled apart.

I have seen successful pushes up the obvious central path, but most often this is in favour of the plateau team. Coming from the rear has worked before, but again most often in favour of the plateau team. North side is hardest for the pleateau team to deal with.

Never seen a proper attempt to stay back or camp near the west base, the west team always pushes to the center even if the enemy already has the plateau.

[Faith McCarron]

Not with the current spawns, it's not.

[Inappropriate9958811]

I hardly ever win when spawned on the lower side. Only time I do win is when the other team scrubs it and ditches high ground.

When I'm on the upper side, I often win. All you have to do is get to the top of the mountain, then sit and wait for the enemy team to assault.

PLEASE FIX THIS MAP ON THIS MODE PGI!!!

[FireDog]

The Alpine Map (as most others) was designed pre-climb nerf. Most of the maps (especially Alpine) had many more viable strategies and play areas before the nerf. Since the nerf, if you do not have JJs you are forced into very, very limited play... Whoever takes the high ground first has a great advantage. And thus become very boring fighting over the same hills and approaches. PGI needs to add some more "goat trails" to loosen up the map or reduce the nerf. BTW, Canyon play greatly suffered much in this nerf as well.