161 replies to this topic

[RapierE01]

Do we really want and need 12 man Premades vs Pugs? I dont want this. Because it will kill the Fun from the Pugs even with weight limitations. A Premade with Mediums can win against a Pug with Assaults and Heavy.

[Roadbeer]

Sorry, but the ability to play with as many of my friends as possible trumps the hurt feelings of those who can't be bothered to form a group.

It may be cold, but the removal of min/max group forming has driven more people from this game than any other misstep since inception.

[Screech]

Will be nice to see people playing full groups again.

PGI is just fixing a mistake of listening to the wrong people and split out the wrong group of people. Nothing forces people from forming up full groups then making them play against other full groups. Man I can't wait till April...



2015.

[Zerberus]

Who wants this??

EVERYBODY that`s not in it solely for the single player experience.

And to those that WANT a single player experience at the price of screwing up the multiplayer experience, I have a few words:

Go find yourself a single player GAME, like solitaire.

[RapierE01]

if it will be Premades vs Premades its okay but a coordinated 12 Man Group which drop against Pug's without any coordination or maybe Gam experience will kill the fun.

It has driven more people away? Why? Pugstomping is such a cool game so we all want it right?

Go play 12 vs 12. Oh wait they are coordinated too and could kill you right?

Edited by RapierE01, 16 January 2014 - 03:00 PM.

[Goose]

Roadbeer, on 16 January 2014 - 02:41 PM, said:

Sorry, but the ability to play with as many of my friends as possible trumps the hurt feelings of those who can't be bothered to form a group.

Shenanaigans: I, too, resent how all the guys I used to play with went off to simul-drop land, but they are gone, man, if only 'cause all their Elos' are at lest 500 above any of mine: There simply is no playing with them anymore.

The way MM handles groups seems like it's most visible failing, but we'll never know, and only have a "happy with the margins/ spread/ over-under" from Teh Devs to say it's "good enough."

I hope we will, someday, get guidance in forming a group, but until then, I have better games PuG'n …

This is the antisocial game of battlin' 'bots.

[Deathlike]

All I can say is... there will be a lot more whining when this is actually implemented.

[Zerberus]

RapierE01, on 16 January 2014 - 02:59 PM, said:

if it will be Premades vs Premades its okay but a coordinated 12 Man Group which drop against Pug's without any coordination or maybe Gam experience will kill the fun.

It has driven more people away? Why? Pugstomping is such a cool game so we all want it right?

Go play 12 vs 12. Oh wait they are coordinated too and could kill you right?

Maybe if you were one of the guys that watched most of their friends quit becasue other games allowed you to play with your friends while this one always forces someone to sit out you could understand. NO game is fun if you have to play it alone all the time or watch your friends play while you can only listen on TS

Edited by Zerberus, 16 January 2014 - 03:04 PM.

[Lukoi Banacek]

Roadbeer, on 16 January 2014 - 02:41 PM, said:

It may be cold, but the removal of min/max group forming has driven more people from this game than any other misstep since inception.

While I don't disagree with your premise that there is no need for group limits once we get close to CW, I doubt this little "factoid" is true.

Soooooo very many things have turned away large #'s in droves that don't even remotely concern themselves with group limits that I doubt very much this statement is correct. Regardless, it's not a stat we can ever learn anyway....the players that are gone are gone and there is no exit survey requirement to point to reasons.

Hell...plenty of PUGS have left the game over repeatedly being stomped (or rather the perception that the % was as high as they portrayed) to balance out the legions of people you claim are leaving over not being allowed to form an 11-man in the public queue RB.

Here's a sideline thought:

Why not 2-6 person premade's and below in a queue and 7-12 person premades in a second queue. Covers all of the bases, gets the "stompers" who want to run 11's in public queue more reasonable competition in the form of 7-12's and LNW's can elect which of the two queues they want to be a part of? Seems fair.

[Revorn]

Pug only, vs Pug only. Premades go 12 - 12.

[Goose]

Zerberus, on 16 January 2014 - 03:02 PM, said:

NO game is fun if you have to play it alone all the time or watch your friends play while you watch[sic].

That's the lack of respawns talkin' …

Oddly, it's another reason I'm inclined to PuG: Can't get warmed up waiting for a game to end …

[RapierE01]

@ Zerberus Oh so your friendys are unable to split a four man and a single Player to a 3 man and a 2 man? Nice friends really.



The Problem will be that the new Players wont Play Mwo if they were Pugstomped every Match and this will happen. A 4 Man on 8 had much influence to the Match. Now which infulence will a 8 man have to a 12 man drop?

Edited by RapierE01, 16 January 2014 - 03:07 PM.

[KHETTI]

This confirms my suspicion that MWO is a crutch shooter for group queue rejects, gg PGI ,Die MWO die.

[Goose]

Lukoi, on 16 January 2014 - 03:04 PM, said:

Hell...plenty of PUGS have left the game over repeatedly being stomped (or rather the perception that the % was as high as they portrayed) …

I we got a graph from Teh Devs, showing the sum total of health percent on a team, as a postmortem, would we feel better about all the 5 kills or less to 12?

How many "900 to zeros" would we see?

[Zerberus]

RapierE01, on 16 January 2014 - 03:06 PM, said:

@ Zerberus Oh so your friendys are unable to split a four man and a single Player to a 3 man and a 2 man? Nice friends really.

Not that it `s any of your business, but they`re wonderful friends, they just have the same tolerance for BS that I have without the love for BT

but maybe we also got tired of being forced to play against each other... but in your world where sync drops have a guaranteed 100% success rate and every loss you earn is really just because the other team hade a premade, that doesn`t happen often, does it?

Quote

[The Problem will be that the new Players wont Play Mwo if they were Pugstomped every Match and this will happen. A 4 Man on 8 had much influence to the Match. Now which infulence will a 8 man have to a 12 man drop?

And here`S the error in your logic: If you`Re pugstomping round after rounf after round after round, your Elo scores are going UP , and you soon won`t see any newbies anymore... but keep spreading the fear and that job at Fox News will soon be yours.

Not to mention the completely asinine premise that your entire basic argument is based upon: that Premades are always matched against completely random 12 man groups.

90%+ of the matches have AT LEAST one premade on BOTH sides. I actually know I haven`t been in a match without at least one on each side for months, becasue one was mine and the other side had people who I know for a fact usually drop together.

And that`s why I laugh about people that scream about evil premades when they die, BECAUSE I know that there was one in his team too and he was just a POS pilot. Judging by other`S experiences, this seems to be an almost universal truth.

But in their world, even if the matchmaker is matching up 11+1 to 5+7, then they still lost becasue the other team was premade pug stompers, even though they had the 11 man drop in their team, right?

Now, what was the meat of your argument exactly other than a jab at people that aren`t here to defend themselves, which is a clear sign of a weak moral character and nothing else?

Edited by Zerberus, 16 January 2014 - 03:29 PM.

[Goose]

KHETTI, on 16 January 2014 - 03:13 PM, said:

… MWO is a crutch shooter for group queue rejects …

What does that even mean?

[OneEyed Jack]

Zerberus, on 16 January 2014 - 03:02 PM, said:

Maybe if you were one of the guys that watched most of their friends quit becasue other games allowed you to play with your friends while this one always forces someone to sit out you could understand. NO game is fun if you have to play it alone all the time or watch your friends play while you can only listen on TS

Anyone who actually thinks this will improve anything is delusional. Play with any number of people? No. Play with a very specific number of people. The matches still have a specific player count. Have 12 friends? Someone still has go sit out. Have 6 friends? Prepare to be ROFLStomped, because now you and your merry band of PUG-STOMPERS are now on the other side of the fence. Multiple small pre-mades won't be any better against one large pre-made than a PUG is against a pre-made now. The only answer is to run with a large enough crew to always have a full team available, which circles you right back to the first problem. Or you could pick up semi-randoms in a voice server. But if you are willing to do that, why do you need this anyway? You could do that now and play in the 12-man queue.

No. This solves nothing. It will serve no purpose but to drive off the population even more, including many of the shortsighted people typical of these boards who think they want it.

[Nick Drezary]

Free group size and weight limits are steps in right direction

I assume MM will try to mach premade vs premade and fill empty space with pugs, like TeamA 10 premaders+2 pugs, Team B 9 premaders+ 3 pugs

And don't act like it is the end of the world: current system screws small merc corps/player groups that want to have fun together, but can't get all 12 players together every day, but roflstomps happen as often as they were. So it spoils game for one group of players, but not fixes it for the other one. No fun allowed.

[Amsro]

OneEyed Jack, on 16 January 2014 - 03:30 PM, said:

Anyone who actually thinks this will improve anything is delusional. Play with any number of people? No. Play with a very specific number of people. The matches still have a specific player count. Have 12 friends? Someone still has go sit out. Have 6 friends? Prepare to be ROFLStomped, because now you and your merry band of PUG-STOMPERS are now on the other side of the fence. Multiple small pre-mades won't be any better against one large pre-made than a PUG is against a pre-made now. The only answer is to run with a large enough crew to always have a full team available, which circles you right back to the first problem. Or you could pick up semi-randoms in a voice server. But if you are willing to do that, why do you need this anyway? You could do that now and play in the 12-man queue.

No. This solves nothing. It will serve no purpose but to drive off the population even more, including many of the shortsighted people typical of these boards who think they want it.

Our super leet group rarely has 12 on at the same time, having the option for 2-12 allows us to still play the game together in the same match, more then likely there will be a large group of similar number on the other side to balance.

This will actually bring back more players, your head is in the sand if you think otherwise.

[Deathlike]

Amsro, on 16 January 2014 - 04:07 PM, said:

Our super leet group rarely has 12 on at the same time, having the option for 2-12 allows us to still play the game together in the same match, more then likely there will be a large group of similar number on the other side to balance.

This will actually bring back more players, your head is in the sand if you think otherwise.

It will kill solo PUGs to build the super-teams.

Darwin would be proud.

Edited by Deathlike, 16 January 2014 - 04:33 PM.