311 replies to this topic

[Voivode]

1 AC/10 > 1 LB10X

2 AC10 < 2 LB10x

[SaltBeef]

LBX needs some lovin' they were more powerful in MW4 mercs. I absolutely love the graphic for it in this game, ( that isn't yer daddies shotgun Private Pyle! 4 inches!!!! ). damage should increase the closer it gets to the source to simulate a round that has not fragmented fully before hitting the target. LBX round were like puzzle piece sabots that came apart in the air not shotgun pellets I think. Should be devastating at 20 to 100 feet. Face-hugging mechs in combat should both be taking explosion and collision damage from SRM autocannon hits no matter who fires the shot. Like pushing a live grenade between the blubber of two battle munched sumo wrestlers.

Edited by SaltBeef, 27 January 2014 - 08:09 AM.

[Zyllos]

Who would have knew, the LBX is not functioning as the lore says...thus it's performance is different. And in this case, it's extremely worse than lore.

This is why I advocate for a canister shot, like from the TT mechanics. It should fire a canister that explodes 50m or so from a solid object into it's submunition in the same pattern as the weapon does now, or maybe a bit wider.

This will make the LBX a much more effective weapon, especially at range, as the weapon is suppose to function.

LBX is never suppose to be a "shotgun"...unlike how the description says "shotgun-like" but goes on to act more closely to a canister firing weapon.

Edited by Zyllos, 27 January 2014 - 08:10 AM.

[PanzerMagier]

Bishop Steiner, on 26 January 2014 - 01:48 PM, said:

please explain how LBX is "far better" at brawling? Slightly less heat, but same range, RoF, and ammo, less concentrated damage?

Niche advantage, if there's an open torso, it has a much higher chance of critical damaging internals/destroying weapons which can make/break a brawl.
If the Ac10 misses you deal 0 damage, if the LBX misses, it means you likely hit half your shots if you're a good shooter. It does have a higher ROF if you didn't notice. But I guess you're going to stubborn so why am I wasting my breath, you elitist types are never reasonable.

Sybreed, on 26 January 2014 - 12:40 PM, said:

NARC will get fixed soon. Command console and flamers do need a rework. Thomas said they'd include switchable ammo eventually, which should help LB-X a lot. Though, they need to give a higher cooldown when firing slugs, otherwise it'll just be better than an AC/10 in every wya.

Sorry, but forgive me if I don't hold my breath in believing that PGI will "fix" narc.

[Bishop Steiner]

PanzerMagier, on 27 January 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

Niche advantage, if there's an open torso, it has a much higher chance of critical damaging internals/destroying weapons which can make/break a brawl.
If the Ac10 misses you deal 0 damage, if the LBX misses, it means you likely hit half your shots if you're a good shooter. It does have a higher ROF if you didn't notice. But I guess you're going to stubborn so why am I wasting my breath, you elitist types are never reasonable.

Niche advantage in a small window of occurrence is far different than being "far better" as even better than crits is simply destroying that section with focused fire. And spreading damage all over the opponent is seldom preferable to maximizing damage. You miss with an AC10, you do indeed do zero damage. so, looking at my high 60% (68, technically) hit percentage with them, that means on average 1 out of 3 shots hit. 20 damage, IRL over 7.5 seconds. With an LBX, I might hit a higher percentage (74%, which means one shot out of 4 still does ZERO damage.), but like lasers, that is misleading, because the damage can be minimal and everywhere. But let's say I hit every time with the LB-X, with 6-7 of the pellets on average. Wow, I might be doing a smidgen more damage, but 1 pt damage to the leg, 1 pt to the head and 1 pt to the arm and rt, etc, is only preferable on those occasions you are facing a mostly naked mech, as opposed to doing the same average damage clustered in nice 10 pt chunks.

And no, both the LBX and AC10 have a cooldown of 2.5 seconds. Has been this way for a long time. So no, that's not stubborn, that's a simple statement of fact.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...eapon_ballistic

But by all means, continue telling yourself otherwise, due to the placebo effect you will continue to tell yourself you are more effective this way. And hey, if you are running a stealth ambusher who only engages at the end of the match and tries to clean up on kills after all the other mechs have done the heavy lifting, you might almost be right.


Put on your big boy pants. Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't make it a personal attack, so no need to get snippy. And the Elitists on this site would be highly offended to have me ranked in their number since I am the most anti meta advocate here.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 27 January 2014 - 08:43 AM.

[N a p e s]

PanzerMagier, on 27 January 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

Niche advantage, if there's an open torso, it has a much higher chance of critical damaging internals/destroying weapons which can make/break a brawl.
If the Ac10 misses you deal 0 damage, if the LBX misses, it means you likely hit half your shots if you're a good shooter. It does have a higher ROF if you didn't notice. But I guess you're going to stubborn so why am I wasting my breath, you elitist types are never reasonable.

Serious question.

Did they really change the ROF with the LB10 and when was this done? Aren't both the LB10 and AC10 at 2.5 second recycle rates?

Edit: Just read Bishop's reply post that confirmed that they're both at 2.5 seconds

Edited by Napes339, 27 January 2014 - 08:39 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Zyllos, on 27 January 2014 - 08:07 AM, said:

Who would have knew, the LBX is not functioning as the lore says...thus it's performance is different. And in this case, it's extremely worse than lore.

This is why I advocate for a canister shot, like from the TT mechanics. It should fire a canister that explodes 50m or so from a solid object into it's submunition in the same pattern as the weapon does now, or maybe a bit wider.

This will make the LBX a much more effective weapon, especially at range, as the weapon is suppose to function.

LBX is never suppose to be a "shotgun"...unlike how the description says "shotgun-like" but goes on to act more closely to a canister firing weapon.

Add to it that Solid Slug it is supposed to capable of shooting and I'd be willing to take it.

[Bishop Steiner]

Joseph Mallan, on 27 January 2014 - 08:38 AM, said:

Add to it that Solid Slug it is supposed to capable of shooting and I'd be willing to take it.

problem then is it is a direct upgrade over the ac10, and thus obsoletes it entirely.
I still like my delayed fuse canister shot idea. But I am thinking, maybe (yes the purists are grabbing their torches already) if it did have a solid shot option, make it one that does less damage (7-8?) with a lower range and projectile speed. Then it would still be useful as a dual purpose, but not outright replace the ac10?

[kesuga7]

Would you Take Twin LB 10x's and two medium lasers
Or Two AC 10's?

[Bishop Steiner]

Zyllos, on 27 January 2014 - 08:07 AM, said:

Who would have knew, the LBX is not functioning as the lore says...thus it's performance is different. And in this case, it's extremely worse than lore.

This is why I advocate for a canister shot, like from the TT mechanics. It should fire a canister that explodes 50m or so from a solid object into it's submunition in the same pattern as the weapon does now, or maybe a bit wider.

This will make the LBX a much more effective weapon, especially at range, as the weapon is suppose to function.

LBX is never suppose to be a "shotgun"...unlike how the description says "shotgun-like" but goes on to act more closely to a canister firing weapon.

ya mean like this?
http://mwomercs.com/...b-10x-proposal/

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 27 January 2014 - 08:45 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

I always thought the LB stood for Light Barrel!

[Bishop Steiner]

kesuga7, on 27 January 2014 - 08:42 AM, said:

Would you Take Twin LB 10x's and two medium lasers
Or Two AC 10's?

2 ac10s, though in all the mechs I run, they also have 2-4 medium lasers, too. The mech with my most 1000+ pt matches is my Ilya Murdermetz with 2 ac10, 105 rounds of ammo and 2 medium lasers, running a 340XL. It can be a little fragile, but it's a heckuva a Hunter.

[kesuga7]

Bishop Steiner, on 27 January 2014 - 08:47 AM, said:

2 ac10s, though in all the mechs I run, they also have 2-4 medium lasers, too. The mech with my most 1000+ pt matches is my Ilya Murdermetz with 2 ac10, 105 rounds of ammo and 2 medium lasers, running a 340XL. It can be a little fragile, but it's a heckuva a Hunter.

okay 2 lb 10x and 4 mids or two ac 10 two mids

though there are some cases where you simply can't fit Twin Ac 10's
such as the orion , so it might or might not depend on the mech
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d3002d927dd664b
dual uac 5's would be only other alternative for those twin ballistic side torso slots
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d4b90098fa9c080

Edited by kesuga7, 27 January 2014 - 08:57 AM.

[SaltBeef]

That was actually successfully implemented as a anti rpg defense for Israeli Tanks and APC's saw it on future weapons the defensive weapon would cut incoming rpg's to shreads right before they would impact. Not a bad idea. but the cool graphic would look like AC10 until 50 feet from targeted mech then blow and spread right!

Edited by SaltBeef, 27 January 2014 - 08:56 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Bishop Steiner, on 27 January 2014 - 08:47 AM, said:

2 ac10s, though in all the mechs I run, they also have 2-4 medium lasers, too. The mech with my most 1000+ pt matches is my Ilya Murdermetz with 2 ac10, 105 rounds of ammo and 2 medium lasers, running a 340XL. It can be a little fragile, but it's a heckuva a Hunter.

This right here is the mentality that will make or break players in my book. Bishop has a build he likes, He knows its limitations & accepts them!

[SaltBeef]

Do you play Company of heroes series of games? Your idea is kinda like the overwatch artillery round in that game. A Round that airbursts sending a cone of frags to the ground / target.

[Joseph Mallan]

kesuga7, on 27 January 2014 - 08:54 AM, said:

okay 2 lb 10x and 4 mids or two ac 10 two mids

though there are some cases where you simply can't fit Twin Ac 10's
such as the orion , so it might or might not depend on the mech
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d3002d927dd664b
dual uac 5's would be only other alternative for those twin ballistic side torso slots
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d4b90098fa9c080

So take an AC10 and a PPC! Let the whiners whine all they want. 20 damage is not huge damage! Yes I would be happier if we had a few decimeters of slop in our convergence, but the same damage of a single AC20 should not be something we complain about.

[A banana in the tailpipe]

Joseph Mallan, on 27 January 2014 - 08:58 AM, said:

This right here is the mentality that will make or break players in my book. Bishop has a build he likes, He knows its limitations & accepts them!

You sir just lost all my respect, for when I was rocking the dual LBX10 HBK-4G build I knew my limitations and was rewarded generously yet you scoffed along with your elitist pals. For shame on you.

[Almond Brown]

Joseph Mallan, on 27 January 2014 - 08:38 AM, said:

Add to it that Solid Slug it is supposed to capable of shooting and I'd be willing to take it.

Sure why not. You get an AC10 with 90m more range and an extra ton of ammo.

Please at least put a dust cover over the AC10 on your way out of the garage please.

Edited by Almond Brown, 27 January 2014 - 09:05 AM.

[AaronWolf]

FupDup, on 26 January 2014 - 05:56 PM, said: