30 replies to this topic

[aniviron]

In the last interview with Eckman at NGNG, Bryan states that the clan mechs are going to come out one at a time, and that it will take a full eight months for the Warhawk to finally get released after the clan packs come out. (Sorry, I don't have a timestamp; if anyone is interested in finding it, I can amend the OP with that info.)

Does this seem weird to anyone else? I had just assumed that it would be the first four mechs in the pack (Kitfox, Nova, Timberwolf, and Direwolf) released as a four-pack so that any clan players would be able to use their weight class of choice at rollout, and then get access to the next four over the following four months, one at a time.

With the one-at-a-time schedule that is planned right now, we're either going to have mixed IS/clan mechs on teams, which seems a bit odd, or we're going to have some serious tonnage matching issues trying to put 12 kitfoxes against whatever the IS team has. The latter scenario sounds absurd, yet in the same interview Bryan mentions that the plan is to have the matchmaker split the groups into IS v Clans in the public queues as soon as clan mechs are available.

The other part that sounds strange to me is the fact that it is only three months after the launch of the clan pack that CW is slated to arrive. Does this mean that clan players just don't get access to assault mechs when CW launches, and have to wait a month before they get to field them? And what about the fact that some of the mechs available at that point are fairly specialized (looking at you, Nova), effectively depriving the clans of any real choice for selection in that weight bracket?

The tl;dr is that is seems crazy to me that the clan releases are getting spread over eight months instead of four at first followed by one a month as per Phoenix.

[Josef Nader]

There will be no tonnage matching issues, as plenty of people are throwing down for early access. They have to make people want to pay money for these things, and trapping non-paying clan players in a Kit Fox for the first month seems like a good way to do that.

You won't be grossly outtonned. The Phoenix pack sold well, and I'd imagine the clan pack will sell well. It will just be a while before free players can play heavies or assaults.

[Alex Warden]

hm well, since i´m mostly interested in Dire Wolf and Stormcrow, i guess that means no clans for me this year, huh?
wait... they will que clanmechs seperately? that means in public matches i´d be treated as clanner no matter what faction i am ? kinda strange if you ask me, what intention should i as a merc or a housemember have to spend real $$ on clanmechs then, if i don´t want to be "traitor" everytime i wanna drive them?? ...


i don´t really mind, i´m a happy spheroid, and i will stick to it anyway

Edited by Alex Warden, 22 February 2014 - 07:18 AM.

[Kaeseblock]

As far as I understood PGI's plan, they will queue Clanners (so Clan faction members) against IS faction members (who can pilot "salvaged" Clan mechs) once Clans "arrive".

This is just my personal interpretation of the currently available info though =/

[Noonan]

The reason that they tried to hold back the Griffin and Shadowhawk was to strong arm us into buying more Clan packs. Since they put it in writing, they had to put the Griffin out on Tuesday or break a legally binding contract.

I have no doubt that they will spread the mechs out over 8 months. Why make the player base happy with carrots when you can threaten them with sticks?

[Iacov]

want my vulture

sorry for that unconstructive post :/

8 months sounds long...
and my guess is, that the initial release of the clans will include at least 4 clan mechs (so every weight class) available for cbills
otherwise you'd only have matches IS vs. pre-order customers

[Butane9000]

That sucks :/.

But anyone who "purchased" the clan package will have all those mechs immediately. Which I believe is most of the hard core Clan community who haven't given up on this game yet.

Everyone else will have to deal with the trickle. But for those interested:

Janurary (Battlemaster) -> February (Firestarter & Griffin) -> March (IS Assault & Wolverine) -> April (IS heavy [?]) -> May (Flea + MASC [?]) -> June (Clans Package + Uller C-bills, IS Assault [?]) -> July (no idea)

[SirLankyIII]

Odds are they'll release them in the same order they're listed on the purchase page so we'll get the summoner in 3 months and direwolf in 4. It would be a bit stiff to go L, L, M, M, H, H, A, A when they normally go L, M, H, A with regular releases anyway.

[Craig Steele]

SirLankyIII, on 22 February 2014 - 05:11 PM, said:

Odds are they'll release them in the same order they're listed on the purchase page so we'll get the summoner in 3 months and direwolf in 4. It would be a bit stiff to go L, L, M, M, H, H, A, A when they normally go L, M, H, A with regular releases anyway.

Yup

[Durant Carlyle]

Alex Warden, on 22 February 2014 - 07:13 AM, said:

hm well, since i´m mostly interested in Dire Wolf and Stormcrow, i guess that means no clans for me this year, huh?
wait... they will que clanmechs seperately? that means in public matches i´d be treated as clanner no matter what faction i am ? kinda strange if you ask me, what intention should i as a merc or a housemember have to spend real $$ on clanmechs then, if i don´t want to be "traitor" everytime i wanna drive them?? ...

Kaeseblock, on 22 February 2014 - 08:49 AM, said:

As far as I understood PGI's plan, they will queue Clanners (so Clan faction members) against IS faction members (who can pilot "salvaged" Clan mechs) once Clans "arrive".

This is just my personal interpretation of the currently available info though =/

Yeah, anybody can use a Clan 'Mech and remain in their chosen faction -- they will not queue Clan 'Mechs separately from I.S. 'Mechs.

[Prezimonto]

Durant Carlyle, on 23 February 2014 - 01:20 PM, said:

Yeah, anybody can use a Clan 'Mech and remain in their chosen faction -- they will not queue Clan 'Mechs separately from I.S. 'Mechs.

Has this been actually stated anywhere?

Wow talk about total setting fail. I was hoping for some actual grand clan vs. IS battles on the faction level.

[Strum Wealh]

Durant Carlyle, on 23 February 2014 - 01:20 PM, said:

Yeah, anybody can use a Clan 'Mech and remain in their chosen faction -- they will not queue Clan 'Mechs separately from I.S. 'Mechs.

Prezimonto, on 23 February 2014 - 01:24 PM, said:

Has this been actually stated anywhere?

Wow talk about total setting fail. I was hoping for some actual grand clan vs. IS battles on the faction level.

One statement made by Bryan Ekman (on Dec. 19, 2013) on the matter can be found here.

Quote

Ed Steele ‏(@EdSteeleMWO)
@bryanekman: I have a Christmas bonus on the way, so give me some info that would make an IS player want a clan pack.

Bryan Ekman (‏@bryanekman)
@EdSteeleMWO: lore - battlefield salvaged mechs put into service under your command. Still a valiant IS MechWarrior ready to kill clanners.

Ed Steele ‏(@EdSteeleMWO)
@bryanekman: Good answer, I will "salvage" some clan mechs with my credit card shortly!

Additionally, listen to Bryan Ekman discuss the issue more recently on NGNG # 103, part 3, from the 28:57 mark to the 30:08 mark... or, more specifically, from 29:40 to 30:08.

Quote

We also had to redo the matchmaker a little bit, to handle the Faction buckets so that we could take... at any given time we're only going to have two Faction buckets. So right now would be the Inner Sphere alliance versus Inner Sphere alliance; when Clans comes out, it would be Clans versus Inner Sphere, in the public... in the public Faction play. So, those two things are happening with the Launch Module, and kind of set up the ability to do Community Warfare.

Presumably, "Inner Sphere alliance versus Inner Sphere alliance" refers to something like "Federated Commonwealth (AFFS + LCAF, plus Mercs & Lone Wolves) versus Concord of Kapteyn (CCAF + DCMS + FWLM, plus Mercs & Lone Wolves)", with a later transition to "Inner Sphere Factions (AFFS + CCAF + DCMS + FWLM + Kungsarme + LCAF, plus Mercs & IS Lone Wolves) versus Clan Factions (CDS + CGB + CJF + CNC + CSJ + CSV + CW, plus Clan Lone Wolves)".
Nothing in what was said by Bryan Ekman within that segment of the podcast necessarily precludes the ability for a player who has selected an IS affiliation from using Clan 'Mechs that they may have purchased through one of the packs or the A La Carte option.

[Basskicker]

Sooooo, we are going to have on day one of the "Clan Invasion" mixed queues of IS and Clan mechs on the same team... Really??? Am I the only one who thinks this would be Super Duper Uber Lame????

[Craig Steele]

Basskicker, on 23 February 2014 - 07:14 PM, said:

Sooooo, we are going to have on day one of the "Clan Invasion" mixed queues of IS and Clan mechs on the same team... Really??? Am I the only one who thinks this would be Super Duper Uber Lame????

I kinda thought it was lame that Ravens were running around in Steiner colours, and that Kurita Cataphracts were all the rage. So many Marik Jenners too, and Davion Commando's.

MW:O has never attempted to implement the 'flavour' of the Factions into the battlefield so why would they start now?

[Basskicker]

Craig Steele, on 23 February 2014 - 07:23 PM, said:

I kinda thought it was lame that Ravens were running around in Steiner colours, and that Kurita Cataphracts were all the rage. So many Marik Jenners too, and Davion Commando's.

MW:O has never attempted to implement the 'flavour' of the Factions into the battlefield so why would they start now?

Then why should anyone play this game from a lore perspective??? If all this is and all its ever going to be is a Solaris arena style moshpit... they should just do away with the timeline and let us have an arena ranking system, and quit calling this the clan invasion... cause it's not... this is the mass clan mech arrival into the same exact game that some of you have been playing now for over 2 years...

What is the point of this game after CW is released???

What is CW going to be like with each team fielding the same exact mechs(half IS and half Clan)??? It will be the same game we have now, but with different game modes and new mechs... I'm sorry, but if PGI wants me to spend any more money on this game they are going to have to give me some reason to play other than a 12v12 brawl in the middle of the map.

There is writing on the wall here and up until now I haven't wanted to read it... but if the clans get released into the same game we have now without separate queues, I'm done.

Edited by Basskicker, 23 February 2014 - 08:22 PM.

[Alex Warden]

someone brought up an interesting point in another thread... if they only release 1 Clanmech every month, that also means that clanWEAPONS (and the ability to use them in actual mechs) aren´t available for free players/ non-purchasers for a long time...

so twin UAC20 daishis are $$ exclusive for uhm...how long ? smells a little like "force2pay" to me...just a little...

Edited by Alex Warden, 23 February 2014 - 08:34 PM.

[Craig Steele]

Basskicker, on 23 February 2014 - 08:21 PM, said:

Then why should anyone play this game from a lore perspective??? If all this is and all its ever going to be is a Solaris arena style moshpit... they should just do away with the timeline and let us have an arena ranking system, and quit calling this the clan invasion... cause it's not... this is the mass clan mech arrival into the same exact game that some of you have been playing now for over 2 years...

What is the point of this game after CW is released???

What is CW going to be like with each team fielding the same exact mechs(half IS and half Clan)??? It will be the same game we have now, but with different game modes and new mechs... I'm sorry, but if PGI wants me to spend any more money on this game they are going to have to give me some reason to play other than a 12v12 brawl in the middle of the map.

There is writing on the wall here and up until now I haven't wanted to read it... but if the clans get released into the same game we have now without separate queues, I'm done.

idnk is the answer to your question.

I am just highlighting that MW:O has never been about the lore / canon when it comes to factions and that they have specifically said that IS factions will be able to buy and field Clan mechs from day one.

So if the techs are balanced, we will see Jenners and Phracts alongside Timberwolves and Direwolves in Marik / Liao / Davion colours.

If the techs are not balanced we will see pure Clan forces in IS faction colours, and possibly pure IS mechs in Clan factions (if the pilots choose to)

Faction has never been a driver for mech availability in MW:O. You've played for a few months, you already know the scene.

Edited by Craig Steele, 23 February 2014 - 08:35 PM.

[Khobai]

Quote

The tl;dr is that is seems crazy to me that the clan releases are getting spread over eight months instead of four at first followed by one a month as per Phoenix.

My guess is its so they can release clan hero mechs, then release them for MC, then release them for cbills.

But if you can buy a clan hero mech for less than buying the mech alacarte, it makes more sense to just wait for the hero mech.

You could buy a Daishi alacarte for $55 and get 3 variants. Or you could just wait 4 months, buy a hero Daishi for $30, and then wait 2 weeks and buy 2 cbill variants.

Edited by Khobai, 24 February 2014 - 12:26 AM.

[GalaxyBluestar]

Strum Wealh, on 23 February 2014 - 07:03 PM, said:

One statement made by Bryan Ekman (on Dec. 19, 2013) on the matter can be found here.
Additionally, listen to Bryan Ekman discuss the issue more recently on NGNG # 103, part 3, from the 28:57 mark to the 30:08 mark... or, more specifically, from 29:40 to 30:08.
Presumably, "Inner Sphere alliance versus Inner Sphere alliance" refers to something like "Federated Commonwealth (AFFS + LCAF, plus Mercs & Lone Wolves) versus Concord of Kapteyn (CCAF + DCMS + FWLM, plus Mercs & Lone Wolves)", with a later transition to "Inner Sphere Factions (AFFS + CCAF + DCMS + FWLM + Kungsarme + LCAF, plus Mercs & IS Lone Wolves) versus Clan Factions (CDS + CGB + CJF + CNC + CSJ + CSV + CW, plus Clan Lone Wolves)".
Nothing in what was said by Bryan Ekman within that segment of the podcast necessarily precludes the ability for a player who has selected an IS affiliation from using Clan 'Mechs that they may have purchased through one of the packs or the A La Carte option.

so many people use that bryan tweet to re-assure themselves. he's just fishing for excusses cause he doesn't know what they'll do.

Wants IS to be happy

Bryan Ekman ‏@bryanekman
@EdSteeleMWO lore - battlefield salvaged mechs put into service under your command. Still a valiant IS MechWarrior ready to kill clanners.

Wants clans to be happy "note this was after the vlog and after the first statement so have they changed their mind?" https://twitter.com/...659678791192576

Bryan Ekman ‏@bryanekman
@EineNeueWelt @Paul_Inouye it will most likely end up at 10 v 12 Stars vs Lances. The guys were being cautious for now.

very much implying seperate ques for each tech, considering no mix tech either. garth said it would be a quagmire of exponential balancing problems matching is tech to clan tech to clan tech in is mechs ontop of exsisting balncing.

really how would it be fair to have a team of half clans and half IS being 12 vs 10 clans or how is it fair for the IS to face 12 clanners even when half their own number are clans, cause there ain't no amount of nerfs that will make up for clans being supeiror with weight and critslots.

the only way they can have IS with clan mechs in a lore setting something like tonnage to keep the amount of firepower and armour fielded balanced and 10vs12 makes that easier. i'd suggest BV but the pilots and HSR sever stability are pure randoms and the customisation is too wild to equate actuall performance values for match balancing purposes.

if they don't use tonnage limits and deployment numbers and think 12vs12 3x3x3x3 each weight class and balanced clans will cut it not only are you cementing the use of the best in the class "meta" then you can forget CW because... answering the next quote here...

Craig Steele, on 23 February 2014 - 08:34 PM, said:

idnk is the answer to your question.

I am just highlighting that MW:O has never been about the lore / canon when it comes to factions and that they have specifically said that IS factions will be able to buy and field Clan mechs from day one.

So if the techs are balanced, we will see Jenners and Phracts alongside Timberwolves and Direwolves in Marik / Liao / Davion colours.

If the techs are not balanced we will see pure Clan forces in IS faction colours, and possibly pure IS mechs in Clan factions (if the pilots choose to)

Faction has never been a driver for mech availability in MW:O. You've played for a few months, you already know the scene.

we thought CW would change that gameplay, we thought the public pool would become faction alliances that dropped to specific zones, offereing tactics and gameplay through all the variables, weapons, armour, speed, numbers of mechs the lot. lone wolfs supporting the faction players making up each side of the team. in the beta the mixes were exceptable. but for the released game and CW? NO WAY! if that's what it is, just like the previous years gameplay then what is territorial and planet conquest going to be? this planet is owned by the IS and this is owned by clans? whilst every team uses clan mechs anyways!?

what's the point in participating in that ESPECIALLY if each side has been nerfed and buffed and forced to be deployed equally. vanilla vs vanilla for a two tone colour change on a map? lack luster game loses players fast especially one riddled with false advertising. that clans vs IS vision is not the faction gameplay we were sold on during 2011-12. it'd be a joke to have kurita and davions on the same team vs wolfs and falcons holding hands during CW and we can only hope that this launch set up is but a test phase before opening it up for when later CW phases are in. otherwise i've played the game beaten the game and it offers no more cause 2014-15 is gonna be too simillar to 12-13. been there done that.

Edited by GalaxyBluestar, 24 February 2014 - 01:00 AM.

[Craig Steele]

GalaxyBluestar, on 24 February 2014 - 12:53 AM, said:

so many people use that bryan tweet to re-assure themselves. he's just fishing for excusses cause he doesn't know what they'll do.

Wants IS to be happy

Bryan Ekman ‏@bryanekman
@EdSteeleMWO lore - battlefield salvaged mechs put into service under your command. Still a valiant IS MechWarrior ready to kill clanners.

Wants clans to be happy "note this was after the vlog and after the first statement so have they changed their mind?" https://twitter.com/...659678791192576

Bryan Ekman ‏@bryanekman
@EineNeueWelt @Paul_Inouye it will most likely end up at 10 v 12 Stars vs Lances. The guys were being cautious for now.

very much implying seperate ques for each tech, considering no mix tech either. garth said it would be a quagmire of exponential balancing problems matching is tech to clan tech to clan tech in is mechs ontop of exsisting balncing.

really how would it be fair to have a team of half clans and half IS being 12 vs 10 clans or how is it fair for the IS to face 12 clanners even when half their own number are clans, cause there ain't no amount of nerfs that will make up for clans being supeiror with weight and critslots.

the only way they can have IS with clan mechs in a lore setting something like tonnage to keep the amount of firepower and armour fielded balanced and 10vs12 makes that easier. i'd suggest BV but the pilots and HSR sever stability are pure randoms and the customisation is too wild to equate actuall performance values for match balancing purposes.

if they don't use tonnage limits and deployment numbers and think 12vs12 3x3x3x3 each weight class and balanced clans will cut it not only are you cementing the use of the best in the class "meta" then you can forget CW because... answering the next quote here...



we thought CW would change that gameplay, we thought the public pool would become faction alliances that dropped to specific zones, offereing tactics and gameplay through all the variables, weapons, armour, speed, numbers of mechs the lot. lone wolfs supporting the faction players making up each side of the team. in the beta the mixes were exceptable. but for the released game and CW? NO WAY! if that's what it is, just like the previous years gameplay then what is territorial and planet conquest going to be? this planet is owned by the IS and this is owned by clans? whilst every team uses clan mechs anyways!?

what's the point in participating in that ESPECIALLY if each side has been nerfed and buffed and forced to be deployed equally. vanilla vs vanilla for a two tone colour change on a map? lack luster game loses players fast especially one riddled with false advertising. that clans vs IS vision is not the faction gameplay we were sold on during 2011-12. it'd be a joke to have kurita and davions on the same team vs wolfs and falcons holding hands during CW and we can only hope that this launch set up is but a test phase before opening it up for when later CW phases are in. otherwise i've played the game beaten the game and it offers no more cause 2014-15 is gonna be too simillar to 12-13. been there done that.

So MY understanding is this.

Factions and tech are two very different things.

Under CW when you press launch you will be pooled with players from 3 buckets according to your faction. 2IS (we assume Davions Steiner / FRR, vs Liao / Marik / Kurita but these are as yet unspecified) and one Clan. All players in a team will be from one of those pools, rounded out with Lone Wolves if required.

So it possible for 2 / 3 + LNW to be rounding out a clan force or a IS force for the purpose of MM.

IF Clan tech is balanced with IS then there will be no change to the queues as is, it will be a 12 v 12 fight, this is PGI's stated goal (albiet they did say 10 v 12 is looking likely).

In this scenario we will have (possibly) a mix of Kuritans, Liao's / Mariks and LNW fighting either a Davion / Steiner / FRR / LNW force or a CW / CJF / CGB / CSJ / LNW force, all combatants fighting in whatever mech they wich within the 3 / 3 / 3 / 3 breakup.

The outcome of the battle will determine the status change of the planet by 1% and hence which "alliance" has control.
IF the two techs are not balanced and they balance with 10 v 12 (or some such), then there will have to be another queue for the tech. MM will pull the required number of mech from the faction queue for that tech instead and put that into the match.

These are public matches, not organised private matches.

There will be another function for registered mercenary outfits which is broadly (as I understand it) hitting a specific planet rather than a randomly determined front, but the mechanics are the same.

Thats how I envisage all the various posts and stuff I have read coming together.