21 replies to this topic

[Sybreed]

Devs, you stated that you love the MW and BT franchise, so please hear me out.

In the launch module post you mentionned enforcing a 3/3/3/3 setup for lights, mediums, heavies, assaults, but by canon this is just wrong. Mediums are supposed to be the most common threat on the battlefield and assaults are supposed to be pretty rare, so please, let some matches be closer to 2/5/3/2 or 3/4/3/2 so the few immersion enthusiasts left get some real fun MW matches.

I'm not asking to entirely get rid of the 3/3/3/3, but at least give some flexibility so if there can be more mediums, let there be more mediums?

[stjobe]

The Inner Sphere "standard 'mech lance" (according to BattleTech, 2nd edition) is
1 Light
1 Medium
2 Heavy 'mechs

Which is kind of weird, since the distribution of 'mech chassis in the IS in general is also said to be about 30% Light, 40% Medium, 20% Heavy, and 10% Assault.

I guess there are more speciality lances (Recon, Assault, Support, etc) than there are standard lances.

Either way, a 1/1/1/1 lance would be an oddity.

[Panther TBC]

Sybreed, on 28 February 2014 - 07:23 AM, said:

Devs, you stated that you love the MW and BT franchise, so please hear me out.

In the launch module post you mentionned enforcing a 3/3/3/3 setup for lights, mediums, heavies, assaults, but by canon this is just wrong. Mediums are supposed to be the most common threat on the battlefield and assaults are supposed to be pretty rare, so please, let some matches be closer to 2/5/3/2 or 3/4/3/2 so the few immersion enthusiasts left get some real fun MW matches.

I'm not asking to entirely get rid of the 3/3/3/3, but at least give some flexibility so if there can be more mediums, let there be more mediums?

Agreed, I would go even further, thinking it should be 1 or 2 assaults per team at most, with 4-6 mediums per team.

[pbiggz]

3/3/3/3 stands the best chance of making everyone happy, though it would be interesting to see a 4 light 4 medium 2 heavy 2 assault configuration. Emphasis on light and medium mechs probably isn't a bad thing.

[Khobai]

No. Just NO.

Mediums are already the least played weight class. If you forced it to find more mediums the queue times would increase drastically.

[MisterPlanetarian]

3/3/3/3 is actually better than straight up weight limits. It lets people play whichever mech they choose within the weight class. Yes there will no doubt be cases where one team brought 3x100 tonners for assaults and the other maybe a 90 and two 85 tonners but thats hardly the end of the world imo.

3/3/3/3 keeps an even represantation for each weightclass which is great for the public games. Aslong as people can bring different mechs in their dropship and pick something appropriate for each map then its not going to cause any real problems.

Weight limitations are better for private matches and are ultimately artificial rules that can be enforced outside the game for competitive play etc.

[Sybreed]

Khobai, on 28 February 2014 - 09:18 AM, said:

No. Just NO.

Mediums are already the least played weight class. If you forced it to find more mediums the queue times would increase drastically.

that's too bad, mediums are a lot of fun

[Mirkk Defwode]

Sybreed, on 28 February 2014 - 10:04 AM, said:

that's too bad, mediums are a lot of fun

Yes they are. Love my centurions and griffins and can't seem to have any luck with my Wolverines.

[Khobai]

Quote

that's too bad, mediums are a lot of fun

Well the obvious solution is to buff mediums so theyre played more often. The closer we get to all weight classes being played 25% of the time, the better 3/3/3/3 will work, and the faster the queue times will be.

Edited by Khobai, 28 February 2014 - 10:17 AM.

[Sybreed]

Khobai, on 28 February 2014 - 10:17 AM, said:

Well the obvious solution is to buff mediums so theyre played more often. The closer we get to all weight classes being played 25% of the time, the better 3/3/3/3 will work, and the faster the queue times will be.

What buff do they need? The only reason they don't do well atm is because everyone is playing assault warrior online. If more people used mediums, they woudln't feel inadequate.

Edited by Sybreed, 28 February 2014 - 02:22 PM.

[tucsonspeed6]

Khobai, on 28 February 2014 - 09:18 AM, said:

No. Just NO.

Mediums are already the least played weight class. If you forced it to find more mediums the queue times would increase drastically.

They are least played because the current meta is still a majority of assaults in each match, combined with an outdated stigma against them from before they were buffed half a year ago.

I think if we can expect a guaranteed matched drop with only 3 assaults to face, mediums can only become more viable. So saying they aren't played now isn't a fair assessment of what the meta will be post launch module.

That said, I agree about queue times. Only letting one or two assaults in per match would increase queue times, even in cases of perfectly evenly distributed usages between the weight classes.

[Khobai]

Quote

What buff do they need? The only reason they don't do well atm is because everyone is playing assault warrior online. If more people would use mediums, they woudln't feel inadequate.

Simply put:
1) mediums need stronger SRMs to give them a decent weapon with low tonnage requirements.
2) mediums need to be penalized less by engine weight. A 300 engine is only 25% of an assaults weight but its 50% of a mediums weight. mediums are penalized too heavily by the engine weight curve.

Quote

They are least played because the current meta is still a majority of assaults in each match

And the majority of players will continue playing heavies/assaults. This will result in longer queue times while waiting for mediums to join the game. The only way to get players to play mediums more is to make them better. Its quite simple really.

Quote

Only for people who refuse to pilot mediums.

Which is most people. Medium pilots are the minority.

Edited by Khobai, 28 February 2014 - 10:28 AM.

[Charons Little Helper]

Khobai, on 28 February 2014 - 09:18 AM, said:

No. Just NO.

Mediums are already the least played weight class. If you forced it to find more mediums the queue times would increase drastically.

Only for people who refuse to pilot mediums.

[Sybreed]

Khobai, on 28 February 2014 - 10:24 AM, said:

Simply put:
1) mediums need stronger SRMs to give them a decent weapon with low tonnage requirements.
2) mediums need to be penalized less by engine weight. A 300 engine is only 25% of an assaults weight but its 50% of a mediums weight. mediums are penalized too heavily by the engine weight curve.



And the majority of players will continue playing heavies/assaults. This will result in longer queue times while waiting for mediums to join the game. The only way to get players to play mediums more is to make them better. Its quite simple really.



Which is most people. Medium pilots are the minority.

1) So that's an SRM buff, not a direct medium buff
2) This one makes me curious, how would that be achievable? It's all based on TT and should be "balanced" per se. I'm not saying your wrong, but I don't think that's a way to fix things. Besides, you don't always need to fit the biggest possible engine

And yes, medium pilots are the minority, but that shouldn't be.

[Ronan]

Don't know 'bout the rest of you, can't speak to anything but anecdotal evidence, YMMV and all that.

If you play mediums, you see more mediums. If you play assaults, you see more assaults. I generally play mediums, and I see lots of other medium mechs in use.

<shrug>

[Yanoshiku]

Yes to more mediums.
3/4/3/2 seems to be the best for me, although I also agree that they need a buff.
Cheers.

[Khobai]

Quote

1) So that's an SRM buff, not a direct medium buff
2) This one makes me curious, how would that be achievable? It's all based on TT and should be "balanced" per se. I'm not saying your wrong, but I don't think that's a way to fix things. Besides, you don't always need to fit the biggest possible engine

An SRM buff IS a medium buff since mediums rely heavily on SRMs.

And the way I would do it is to give each weight class its own unique skill tree and simply give mediums a bigger speed boost than the other weight classes. That allows them to run smaller engines to go the same speed, which saves them tonnage.

[Sybreed]

Khobai, on 28 February 2014 - 01:46 PM, said:

An SRM buff IS a medium buff since mediums rely heavily on SRMs.

And the way I would do it is to give each weight class its own unique skill tree and simply give mediums a bigger speed boost than the other weight classes. That allows them to run smaller engines to go the same speed, which saves them tonnage.

oh stop, an SRM buff is an SRM buff, all mech classes would benefit from it. And, what you're suggesting only allows to circumvent the issue that nothing prevents someone from playing Assaults. This is Tribes: Ascend, all over again, where heavy classes ruled the battlefield and since there was no restriction to how many there could be on a team, everyone would end up using a heavy class. Guess how that game is doing right now. (hint: it died)

[Chemie]

and what happens when the community does not select and drop in mechs in the perfect 3-3-3-3 ratio? Failed to find match...over and over...with no idea which mech you actually should be taking to get a game.

[Hellcat420]

there is nothing in the universe that pgi could do that would make me drop in a medium mech unless i actually want to drop in a medium mech. (and buffing medium mechs wont make me want to pilot them either)

Edited by Hellcat420, 28 February 2014 - 04:24 PM.