31 replies to this topic

[no1337]

Heyo, just a little question:

Does a crit-damage damages internal structure or a component only?

Example: ac20 crits a laser in an arm of a jenner, deals 9999 damage. does this kills the arm and the laser or the laser only and the rest crit is transfered ?!

I have read the guide but its almost too much text -.-

Thx in advance

no1337

Edited by no1337, 10 March 2014 - 10:35 AM.

[stjobe]

This would happen:

The arm internal structure takes 20 damage triggering a crit; the crit does 20, 40, or 60 damage to a component - in this case the laser. The laser has 10 HP, so it gets destroyed.

Furthermore, 15% of crit damage is applied as internal structure damage, so the arm's internal structure takes 3, 6, or 9 additional damage.

Depending on the size of the 'mech, that might be enough to destroy the arm; if that happens, 50% of any remaining damage is transferred to the side torso and applied there.

In the case of the Jenner, critting the laser is irrelevant since the arm only has 12 internal structure; any hit by an AC/20 will destroy the arm and everything in it, transferring at least 8 (and possibly up to 17 points on a triple crit) damage to the side torso.

Edited by stjobe, 10 March 2014 - 10:50 AM.

[no1337]

oO is that the reason why the servers are so laggy?

[Sandpit]

stjobe, on 10 March 2014 - 10:49 AM, said:

This would happen:

The arm internal structure takes 20 damage triggering a crit; the crit does 20, 40, or 60 damage to a component - in this case the laser. The laser has 10 HP, so it gets destroyed.

Furthermore, 15% of crit damage is applied as internal structure damage, so the arm's internal structure takes 3, 6, or 9 additional damage.

Depending on the size of the 'mech, that might be enough to destroy the arm; if that happens, 50% of any remaining damage is transferred to the side torso and applied there.

In the case of the Jenner, critting the laser is irrelevant since the arm only has 12 internal structure; any hit by an AC/20 will destroy the arm and everything in it, transferring at least 8 (and possibly up to 17 points on a triple crit) damage to the side torso.

^This

no1337, on 10 March 2014 - 11:13 AM, said:

oO is that the reason why the servers are so laggy?

ok

[Kaeb Odellas]

Also a fun fact:

Ammo in the limbs can still explode even after it's been destroyed. It's extremely annoying to have your arm blown off and the ammo you stored within it still blow your mech up half a second later, even though that arm is now sitting on a house.

[Deathlike]

Kaeb Odellas, on 10 March 2014 - 05:24 PM, said:

Also a fun fact:

Ammo in the limbs can still explode even after it's been destroyed. It's extremely annoying to have your arm blown off and the ammo you stored within it still blow your mech up half a second later, even though that arm is now sitting on a house.

THat would explain a few things...

[Sandpit]

Deathlike, on 10 March 2014 - 05:33 PM, said:

THat would explain a few things...

It's not just limbs. I dont' know if it's by design or a bug but I've seen players (I don't use ammo often enough to have had it happen to me personally) and teammates experience a delayed ammo explosion.

[Kaeb Odellas]

Sandpit, on 10 March 2014 - 05:36 PM, said:

It's not just limbs. I dont' know if it's by design or a bug but I've seen players (I don't use ammo often enough to have had it happen to me personally) and teammates experience a delayed ammo explosion.

The delay is definitely by design, since it also happens with Gauss explosions. It's just annoying to have it happen when the component where the exploding ammo was located is 50 meters away from the rest of the mech it managed to destroy...

[Deathlike]

I've noticed that, and the most recent "stun-lock" deaths. It's not true stun-lock, but it's like the HSR-version of dying. I'm not exactly sure why it's happening like that... but you see a crit target get "locked into place" for a moment and then die.

I'm not even sure why this is done anymore...

[Lyoto Machida]

Kaeb Odellas, on 10 March 2014 - 05:24 PM, said:

Also a fun fact:

Ammo in the limbs can still explode even after it's been destroyed. It's extremely annoying to have your arm blown off and the ammo you stored within it still blow your mech up half a second later, even though that arm is now sitting on a house.

I've seen mechs I was hitting walk around behind cover and then die a second or two later.

I do miss that sound of ammo cooking off they used to have:

[OneEyed Jack]

stjobe, on 10 March 2014 - 10:49 AM, said:

This would happen:

The arm internal structure takes 20 damage triggering a crit; the crit does 20, 40, or 60 damage to a component - in this case the laser. The laser has 10 HP, so it gets destroyed.

Except that the system doesn't pick the laser, then apply 20, 40, or 60 damage to it. It decides if there 0, 1, 2, or 3 crits, each doing 20 damage, then assigns the crits to random components, individually. They may or may not hit the same component.

I'm not privy to whether they are applied in sequence, so that a component destroyed by one crit is not available to be critted again (how TT does it), or in tandem, so that a 10hp laser could have multiple 20 dam crits applied.

[Reno Blade]

OneEyed Jack, on 11 March 2014 - 12:45 AM, said:

Except that the system doesn't pick the laser, then apply 20, 40, or 60 damage to it. It decides if there 0, 1, 2, or 3 crits, each doing 20 damage, then assigns the crits to random components, individually. They may or may not hit the same component.

I'm not privy to whether they are applied in sequence, so that a component destroyed by one crit is not available to be critted again (how TT does it), or in tandem, so that a 10hp laser could have multiple 20 dam crits applied.

I think they don't use multiple crits, but actually multiply the crit damage before it is applied.

Hit arm for 10 damage

roll for crit -> crit 2x = 2x crit damage
roll equippment to apply the damage. (these two lines could be swapped)

[Ixios]

A good guide on this topic:
http://mwomercs.com/...-a-brief-guide/

Cheers,
Ix

[Diego Angelus]

stjobe, on 10 March 2014 - 10:49 AM, said:

This would happen:

The arm internal structure takes 20 damage triggering a crit; the crit does 20, 40, or 60 damage to a component - in this case the laser. The laser has 10 HP, so it gets destroyed.

Furthermore, 15% of crit damage is applied as internal structure damage, so the arm's internal structure takes 3, 6, or 9 additional damage.

Depending on the size of the 'mech, that might be enough to destroy the arm; if that happens, 50% of any remaining damage is transferred to the side torso and applied there.

In the case of the Jenner, critting the laser is irrelevant since the arm only has 12 internal structure; any hit by an AC/20 will destroy the arm and everything in it, transferring at least 8 (and possibly up to 17 points on a triple crit) damage to the side torso.

Why is damage transferred to side torso ?

[Ixios]

I suggest you read the guide I linked, it'll explain everything clearer than I ever could!

The 50% Damage is transferred from a weapon hit on a destroyed hitbox, say a side torso, to the centre torso, is needed as the to stop us all using our destroyed mech hitboxes as 100% damage absorb shields! Ammo explosions transfer at 100% left over damage.

Ix

Edited by Ixios, 11 March 2014 - 02:16 AM.

[Trauglodyte]

stjobe, on 10 March 2014 - 10:49 AM, said:

This would happen: The arm internal structure takes 20 damage triggering a crit; the crit does 20, 40, or 60 damage to a component - in this case the laser. The laser has 10 HP, so it gets destroyed. Furthermore, 15% of crit damage is applied as internal structure damage, so the arm's internal structure takes 3, 6, or 9 additional damage. Depending on the size of the 'mech, that might be enough to destroy the arm; if that happens, 50% of any remaining damage is transferred to the side torso and applied there. In the case of the Jenner, critting the laser is irrelevant since the arm only has 12 internal structure; any hit by an AC/20 will destroy the arm and everything in it, transferring at least 8 (and possibly up to 17 points on a triple crit) damage to the side torso.

What he said. By the way, it is amazing how many people glossed over the additional 15% damage transferrence from crits to internal structure. It is, in all respects, a double tax on internal damage and just another thing that has sped up the TTK in this game.

Kaeb Odellas, on 10 March 2014 - 05:24 PM, said:

Also a fun fact: Ammo in the limbs can still explode even after it's been destroyed. It's extremely annoying to have your arm blown off and the ammo you stored within it still blow your mech up half a second later, even though that arm is now sitting on a house.

Regarding this, IF you crit an ammo bin, you have a 10% chance to cause an ammo explosion (heat doesn't increase the chance, though it should). Once that location is destroyed, the game looks to see if ammo was in that location and treats it as an additional 'crit' and, therefore, checks the calculation to see if the ammo should explode.

Really really fun fact, if you have two tons of ammo in your leg and you lose the leg, it'll check each bin to see if it explodes. If one does go off, it will check to see if the other bin explodes as well. Thus, creating an ammo explosion chain chance and why you often go nuclear when you lose a limb filled with ammo.

Diego Angelus, on 11 March 2014 - 01:48 AM, said:

Why is damage transferred to side torso ?

Because, limbs are considered to be attached to the side torsos and the head/side torsos are considered to be attached to the center torso.

Edited by Trauglodyte, 11 March 2014 - 06:42 AM.

[Jman5]

stjobe, on 10 March 2014 - 10:49 AM, said:

In the case of the Jenner, critting the laser is irrelevant since the arm only has 12 internal structure; any hit by an AC/20 will destroy the arm and everything in it, transferring at least 8 (and possibly up to 17 points on a triple crit) damage to the side torso.

It can happen if the ac/20 shot results in stripping all the armor off that component in that shot. If the jenner had 19 armor, you'll shed all the armor and can potentially crit the laser off without doing much damage to the internals.

[80sGlamRockSensation David Bowie]

stjobe, on 10 March 2014 - 10:49 AM, said:

This would happen:

The arm internal structure takes 20 damage triggering a crit; the crit does 20, 40, or 60 damage to a component - in this case the laser. The laser has 10 HP, so it gets destroyed.

Furthermore, 15% of crit damage is applied as internal structure damage, so the arm's internal structure takes 3, 6, or 9 additional damage.

Depending on the size of the 'mech, that might be enough to destroy the arm; if that happens, 50% of any remaining damage is transferred to the side torso and applied there.

In the case of the Jenner, critting the laser is irrelevant since the arm only has 12 internal structure; any hit by an AC/20 will destroy the arm and everything in it, transferring at least 8 (and possibly up to 17 points on a triple crit) damage to the side torso.

One small complaint -> there is no damage transfer from destroying and arm to Side Torso. Only from Legs -> Side T - > CT

Although, ammo explosions from the arms and Gauss detonations will still transfer. 0 armor arm shields ftw!

[Odins Fist]

Sandpit, on 10 March 2014 - 05:36 PM, said:

It's not just limbs. I dont' know if it's by design or a bug but I've seen players (I don't use ammo often enough to have had it happen to me personally) and teammates experience a delayed ammo explosion.

That hasn't happened to me in a while, but I remember a few times (months ago) when the reason for my mech being destroyed was "Ammo Explosion".
The funny thing was that I was running ONLY energy weapons, 4 ERPPCs, and no stored ammo forgotten anywhere, no AMS or ammo either.

Edited by Odins Fist, 11 March 2014 - 09:39 AM.

[Deathlike]

Odins Fist, on 11 March 2014 - 09:37 AM, said:

That hasn't happened to me in a while, but I remember a few times (months ago) when the reason for my mech being destroyed was "Ammo Explosion".
The funny thing was that I was running ONLY energy weapons, 4 ERPPCs, and no stored ammo forgotten anywhere, no AMS or ammo either.

AMS or you left ammo in your mech.

I don't think I've gotten an ammo explosion when I have been able to find the ton of ammo that I've personally misplaced or completely forgotten about.