12 replies to this topic

[Enzane]

So I was checking out the retreat forum when someone had the greatest idea ever.
MungFuSensei Had the great idea of how a lone mech should be able to retreat.

As it is, Depending on the game mode, we spend a minute or two chasing down that one light mech that managed to survive. Normally they are gracious enough to come at us and try to take one or two of us out as we kill it.

I've made a few changes but I love the idea.

MungFuSensei, on 31 January 2014 - 09:36 PM, said:

Make retreat into a mini game. The game selects the sector furthest from your current position, and notifies you. It also notifies the enemy team. You have to make it there without dying. If you do, you get some bonus XP for making it out alive. The person who kills you could also get some bonus XP for making sure no one makes it back to report on the outcome of the mission.

It still counts as a defeat but at least it's something to cheer for.

That would be fun and exciting. Instead of yelling at your teammate to power back up or watching him uselessly fight against an Atlas lance with his one ER LL, you get to root for him and sit with your butt cheeks clenched at the suspense.

The retreat sector should be random, but in a direction near the edge of the map. The distance should also be determined by your top speed. (If you are the last surviving atlas, it's not fair to assume you can make it across the map.) The distance should be something simple, like 1 grid square per 15KPH of your mech. (a light would be 10 grids, an atlas 4.)

This should also give a reward of some kind. I agree with XP. You ARE the last mech standing, through luck or skill, and that deserves a reward. You are also bringing back information of the enemy lances, This could be valuable data for your commanders back at base. Not to mention it means your mech survives. So what should the reward be?

Well a few things are obvious. If the economy ever comes back, you don't have to pay for your blown up mech, or unused ammo / armor. It should also give a bonus to XP as your combat computer didn't blow up. And lastly, It should earn you a title or achievement for doing this.

Conversely, the pilot who manages to take out the retreating mech should get that mech's Salvage! So a bit of a bonus C-bill for that pilot. As well as some extra XP for being such an awesome shot. Finally, this should also earn a title or achievement. After all, nailing that spider weaving through the canyons just before it escapes will make you feel like a champion!

Please, this was not my idea, just my thoughts on MungFuSensei's idea. Elaborate! Expand on my idea! Make it better! Point out my flaws (nicely please)!

[General Taskeen]

You should look up Titan Fall, unless you played that Beta.

In the attrition game mode, the losing team gets to retreat.

Basically what happens is, is a game mode within a game mode. Everyone respawns when "retreat" mode starts, the losing team is required to make it to a retreat zone within a certain time. The other team is tasked with stopping the retreat.

Now imagine if MWO had that and getting stomped might be bearable and it would be far more immersive as is the case in Battle Tech when an operation goes bad, people retreat back to dropships like the Clans did at Tukayyid.

[Enzane]

Actually. I never got into the Titan Fall Beta. Tried but never did.

That sounds pretty cool! Would be nice if MWO could do something of the like.

[Supersmacky]

My feeling, as nicely as I can put it, is that this "mini-game" would become THE game. Players would hold back playing timid so, just in case things go badly they are the ones that will get the chance to escape. There is already enough timid play happening and this would just exacerbate that situation. In principle, the idea has merit if their were an economic impact. I don't feel the retreating player should get anything for escaping other than not getting killed.

My one suggestion would be to make it even more dynamic (and again, only if there were an economy and a real reason not get get destroyed). By more dynamic I mean have the game look at the balance of kills between the two sides. If one side has 9 kills and the other has zero, allow the last three the escape option. If one side has 10 kills and the other 2, allow the last two the retreat option. And so on. In other words, depending on how bad one team is getting stomped would depend on when the escape option would be presented. That way it doesn't always become a predictable circumstance (or at least less predictable).

Again, I am not a fan of it with the game the way it is. The only up side as it stands is the last man standing on one side getting the option to keep his KDR from getting hit. Implementing this sort of options should have serious discouraging consequences (no salvage/match C-Bill rewards, etc).

[Enzane]

I see your point SuperSmacky.

I rather agree with it being more dynamic.

I don't think players are too timid in this game, but that is a matter of opinion and I don't mean to argue it.

I rather like your idea, making it variable based on the number of kills the two teams have. But I think it should give rewards, it's meant to be an advanced storyline or something fun to participate in. Not a goal to achieve. Achievements will always make players act awkwardly in a game. How much will it suck when the "100 cap" achievement comes out? we'll have conquest maps where no one fights, just runs and caps. But anywho.

I would just like to see more ideas for this game implemented. Will we ever see Dynamic Retreat? Probably not. But it's a thought. And hopefully it will inspire better ideas from the developers.

[PhoenixFire55]

Really? Retreat? What is the bloody point?

There is NO repair and rearm. You do NOT lose your mech if it is blown up or any equipment. You do NOT lose c-bills / exp if you die.

Really guys? You want to farm that KDR THAT badly huh?

It might be useful if CW will have some sort of penalties for dying ... but now it makes no sense.

Edited by PhoenixFire55, 12 March 2014 - 09:01 AM.

[Enzane]

PhoenixFire.

I'm more interested in diverse gameplay at this point. My KDR is 1.2 nothing special.

I'd rather just have more occurring in battles then Fight, run away, or cap.

[DONTOR]

Phoenix Fire, he said originally the survivng mech would have details of enemy forces that could be tactically advantageous, making it critical that he escape to warn his allies. It makes perfect sense I dont know how you arent grasping it. Although implementing it might be a bit of a challenge.

(it was reallllly hard not to vote BANANA)

Edited by DONTOR, 12 March 2014 - 09:09 AM.

[Reitrix]

General Taskeen, on 12 March 2014 - 05:13 AM, said:

You should look up Titan Fall, unless you played that Beta.

In the attrition game mode, the losing team gets to retreat.

Basically what happens is, is a game mode within a game mode. Everyone respawns when "retreat" mode starts, the losing team is required to make it to a retreat zone within a certain time. The other team is tasked with stopping the retreat.

Now imagine if MWO had that and getting stomped might be bearable and it would be far more immersive as is the case in Battle Tech when an operation goes bad, people retreat back to dropships like the Clans did at Tukayyid.

I'd like to see it implemented here, But more of a Team Choice sort of thing. For example:
The score is 7 - 0 , (possibly with Command Console) losing team can sound a retreat, which calls in a DropShip on a random grid on the edges of the map. DropShip takes 3 minutes to make Landfall, Enemy team is notified via Battlegrid that a Dropship is incoming and given an estimated arrival zone.
Enemy team then has to either eliminate the DropShip or the survivors of the losing side.
Now, the DropShip would remain on the battlefield until all friendly 'Mechs are picked up. Until all remaining friendlies are on board, the DropShip will remain at the Landing Zone and continue to take damage. Losing the DropShip destroys all 'mechs within it. Dropship would then take 15 seconds to properly Launch once all friendlies are on board.
Perhaps make it possible for the DropShip to boarded by the enemy team?

[Fut]

PhoenixFire55, on 12 March 2014 - 09:00 AM, said:

Really? Retreat? What is the bloody point?

There is NO repair and rearm. You do NOT lose your mech if it is blown up or any equipment. You do NOT lose c-bills / exp if you die.

Really guys? You want to farm that KDR THAT badly huh?

It might be useful if CW will have some sort of penalties for dying ... but now it makes no sense.

This is exactly why this game needs R&R back!
People have this attitude that dying doesn't matter at all (which is genuine, because there is no consequence to dying in MWO), and it effects the way they behave in game.

People should be worried about dying.
People should want to survive a match, even if they lose.

This Dynamic Retreat idea sounds pretty cool, but I think it could use some tweaking.
It should *somehow* be determined by the match score and not left down to the last mech every time (if the last remaining Lance is in a horrible situation, the option to retreat should be available). It'd also be cool if *again somehow* the option to retreat wasn't available in every single match - some missions, retreat is not an option.

Would also be kind of neat if the Command Console (or just the company commander) could order the retreat on their own.

Of course, like I said above, the game needs R&R back first!!

[PhoenixFire55]

Fut, on 12 March 2014 - 09:30 AM, said:

Of course, like I said above, the game needs R&R back first!!

For CW, yes. In random PUG drops people will just avoid fighting to minimize c-bills. I'm all for the R&R, but sadly it brings as much bad stuff into the game as it brings good stuff.

[tucsonspeed6]

I like it. You almost lost me when you called it a "mini game" but it actually does sound pretty good. I agree the retreat point should be randomized, otherwise you'd get campers. It certainly wouldn't stop trolls from annoying everyone on purpose, but nothing's ever going to stop that. I see this as an extra layer to the skirmish mode (and only the skirmish mode) to make it a bit more interesting.

The big question is, where do you draw the line? What triggers the retreat option? Only when there is 1 player left but more than (n) enemies? If so, what is n? I've picked off guys to even up a 4-1 deficit before, and was maybe a couple shots away from winning the match, so 5 seems like my limit, but that only happened once, and might not work for everyone. What if it's 2-12? Do both guys get to retreat, or does one have to be sacrificed before that can happen? And if multiple players can retreat, what happens if one makes it to the retreat zone before the other? Is he immediately removed from the battlefield, or does he have to wait there and defend until the other guy arrives or dies?

Here's how I'd like to see it play out: at a certain ratio (let's say any combination worse than 3-1 red to blue) a retreat call is made, and a point is marked on the map for the extraction zone. The zone would be fairly large compared to the standard base size to allow for fighting within the extraction zone. Fighting can still happen, but if the ratio happens to improve (ie: you down an enemy making the odds 2-5) the extraction option will still be available. You could even turn the odds during this time and possibly activate a retreat for the other team too, but the retreat option would always still be available. Once all team members are in the extraction zone, a timer begins signaling the extraction (30 seconds, give or take) During the countdown, you must defend. You can leave the zone at any time before or after the timer starts, but once the timer hits 0, you must be in the zone to get a retreat bonus. This ends the match with a loss, but all players in the extraction zone at the end get a modest consolation of experience and money that they wouldn't get otherwise.

[Mechteric]

I think the retreat area shouldn't be random. It would be easiest just to make the retreat area be the out bounds area near that team's spawn area of the map. It only needs be about a 500 meter long area or so, but still have a 10 second countdown to leaving the area like you currently get when you go out of bounds. Only difference is you won't get a death on your record (maybe could start a new stat for tracking this number).