12 replies to this topic

[Rhent]

How would I fix LRM's? Well the ALARM broke LRM's, here is how to deal with the ALARM feature:

#1: LRM's fired without lock travel at 33% increased speed

If a pilot decides to skirt the alarm and dumb fire his LRM's, then the LRM's should travel faster. It is assumed it will only hit mechs standing still or idiots charging the LRM mech head on who aren't serpenting.

#2: Increase LRM ammo amount by 25% a ton

LRM's generally do crap damage, and you have to fire an inordinate amount of LRM's to do a modicrum amount due to the ALARM that Piranha implemented (horribly wrong feature). Due to the alarm making it incredibly easy to dodge LRM's shot at 450M+ range, increase the amount of LRM rounds per ton.

#3: LRM's fired at a target at 180M who close to 179M take full damage

If a fast mech is closing on a LRM boat and the boat gets the rounds off at effective range but the mech closes to 179M or less, let the mech still take damage.


All three points will increase the viability of LRM's without increasing the base LRM damage that a few very vocal people who can't use cover are so terrorized.

[Sybreed]

I kind of agree with all points, but #2 is kind of a trickier one.

Because it's so easy to get DHS and Endo, it's also very easy to boat ammo like nuts. I agree that having little ammo per ton makes assault boating even more appealing than anything else (Trebuchet is extremely at a disadvantage here), but at the same time it's not an issue because it's easy to save tonnage. But, since it would help medium mechs to use their LRM launchers, I agree with #2 as well.

[MadMaxMKII]

havent lrm being fixed today? i think so.

[101011]

That one meter will make all the difference...yeah. The extra ammo..well, you're indirect fire, you can't expect to do as much dpt as a direct fire weapon. The first suggestion seems alright though.

[Lord Perversor]

Rhent, on 18 March 2014 - 05:36 PM, said:

How would I fix LRM's? Well the ALARM broke LRM's, here is how to deal with the ALARM feature:

#1: LRM's fired without lock travel at 33% increased speed

If a pilot decides to skirt the alarm and dumb fire his LRM's, then the LRM's should travel faster. It is assumed it will only hit mechs standing still or idiots charging the LRM mech head on who aren't serpenting.

#2: Increase LRM ammo amount by 25% a ton

LRM's generally do crap damage, and you have to fire an inordinate amount of LRM's to do a modicrum amount due to the ALARM that Piranha implemented (horribly wrong feature). Due to the alarm making it incredibly easy to dodge LRM's shot at 450M+ range, increase the amount of LRM rounds per ton.

#3: LRM's fired at a target at 180M who close to 179M take full damage

If a fast mech is closing on a LRM boat and the boat gets the rounds off at effective range but the mech closes to 179M or less, let the mech still take damage.


All three points will increase the viability of LRM's without increasing the base LRM damage that a few very vocal people who can't use cover are so terrorized.

1: without lock Lrm should be fire in a close up to 10% degree arc as much working as some ******** blob of Srm able to reach up to 1000m, but not fly faster

2: Missile dmg it's quite ok with the added speed, play a few matches with a normal Lrm mech or a Lurm boat and then say ppl can easily dodge them.

3: WUT? so if someone it's beyond 180m and get close before the 1sec i takes them to reach the target it deserves to eat full dmg..
so if the target it's under 180m and you manage to put up distance to fire Lrm at him he deserve to soak dmg because he sucks at keep range.. what's next apply yhe same to the snap second of PPC firing at 90m?

[Rhent]

101011, on 18 March 2014 - 05:42 PM, said:

That one meter will make all the difference...yeah. The extra ammo..well, you're indirect fire, you can't expect to do as much dpt as a direct fire weapon. The first suggestion seems alright though.

Run LRM's exclusively on a mech and fire them direct fire like you would a PPC or AC after you have gotten a lock and then look at your damage after a match. Why is it that ton for ton, the damage LRM's do are fractional to a PPC or AC? Could it be:
1st) You get an alarm and have 3 seconds usually to dodge the shot completely
2nd) The LRM mech has to expose himself for 1 second to get a lock and on average 3-5 seconds of facing the opponent mech to do damage

If a LRM using mech wants to have the same advantages as a PPC or AC using mech, they have to fire relying on locks that may or may not exist OR expose themselves to enemy fire for at least 3 seconds that other mechs can pop - fire - hide. LRM mechs generally don't have that ability even with time delay modules unless their targets are at 450M in which case on an Atlas they will probably hit it because it moves so slowly even the alarm can't save them.

SO, LRM mechs have to spray and pray A LOT to do 40% of the damage by ton compared to other weapon systems. Increase the ammo so LRM's could at least hit 50% damage by ton compared to AC/PPC/Lasers.

[ShinVector]

People turn a support weapon into a primary weapon.

[101011]

LRM's aren't meant to do damage, not like PPC/ACs. Indirect /= direct fire. You sacrifice damage for the ability to shoot without LOS.

[Rhent]

ShinVector, on 18 March 2014 - 05:53 PM, said:

People turn a support weapon into a primary weapon.

LRM's are a weapon, its not a "Support Weapon", it would be like me calling your mother a Bicycle, she's your Mother not the town ride.

[Volthorne]

ShinVector, on 18 March 2014 - 05:53 PM, said:

People turn a support weapon into a primary weapon.

101011, on 18 March 2014 - 05:57 PM, said:

LRM's aren't meant to do damage, not like PPC/ACs. Indirect /= direct fire. You sacrifice damage for the ability to shoot without LOS.

Please tell this to the guys in the army who man the giant-ass artillery cannons. I'm sure they'd LOVE to hear about it.

[ShinVector]

Rhent, on 18 March 2014 - 06:01 PM, said:

LRM's are a weapon, its not a "Support Weapon", it would be like me calling your mother a Bicycle, she's your Mother not the town ride.

It's ok... I love meeting LRM super boats in the front lines tearing them apart and hoping they carry XL engines too.

Volthorne, on 18 March 2014 - 06:03 PM, said:

Please tell this to the guys in the army who man the giant-ass artillery cannons. I'm sure they'd LOVE to hear about it.

Which they can't do squat without spotters near the front lines ?
I salute the spotters !

Edited by ShinVector, 18 March 2014 - 06:22 PM.

[101011]

Let's do some theoretical math. We'll assume average target speed is 64.8 mph (or 4/6). Now, let's say your 'mech armed with just a single LRM20 and one ton of ammo (120 missiles) attacks said target which is 12 hexes away. Assume that both you and the target are moving top speed (6 hexes), with the average IS pilot skill of 4/5. The to-hit roll would be 4 (base) + 2 (attacker ran) + 2 (target moved 5-6 hexes) + 2 (medium range) for a total modifier of +10.
(EDIT: For poorly rushed math) Probablities follow:

Dealing 6 Damage spread over 2 locations: ~0.04482
Dealing 9 Damage spread over 2 locations: ~0.022491
Dealing 12 Damage spread over 3 locations: ~0.0891
Dealing 16 Damage spread over 3 locations: ~0.04482
Dealing 20 Damage spread over 4 locations: ~0.04482
Missing: .73

Now, apply this to that one ton of ammo. Immediately, 3/4 of the 6 shots are misses. Rounding down, that's four shots with no damage. Now, you have two shots, with 40 potential damage. Theoretically, the majority of the time, those shots will do 12 damage to 3 random locations each, for a total of 24 damage to 6 random locations, tending towards the CT, per ton of ammo. Compare that to MWO.


Oh, and to the guy who tried to compare BT to real life...well, the M982 Excalibur weighs roughly ten times as much as a single LRM. These missiles aren't artillery shells, if they were, they'd be called AC/20's.

Edited by 101011, 18 March 2014 - 06:50 PM.

[MadcatX]

Can we just sorta wait a week or two, see how this plays out, then based on that experience start making LRM fixing threads?

I mean, seems kind of early.