49 replies to this topic

[Mirkk Defwode]

AdamBaines, on 26 March 2014 - 05:30 AM, said:

Interesting idea that I like and think they should give a try at lest once, but I have a sneaking suspicion its going to be a lot harder for PGI to implement then the general sentiment here thinks it is. Make it a contest. 1 winning map. If the effort on PGI side is too much dont do it again.

Then maybe in private matches, people can choose to use "unofficial maps" if they want.

If they're just going to do it once, I'd want more content rather than less out of it. I also know this isn't too difficult to do it really just comes down to pipeline and how they choose to manage it.

The CryEngine itself is designed to have an influx of content, otherwise they wouldn't be pushing out a map editor with the Engine for every official title for the CryEngine (Go look, seriously all PC Crytek games have the map editor included, and it was heavily advertised it was there for FarCry2 and Crysis2). Just because this is making use of the engine we should be able to utilize that as a tool for the community.

It's more a question of the studio embracing community support in this fashion.

[Rebas Kradd]

Ozric, on 26 March 2014 - 02:22 AM, said:

PGI have already given a negative answer to this question I'm sure, but now that they seem to be outsourcing community warfare to the community, maybe community maps are possible too?

PGI has outsourced a lot of things just by not doing them and thus leaving them to the community. It's actually a genius move considering how much of an infrastructure they got from the community without lifting a finger. New player tutorials, mech lab (Smurfy), advertising, leagues, even the forum's Developer Tracker, all left to the players because PGI didn't do it for whatever reason.

This, however, would require work from PGI.

Edited by Rebas Kradd, 26 March 2014 - 12:26 PM.

[AdamBaines]

Mirkk Defwode, on 26 March 2014 - 09:14 AM, said:

If they're just going to do it once, I'd want more content rather than less out of it. I also know this isn't too difficult to do it really just comes down to pipeline and how they choose to manage it.

The CryEngine itself is designed to have an influx of content, otherwise they wouldn't be pushing out a map editor with the Engine for every official title for the CryEngine (Go look, seriously all PC Crytek games have the map editor included, and it was heavily advertised it was there for FarCry2 and Crysis2). Just because this is making use of the engine we should be able to utilize that as a tool for the community.

It's more a question of the studio embracing community support in this fashion.

I agree part of it is embracing the community and their efforts, but I feel pretty confident the maps would lack the polish the dev created. They put a lot of time into the maps and the QA of them (regardless of what many of you think ) and there are still a lot of issues with terrain, geometry, spacing and etc.

Question. With the tools that could be provided by by the dev team, would it include a mode where you could drop into the maps them selves? I know less then you do about the Cry engine and its tools package and making maps for it. it would seem to me that you would have to actually play in the Map to do your own personal QA of your created map.

Can you point me to some resources online where I can see examples of other games using community provided maps with Cry Engine 3? And the tool sets that were provided by the dev teams? Id like to educate myself a bit on the subject. Thanks very much.

[Mirkk Defwode]

AdamBaines, on 26 March 2014 - 12:25 PM, said:

...

Can you point me to some resources online where I can see examples of other games using community provided maps with Cry Engine 3? And the tool sets that were provided by the dev teams? Id like to educate myself a bit on the subject. Thanks very much.

http://gamedevelopme...--gamedev-10166 This is a fairly informative look at development within the engine and the capabilities to interact with it.

Here is a map from someone doing a Stalker Mod with the CryEngine


A Map in development within the tool


And for a Shoutout to the level designers and mappers for MWLL


I will say with all due respect, the community will work very hard to ensure that their maps are well map to a good measure of polish, and will attempt to be balanced. I'm not saying every map will be but those that are passionate about making a good map for the game at large will strive towards that. Plus if there is a submission and review process through PGI I'm sure they can weed out or take notes of adjustments they'd like to make and have them done in house before final release.

The idea behind this is also that before maps start being made PGI gives a list of things they're looking for in a quality map so the community isn't blind in what they're striving for.

I know personally any attempts at map development I'd take I'd run it through a gambit of other folks looking at it before final submission.

[AdamBaines]

Mirkk Defwode, on 26 March 2014 - 12:57 PM, said:

http://gamedevelopme...--gamedev-10166 This is a fairly informative look at development within the engine and the capabilities to interact with it.

Here is a map from someone doing a Stalker Mod with the CryEngine


A Map in development within the tool


And for a Shoutout to the level designers and mappers for MWLL


I will say with all due respect, the community will work very hard to ensure that their maps are well map to a good measure of polish, and will attempt to be balanced. I'm not saying every map will be but those that are passionate about making a good map for the game at large will strive towards that. Plus if there is a submission and review process through PGI I'm sure they can weed out or take notes of adjustments they'd like to make and have them done in house before final release.

The idea behind this is also that before maps start being made PGI gives a list of things they're looking for in a quality map so the community isn't blind in what they're striving for.

I know personally any attempts at map development I'd take I'd run it through a gambit of other folks looking at it before final submission.

Thanks for the info. I will read up!

[Spyro]

without community warfare, I feel like MWO can get a little stale. Having a bunch of new maps generated by the community, and requiring only moderate work from MWO so that they can focus on CW would be awesome

[aniviron]

Rebas Kradd, on 25 March 2014 - 01:59 PM, said:

It's a great idea, but the review, vetting, and tweaking process would be a lot of work for PGI. 50% of the submissions would probably be grumpy people's revisions of the maps they hate ("River City as I Think It Oughta Be!"). You'd probably only get 1% of submissions that actually meet their criteria for technical and gameplay alone - map balance, variety, server friendliness, terrain workability, and whatever else. Then you've got legal (i.e. perusing the entire map to make sure nobody snuck in a hidden picture of a Marauder that Harmony Gold could sue over).

I don't think there's going to be nearly as much problem with this as you suggest; first of all, I think it's a bit disingenuous to suggest that PGI's crack review team is going to spend hours and hours (or any time at all) pouring over a map called "River City as I Think It Oughta Be!" Furthermore, there's really no reason at all that they have to promise any maps will make it in the game at all. It's not as though the technical and legal hurdles couldn't be overcome- since PGI wouldn't exactly be the first company to ever add user generated content to their game, they could maybe take an example from the hundreds of games before them that have incorporated user-made content?

Now, call me crazy, but imagine this- let's say they release the SDK, and put no further work in besides creating a subforum for level design. People make things, submit them, and any other users interested in what others are making can load up the maps and play them. Most of what is submitted will be crap, but there will be some that stick out for their excellent quality, and in general, users tend to make the most noise about these threads. Once every month or two, someone does a roundup of the maps they think are the closest to being PGI-quality, maybe talks to the author or just observes, and when the maps are close to being done, the creator gets an offer of submitting them to the game proper for a finalizing pass.

Having a map that's 90% done certainly beats having to make maps from scratch; and there are a lot of talented people in this community who are desperately looking for creative outlets to express their love of the game. Nobody makes custom levels because they want to get paid; we do it because the game is amazing, and we want to help and make it grow. There are enough people who are both passionate and skilled that the results can be worth having- just look at CS:GO and TF2; most of the new maps for those games are user-made, and they tend to be better than the maps that shipped with the games.

[Mirkk Defwode]

aniviron, on 29 March 2014 - 06:10 PM, said:

...

This is exceptionally well-put. I was leaning more on doing an idea like what Tripwire Interactive does for having map packs be submitted through a contest, then get rolled up into a map pack released to the community associated with a special event.

The studio adds stuff like new weapons or skins as part of the free content release, but the user made maps get released where the studio gives them full credit whilst officially making these maps part of the online content.

[Novakaine]

They could if they wanted too.
Just ask for a few volunteers.
It's not that there's any lack of talented mappers here.
But it seems if they can't immediately monetize something their not gonna was a line of code on it.

[AdamBaines]

Novakaine, on 30 March 2014 - 10:35 AM, said:

They could if they wanted too.
Just ask for a few volunteers.
It's not that there's any lack of talented mappers here.
But it seems if they can't immediately monetize something their not gonna was a line of code on it.

Agreed. But lets remember, its not just PGI calling those shots. IGP is more then likely pushing a lot of the decisions based on your point on Monetization. They are the "Distributors" and Publishers.

[Geeks On Hugs]

I like this idea so long as everything fits in with the lore..."real" locations and what not.

[Cimarb]

Geeks On Hugs, on 30 March 2014 - 04:46 PM, said:

I like this idea so long as everything fits in with the lore..."real" locations and what not.

According to Heffay, there are files in the game logs that show coordinates and planet names, so that would make me think that they will fit the "real" locations, thanksfully.

[HammerSwarm]

Bump for great internet justice. I would try my steady hand at adding maps to MWO. I have dozens of Ideas which I think would be fantastic for MWO including:

Denser Urban Areas.
More Industrialized Areas.
Additional Moon Like Areas.
Open Pit Mines
A valley with a dam and overhead bridges.
Rolling hills with dense tree cover, open cliff faces, and other natural features.

I'd love to try my hands at those types of maps, as we currently have very little in the way of maps. this could be gold.

Additionally with only a few maps that you could believe are on the same planet how are we ever going to fight campaigns? For instance.

Lets say you were fighting a CW campaign against your rival on Terra Therma. Even if you only planned to play 3 matches we only have one volcano map, with a stunning one weather condition.

I might believe forest colony snow was on the edge of a fjord, further up the mountain you run into a frozen city from the failed terraforming of this planet, and then pushing further up you fight the final battle at alpine peaks.

Nothing like that exists for hpg, crimson straits, caustic value, terra therma.

Even if they released the development assets, and said we could only develop Moon Maps I think the creative people who play this game would jump on it. Just saying.

Edited by HammerSwarm, 31 March 2014 - 06:16 AM.

[CDLord HHGD]

Yup and while I am sh*t at graphic design, I'd love to give my sketches over to someone who knows what they are doing!

[Xenoid]

Community map development will only help the game.

If the Holy Grail of CW ever arrives, we are going to need more maps than what is currently available.

Allowing players to contribute will strengthen the community.

Why couldn't players make maps, have other players test the maps and post feedback then have PGI do the fine tuning? The players would be doing the heavy lifting, all PGI would need to do is the polishing. It's a win/win.

[Prezimonto]

I can't agree enough!

The FPS games I've played and loved the most have a huge variety of maps from the community to supplement the basic game play.

[Mirkk Defwode]

HammerSwarm, on 31 March 2014 - 06:14 AM, said:

Bump for great internet justice. I would try my steady hand at adding maps to MWO. I have dozens of Ideas which I think would be fantastic for MWO including:

Denser Urban Areas.
More Industrialized Areas.
Additional Moon Like Areas.
Open Pit Mines
A valley with a dam and overhead bridges.
Rolling hills with dense tree cover, open cliff faces, and other natural features.

I'd love to try my hands at those types of maps, as we currently have very little in the way of maps. this could be gold.

Additionally with only a few maps that you could believe are on the same planet how are we ever going to fight campaigns? For instance.

Lets say you were fighting a CW campaign against your rival on Terra Therma. Even if you only planned to play 3 matches we only have one volcano map, with a stunning one weather condition.

I might believe forest colony snow was on the edge of a fjord, further up the mountain you run into a frozen city from the failed terraforming of this planet, and then pushing further up you fight the final battle at alpine peaks.

Nothing like that exists for hpg, crimson straits, caustic value, terra therma.

Even if they released the development assets, and said we could only develop Moon Maps I think the creative people who play this game would jump on it. Just saying.

I've got some ideas along those lines as well, and a lot of geographic photos to work from since I did a massive cross America roadtrip not too long ago

But a few maps I'd like to see.

• Temperate Rainforest
  
• Southern Swamp/Marshlands
  
• Open Savannah with scrub trees and tall grass probably some fairly large rocks randomly dispersed
  
• Foothills or Rolling hills map
  
• Lunar Base - more moon than base for this one.
  
• Military Base + Airfield + Space port
  
• Multi-tiered urban center
  
• Tropical Island chain with several small islands
  
• Mech Factory and Industrial area

Even then all of those are reasonable concepts that could have multiple variations made off of them. With that I'd like to see some of these done with some unusual environmental features like multiple moons in the skybox, or the same for multiple suns. How phosphorescent water that glows slightly during night versions. Less entirely earth-like environments.

The other thing I'd really like to see is just larger maps. There are a good portion where we engage within 30-45 seconds which is fine for a traditional FPS title like Counter-Strike, but it doesn't allow for scouts to really be properly utilized or to really reposition oneself to combat another team in multiple fashions. So a little more scale to the maps would be superb.

[Dark Jackal]

I hope the devs look into this soon. Lots of brainstorming going on here!

[Renegat]

I would like to see Solaris VII maps for duel or private games.

[kesuga7]

think they answered no to this question already
in ask the devs

i think