63 replies to this topic

[Tezcatli]

I have two accounts I run on. And I got the 10 wins. There was at least 3 games I recall losing because our team broke up and didn't have the map awareness to respond to the enemy's majority attack. I dunno. Maybe it's my elo. But I pugged all of my matches and didn't have as many problems.

[Ransack]

You're being trolled

[wolf74]

Morang, on 30 March 2014 - 11:09 AM, said:

. TS3 is especially bad with MWO because TS3 overlay sometimes starts to crash the game, and without it when playing with people I don't know intimately I can't recognize them by voice, and their nickname isn't there when they speak. But even with overlay using TS complicates what could've been simple (e. g., picking mates to arrange a lance straight from the match).

You can turn the overlay off if it is crashing your game.
Click on "Setting" than "Plugins" or "Ctrl + Shift + P" and un-check mark it.


on a Side note I have also got the free mechbay for my account and a Friends account (Family Trip where he could not play this weekend)

Edited by wolf74, 31 March 2014 - 09:00 AM.

[Almond Brown]

JohnnyWayne, on 30 March 2014 - 02:37 PM, said:

I stopped after he claimed that LOL is a good game.... Lol...

I had the same problem today. Always dropped in a complete pug team against teams with 1-2 full premade teams in them. Played 1,5 h and won 2 games. Much fun, much fun.

How did you confirm the presence of these 1-2 full pre-mades? You didn't ASK and then believe what they told you did you? LOL

Blaming "others", no matter their make up, is still a BS cop-out.

[Agent 0 Fortune]

Almond Brown, on 31 March 2014 - 09:05 AM, said:

How did you confirm the presence of these 1-2 full pre-mades? You didn't ASK and then believe what they told you did you? LOL
Blaming "others", no matter their make up, is still a BS cop-out.

I can't speak for the player you addressed, but it happens a lot. The matchmaker is really horrible at its job. The April 29 changes are an attempt to mask the matchmaker deficiencies, but until they overhaul the matchmaker itself, I'm not holding my breath.

My personal favorite was the opposing player trying to "help" when he told us that we took too many LRMs, and their balanced team was better with 3 LRM, 2 spotters, and 3 direct fire.

I told him next time I will tell the 11 other PUGs on my team what to take before the next match. And I know we didn't have a premade because I was seat 1, team alpha. And while I have no way of confirming that they they were 2 premades, they had no reason to lie, and I believe the player was being sincere, after all if they had 2 teams, why would he think we didn't.

Edited by Agent 0 Fortune, 31 March 2014 - 09:18 AM.

[Roadkill]

Agent 0 Fortune, on 31 March 2014 - 09:17 AM, said:

And I know we didn't have a premade because I was seat 1, team alpha.

You know nothing of the sort. All you know from that is that if your team had a premade in Alpha lance, it was a 3-person premade.

It is further possible that you had another premade in Beta, and a third in Charlie.

You being solo and in Alpha does not mean your team had no premades.

[WildeKarde]

Have to say it has been more difficult this weekend, maybe I'm just worse than I thought

Even when I had a good game it could still be a loss. Most annoying was getting six kills & four assists but losing the last two mechs (firestarter & awesome). I'm even sure I got killed three games in a row to the same player

Feels like the free bay brought out a lot of the better players, some pre mades were probably playing as well

Edited by Jake Hendricks, 31 March 2014 - 09:32 AM.

[Priest4357]

7 matches, 5 wins, 4 different mechs. All PUG. It wasn't difficult.

I'm with most of the people here, if you are losing that badly, you need to look at your play, not everyone else's.

[Bobzilla]

If you only pug, your win/loss will be close to 1 no matter how good or bad you are due to randomness. So if you feel like you're doing really bad, just look at your w/l and if it's above 1 you are doing really good considering 1 team always has to loose, you actually are deciding games. If your w/l is below 1, you need to change something up.

Meh i could be wrong, my w/l in my 3L is over 4, but only 1.5 in my DDC but my DDC K/D is much higher so I felt i did better in it, go figure.

[Morang]

wolf74, on 31 March 2014 - 08:57 AM, said:

You can turn the overlay off if it is crashing your game.
Click on "Setting" than "Plugins" or "Ctrl + Shift + P" and un-check mark it.

I know that I can turn it off, dammit. And I did. What I described is the consequence of turning it off: I can't recognize speakers by voice (and overlay isn't there to show me on the screen who is speaking).

Edited by Morang, 31 March 2014 - 10:59 AM.

[capt hungry]

I think I had to play at least 10 matches to get the 5 wins and I pugged the whole time. I didn't find it any more difficult than usual this past weekend.

[Quick n Fast]

as a pug i did it in 8games, just under an 1hr..
was almost as easy as the last free give away.. that I nailed 5/5 in 40min..

ooh and if u were havin that much trouble.. y didn't you grp up w/ friends?

Edited by Kahnawake MechMaster Prime, 31 March 2014 - 11:53 AM.

[Agent 0 Fortune]

Roadkill, on 31 March 2014 - 09:27 AM, said:

You know nothing of the sort. All you know from that is that if your team had a premade in Alpha lance, it was a 3-person premade.
It is further possible that you had another premade in Beta, and a third in Charlie.
You being solo and in Alpha does not mean your team had no premades.

Now you have me intrigued, do you have any sources to cite?
My experience in this game as both a PUG and a group player have shown me that my position in the “drop lobby" provides a lot of information regarding the teams composition.

Groups are always added to matches before PUGs. They may not enumerate first, which is why there is sometimes gaps and sometimes players slide down the seat list, but the matchmaker selects them first and always fills out the top of the lance (seat 1 on down).
This means that if you have seat 1 in any lance, then there is not a pre-made group in that lance.
It also means that if you are in a premade group and not in Alpha lance, then there is another premade group in alpha.

I am also very curious about how PUGs are enumerated into the match. I have observed that I am frequently in the first available seat, but I don’t know why that is; I don’t think it is based on Ping, because at 80ms I am middle of the road. However I do have a fast computer with an SSD hard drive, so maybe I just load-in faster.

Now that I think about it, maybe loading in quickly is the reason for these observations. And for someone who normally loads into Bravo or Charlie even in PUG matches, every match would look the same regardless of premades.

Anyway, if you have information to refute these observations, I would love to see it.

[JohnnyWayne]

Almond Brown, on 31 March 2014 - 09:05 AM, said:

How did you confirm the presence of these 1-2 full pre-mades? You didn't ASK and then believe what they told you did you? LOL

Blaming "others", no matter their make up, is still a BS cop-out.

During my 2 years and over 4000 matches of MWO, all in higher ELO areas since elo, I have developed some sort of feeling if there is a coordinated team on the opposing team or not, regardless of their faction. It is even more obvious when 2 teams are there playing that way.

It is usually the others that limit my performance. Because this is a team based game without teams. The only approximation to what could be called a team are premades and these are made some sort of exclusive club due to limited ingame communication and organisation capabilities.

My follow players usually lose track of what is going on in the game, don't have a feeling for enemy movement and spread out all over the map. They have no sense of flow in combat leading to blocking each other at bottlenecks and missing the timing when to push and when to fall back.

Btw, a 3 player premade is way easier to deal with than a 4 player one. The additional chance of a teammate following orders and the additional information shared between the team really sticks out. Experienced this myself.

I actually get the feeling, that the matchmaker places me together with mostly worse players to set my team up against premades. *leaves to build a tinfoilhat*

Anuerysm, on 31 March 2014 - 10:17 AM, said:

7 matches, 5 wins, 4 different mechs. All PUG. It wasn't difficult.

I'm with most of the people here, if you are losing that badly, you need to look at your play, not everyone else's.

Says the guy I never met ingame before.

Edited by JohnnyWayne, 31 March 2014 - 01:40 PM.

[Roadkill]

Agent 0 Fortune, on 31 March 2014 - 01:18 PM, said:

Groups are always added to matches before PUGs. They may not enumerate first, which is why there is sometimes gaps and sometimes players slide down the seat list, but the matchmaker selects them first and always fills out the top of the lance (seat 1 on down).

This means that if you have seat 1 in any lance, then there is not a pre-made group in that lance.

My experience, like yours, comes from both pugging and pre-made play.

As you point out here, groups are chosen first and put into their lances, but they don't always enumerate that way. So if there's a 3-man in alpha, but I solo drop and have a better ping (or simply clicked "launch" first and so already have a connection established with the matchmaker), I might get slotted into slot 1 of lance Alpha.

My regular group sometimes drops in strange configurations. We might have a pair of 3-mans and one solo guy, for example. We generally make a lame attempt to sync drop just to see what happens, and we've seen some strange results.

Such as the solo guy being slot 1 of Lance Alpha even when paired with one of our own 3-mans. Or a 2-man being slots 2 and 3 of a lance.

I don't recall ever seeing the solo guy intermixed with the 2-man or 3-man, but the group does not have to be at the top of the lance. We've definitely seen that before.

Quote

It also means that if you are in a premade group and not in Alpha lance, then there is another premade group in alpha.

This is my experience as well. Note, though, that it says nothing about the size of the pre-made in alpha, though it seems to be that the pre-made in alpha is at least as big as your own.

Quote

I am also very curious about how PUGs are enumerated into the match. I have observed that I am frequently in the first available seat, but I don’t know why that is; I don’t think it is based on Ping, because at 80ms I am middle of the road. However I do have a fast computer with an SSD hard drive, so maybe I just load-in faster.

Now that I think about it, maybe loading in quickly is the reason for these observations. And for someone who normally loads into Bravo or Charlie even in PUG matches, every match would look the same regardless of premades.

I think load-in speed and order of clicking launch both play into it. I'm in Alpha far too often for it to be skill based - I'm just not good enough to be in alpha that often. So it seems like it has to be based on load-in time and/or just plain queue order.

[Adiuvo]

JohnnyWayne, on 31 March 2014 - 01:34 PM, said:

snip

Your feelings on if there is a premade or not aren't exactly reliable. Matchmaker will stick premade groups together. If you have a premade on your team, the other team has one as well. This is part of the reason why in high Elo, presuming you're dropping with people equally skilled, you're more likely to fail as a solo person than as a group.

Also if you find it unlikely to win 5 matches out of 7 total you really have no backing to talk down to people...

So yeah, as the other guy said, look to your own play before blaming everyone else.

[JohnnyWayne]

Adiuvo, on 01 April 2014 - 12:47 PM, said:

Your feelings on if there is a premade or not aren't exactly reliable.

They are.

Adiuvo, on 01 April 2014 - 12:47 PM, said:

Matchmaker will stick premade groups together. If you have a premade on your team, the other team has one as well.

No, it doesn't give a shit. It mixes weightclass and teams at random solely based on elo.

When my win or lose ratio is depending on factors other than myself it says nothing about my skill especially with such low data avaible since the reset.
Elo isn't fit to be used in a team game as itis a 1 on 1 stat. The average does not help shit if you pack in 2 good and 10 bad players.

[A banana in the tailpipe]

ShadowVFX, on 29 March 2014 - 03:28 PM, said:

These tournaments bring out the worst players MWO has to offer.

You mean they bring back the regular players who beat the system long ago and left out of boredom.

[Suko]

lockwoodx, on 01 April 2014 - 01:51 PM, said:

You mean they bring back the regular players who beat the system long ago and left out of boredom.

The guy on my team who decided to let his cat take over for him says otherwise.

[A banana in the tailpipe]

ShadowVFX, on 01 April 2014 - 01:55 PM, said:

The guy on my team who decided to let his cat take over for him says otherwise.

If players can come back after months of major matches just for some weekend event and still wreck face, the problem isn't them. The problem is the game never changed/was fixed enough to the point they had to re-learn how to play.