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Maybe Its Not The Weapons That Are Op. It Mights Be The Mechanics?!


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#1 darrencheesecake

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 12:13 AM

Honestly the weapons seem fine except LRMs. Why they were nerfed into the ground mid last year is beyond anyone. They were fine as they were when they were slow, in-accurate (spectacular to watch) and hard hitting. Anyways, I'll disscuss more about LRMS later but I believe that some mechanics lead to the speculation of weapons being overpowered.

The biggest machanic broken is the hit-registration. I've noticed that it has been bad for a while and needs to be PGI's priority for the next bunch of patches. I was playing in my stalker and noticed that my back torso had being critically damage, to my surprise there were little lights (easy-modes) sniping me. OK, I'm fine with that but I WISH I KNOWN EARLIER!!! I your wanting to create a competitive game, then this needs to be fixed seriously, call helf from other devs who used this version of the cry engine and fix it asap please.

Another problem is the momentum. AHHHHH, it's so annoying to slot on a small ledge when i'm repositioning my atlas. Who agrees. This mechanic needs fixing to make battles more intense and nail-biting. I would suggest a gear mechanic to help with this problem. You change gear to increase power to the engine to help generate more momentum to over come hills and the annoying small bumps (accleration and speed don't increase or decrease). Maybe add a time limit for the gears to be activated and decreases all turning speeds (arms, torso and legs). The assults would have the most gears and lights would have no gears (they don't seem to encounter this problem at all, unless traversing a really tall hill).

The easy mode ECM... I'll admit it's not as OP as it was but there needs to be a cool down on it so that lights that run arround with them can't run around with them on all the time. the total time an ECM can be on is 60 seconds with a 1:3 cool down ratio (1 second of use=3 seconds of cool down) that might be a bit to harsh but you get the point. Another thing is that the two modes whuold have more varation to make then more strategic. I think disrupt modes should disrupt enermy sensors and targeting systems (cloak) and counter mode would be to counter enermy weapon systems (LRMs) and other ECM but would reveal itself to the enemy radar. If a PPC is hit then the cool down mechanic is activated.

Classes of mechs feel the same these days. The assults are designed for brawling, heavy for long range fire support (LRM, sniping), mediums for harssing and lights for scouting. Assults are too vulnerable these days, they feel like a very big and clumberson medium. This is due to the increase in players which greatly increased the fire power these days. They need more armour and less manuvrability to be more feared when encountering it in close quarters.. Because of this MWO is turning into COD very slowly. Possibly a bit more HP for the interior as well.

Back to LRMs. They used to be more fun to operate as they slow, in-accurate but hit hard. This meant that timing was everything, and you had to keep that lock until it hit the mech. Now, you fire it and it's there, no skill required. Tell me guys, do you prefer the nerfed LRMs in teh next patch or do you prefer the glorious slow, in-accurate and hard hitting LRMs, (I prefer the original LRMS :ph34r:). To add a layer of fun to the current LRMs, maybe adding a targeting system on the map. You open you map and select where you want the LRMs to land. The more LRM the larger the area of effect. But there's a catch. When you fire your mech takes a while to calculate the the point of impact, then fires. The mech is imoblie until all missiles have fired. To add a new mechanic to the original LRMS, where the more missiles firing at the same time requries adds to the locking time. It makes sense in a way.

I think I said enough. Let me know what you think of these machincs and suggest you own. PGI, I would like to hear your thoughts sespecially, we are trying help you make this game better but we don't know what you guys think of our suggestions please reply. You are making this game for everyone.

Thanks for you time

Edited by darrencheesecake, 31 March 2014 - 01:54 AM.


#2 darrencheesecake

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 12:19 AM

just to add the LRM mechanic. all mechs would be able to see where the missiles land. And you select the LRMS firing in the battlegrid, say you want your LRM 20 here your LRM 10 here, then click fire. Say if one was to fire all of there LRMs to the one spot would this stack lots of LRMs in the one spot, no, it the mechanic would spread all LRMs over an area and increases as the number of LRMs fired increases. Hopefully this makes sense.

#3 darrencheesecake

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 12:43 AM

Have you guys ever being hit by an AC then your screen spazs out in an atlas. Then you go into a light and notice that screen seems to spaz out the same amount (tha's if you get hit). Itjust doesn't feel right, if your in an assult there needs to be less damage recoil compared to a heavy, medium and light. But making assults have the most resistance to this damage recoil and lights having no resistance at all would help define all classes of mechs.

#4 Onmyoudo

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 12:56 AM

All of these are common complaints, although screen shake differences is very minor. With regards to your opinion that all weapons are fine bar LRMs, do you think that for pulse lasers? Small lasers? Obviously we don't know where we are with SRMs due to the borked hit reg.

#5 darrencheesecake

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 01:54 AM

all pulse lasers are fine, small lasers are only useful for lights and some mediums, there useless to all other mechs thow.

#6 Onmyoudo

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 03:54 AM

Do you see pulse lasers frequently? Do you use them yourself?

#7 Joseph Mallan

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 03:58 AM

View PostOnmyoudo, on 31 March 2014 - 03:54 AM, said:

Do you see pulse lasers frequently? Do you use them yourself?

Only time I used Pulse was when I was playing Clanners. the lack of range on TT turned me off of using them... and still does here as well.

#8 ColonelMetus

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 04:05 AM

small is a really good for boating SMA lol la as the iPhone I didn't ask for message well as your stupid voice chat features

#9 SnagaDance

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 04:09 AM

You lost me when you claimed Light were 'easy mode'. From then on it really seemed your whole point was more like "Wah, I want my assaults to be better and do everything the bestest.".

#10 Davers

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 07:04 AM

View PostSnagaDance, on 31 March 2014 - 04:09 AM, said:

You lost me when you claimed Light were 'easy mode'. From then on it really seemed your whole point was more like "Wah, I want my assaults to be better and do everything the bestest.".

Aren't most posts like this? How many medium mech pilots are complaining about 'OP LRMs'? You never hear 'A light mech should never be able to take down a medium'; it's alway about assaults. Some players seem to feel that assualts should not only be the biggest mechs, they should be the BEST mechs and it should require a whole lance of 'lesser' mechs to take one down. And the assault should take out 3 and cripple the fourth.

#11 Ordellus

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 07:29 AM

View PostSnagaDance, on 31 March 2014 - 04:09 AM, said:

You lost me when you claimed Light were 'easy mode'. From then on it really seemed your whole point was more like "Wah, I want my assaults to be better and do everything the bestest.".


You lost me the second I realized you would rather ignore glaring problems that turn the game into a poo of it's potential glory, rather than step out of your "I win b/c I'm in a light mech" mindset

#12 Joseph Mallan

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 08:38 AM

View PostOrdellus, on 31 March 2014 - 07:29 AM, said:


You lost me the second I realized you would rather ignore glaring problems that turn the game into a poo of it's potential glory, rather than step out of your "I win b/c I'm in a light mech" mindset

I lose cause I am in a Light Mech!

#13 Kommisar

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 09:21 AM

So... lights get behind you, out flanking you without being seen, and then proceed to hammer your thin rear armor.

Buddy, just join the Clans already. That way you can go play honor duels for the right to use someone's last name or what-not in crazy, moronic "Stand & Deliver", Queen's Rules fights. They say we will have private matches in the next month; so you can hold out and live the dream there. Heck, you can even do mech bowing and pre-combat katas for honor before shooting each other in the front at 200 meters like honorable gentlemen Mechwarriors.

Just like the historical battles of yore where brave Sherman tank commanders would slowly drive up to the front plate of German Panther and Tiger tanks to gloriously trade shots to one another after wine and cheese were served.

If you remain in the regular public drops, however, you will have to learn to accept that other players will be trying to kill your mech in ways that use their advantages against your disadvantages. You know, combat and warfare. I typically (mostly) pilot either an Assault mech or a Light mech. I know the advantages and disadvantages of both and how to use them both ways. You HAVE to expect a light striker to try and flank you to get your rear armor. It's his best chance of beating a mech that carries 50 plus tons of extra firepower and armor. AND, you have to expect him to run as soon as you start turning to face him and not let you shoot him in the face.

Calling it "easy mode" is just silly. If it is, get in your Spider and go roll some Stalkers. What? Not your play style? Ohhh. But I thought this light mech thing was "easy mode"; meaning anyone could do it without trying? As a guy that has and can take on assaults in my lights, let me share something with you: It's not easy-mode. It's tough. You have to make tactical decisions at a rate far faster than that of slower assault mechs. You have to weigh the risk-reward of each decision quickly knowing that making the wrong choice could leave you open to a full on alpha strike that is capable of ripping your mech clean in half. You can snipe, but with only a fraction of the firepower of a heavy or assault sniper. One or two ER larges. Maybe 2 PPCs if you cut your engine down and stripped some armor. Or me, running a Raven with 2x AC/2s.

I'm not going to say it's the greatest challenge in the game. Some times you get really lucky and find a Stalker or Atlas with near zero situational awareness that will just sit there will you get off 3 or 4 shots into his back before he reacts. But it's not just click and win either. Most of the time, those assaults notice you and start adjusting to your presence. And then your moving and dodging. Then your using that learned internal clock in your brain that is keeping rough track of the cool down times of their big weapons so you can jink right when that PPC or AC/20 cycles up. Using the terrain around you to limit their shots. And making darn sure all the guys shooting at you don't get straight on shots they don't really have to lead.

Hit reg issues do exist. But lights don't have the free pass they once did. Give it a go, master through the Spiders and then come back and let us know just how Easy-Mode it is. Or, better yet, get that Raven out there and show us by topping the leader board in the next weekend competition. You know, the one's that normally have Highlanders and Victors in the top tier.

Edited by Kommisar, 01 April 2014 - 09:22 AM.


#14 Ordellus

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 09:21 AM

View PostJoseph Mallan, on 01 April 2014 - 08:38 AM, said:

I lose cause I am in a Light Mech!


-.-

#15 Joseph Mallan

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 09:24 AM

Truth Ord. I am no a good light pilot an no mater how OP someone has said X Light is, I die and die and die some more! I only bought a Sara cause f the meaning behind the Mech. and the fact that when I do pilot it I get the giggles. :)

#16 Ordellus

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 09:33 AM

View PostKommisar, on 01 April 2014 - 09:21 AM, said:

So... lights get behind you, out flanking you without being seen, and then proceed to hammer your thin rear armor.


That's all well and good....

Until I turn around and hammer back with a alpha of lasers, or srms, or whatever weapon I happen to be using.... and they laugh and run off.... which is the problem.

Sure they're hard to hit and that's all good.... but since so much of their "tank" is based on speed, they shouldn't survive once they're actually hit.

Which they do.
Far more than they should.
Which is why the OP is angry, and justly so.

View PostKommisar, on 01 April 2014 - 09:21 AM, said:

Calling it "easy mode" is just silly. If it is, get in your Spider and go roll some Stalkers. What? Not your play style? Ohhh. But I thought this light mech thing was "easy mode"; meaning anyone could do it without trying? As a guy that has and can take on assaults in my lights, let me share something with you: It's not easy-mode. It's tough. You have to make tactical decisions at a rate far faster than that of slower assault mechs. You have to weigh the risk-reward of each decision quickly knowing that making the wrong choice could leave you open to a full on alpha strike that is capable of ripping your mech clean in half. You can snipe, but with only a fraction of the firepower of a heavy or assault sniper. One or two ER larges. Maybe 2 PPCs if you cut your engine down and stripped some armor. Or me, running a Raven with 2x AC/2s.


It is easy mode.

And sometimes I do hop in light mechs and proceed to dance through the entire enemy team with 6 or 7 guys spending thousands of damage worth of firepower to kill me.....only to laugh and run off having effectively been an immortal tank.

Not so much on weighing each decision. In a light you can screw up constantly b/c your profile + speed makes it easy to get away. Walk around the wrong corner too fast in an atlas, you're dead in seconds. Walk around the wrong corner in a spider.... you jump at the surprise of seeing half the team.... the jump jet or sprint off.

Oh the sniping, gotta love abusing the invisibility that ECM gives the lights. Especially since their profile is so small that at 1000+ meters most players can't actually see them on the screen.....

So they can pop out, fire off two lasers and then get back behind cover while enemies are just beginning to look in the direction they got shot from.

Oh but the light is fast and can reposition effortlessly, all while keeping the distance they choose, and being immune to targets b/c of the ecm.

Rinse, repeat, lights are OP.

Did I say they can kill 5 mechs and dance on their graves 1 v 1 while standing still. No.

Do they survive 100X longer in a firefight than they should, with firepower going both ways. Hell to the yes.

Anyone that disagrees just doesn't want the easy mode taken away.

#17 Kommisar

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 09:49 AM

Anyone that disagrees just doesn't want the easy mode taken away.

I find that statement utterly and hilariously ironic given your sig:

1) You thinking that you understand logic does not mean you do.

Awesome.

So, riddle me this: If lights are so powerful and EZ-Mode; why are they not ruling the meta right now? Why don't I see the guys that consistently rank in whatever competition or challenge PGI runs driving these OP lights?

#18 sokitumi

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 09:54 AM

View PostOnmyoudo, on 31 March 2014 - 03:54 AM, said:

Do you see pulse lasers frequently? Do you use them yourself?

I use them on my med mechs. Less hitscan lets them punch through quite well - and they mix ok with ML. I fear if they got a 'typical' buff from team awesome they'd be ridiculously OP. Could they lose a little heat? Yeah. Could they not stack with LL in this rotarded ghost heat mechanic? Definitely. But if they upped the damage or the range much more on LPL it would be a bad thing.

View PostKommisar, on 01 April 2014 - 09:49 AM, said:

So, riddle me this: If lights are so powerful and EZ-Mode; why are they not ruling the meta right now? Why don't I see the guys that consistently rank in whatever competition or challenge PGI runs driving these OP lights?

There's a reason so many games end in chase-the-sdr. It has to do with people not bothering to shoot at them bc they know it's mostly a waste of ammo and futile. And it has to do with full alpha's that do hit barely scratching their paint. Personally I think tiny hitboxes going at 130kph+ is just beyond the capabilities of the engine and/or way it's coded.

Edited by sokitumi, 01 April 2014 - 09:59 AM.


#19 Mirkk Defwode

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 09:55 AM

View PostOrdellus, on 01 April 2014 - 09:33 AM, said:

Oh but the light is fast and can reposition effortlessly, all while keeping the distance they choose, and being immune to targets b/c of the ecm.

Rinse, repeat, lights are OP.

Did I say they can kill 5 mechs and dance on their graves 1 v 1 while standing still. No.

Do they survive 100X longer in a firefight than they should, with firepower going both ways. Hell to the yes.

Anyone that disagrees just doesn't want the easy mode taken away.


Have you tried a Locust lately? Cause they're really hit and miss when it comes to feeling strong. It was exceptionally rare for me to get a kill with a Locust, and I'd do light damage across a bunch of mechs.

Hell the only Locust version I even felt like I was doing reasonable damage in was a LCT-3M which has the nice Medium Laser with 2 SSRM2's. Then the only things I really could kill in a fight were other Mediums or the Cicada cause it has paper thin armor and effectively is a super Jenner.

Then you throw in the AMS changes and I have to hump a leg to get any of the SSRMs to hit, seriously...from max range for the SSRM I watched all 4 missiles get taken out by a single AMS without hitting the intended target. I've even got that game recorded.

Now while piloting bigger stuff I do find the lights annoying, and I do think they're a little scary to fight, and I have shot some where it felt like they should've gone down and stayed down after being hit like that.

#20 Joseph Mallan

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 09:59 AM

View PostOrdellus, on 01 April 2014 - 09:33 AM, said:

Do they survive 100X longer in a firefight than they should, with firepower going both ways. Hell to the yes.

Anyone that disagrees just doesn't want the easy mode taken away.

Only when a good pilot is in them do Lights live an insane length of time in a fire fight. I have seen the difference the pilot makes from both sides of the Assault Mech.





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