11 replies to this topic

[Spawnsalot]

I know this has been done to death in the forums but I'm going to say it again anyway.

This is levelled mostly at PPCs and Auto-cannons, I think Lasers and LRMs are in a good place at the moment, SRMs... well let's get back to them once the hit registration is dealt with...

I've seen these ideas floated round the forums before but never (please correct me if I'm wrong) together:

Make PPCs spread their damage over several adjacent components perhaps with 5 points of damage on the targeted component with a total of 5 points damage spread over other components and make Auto-cannons burst-fire.

Ideally with the weapons producing recoil so that if you want to concentrate fire with an Auto-cannon you're going to have to compensate for the recoil, maybe multiple PPC hits in a short space of time creating some kind of electronic interference effect for the victim - affecting the HUD, ghost heat could be toned down a smidge and make damage drop-off after all weapons effective ranges much more severe.

This means people can still deal damage at range but you aren't going to evaporate a component in one or two volleys, increasing time-to-kill making for more interesting matches with less frustration and cementing the Gauss rifle as the go-to weapon for long-range pinpoint damage, though I would keep the charge-up for it and maybe add a noticeable audio-prompt when the rifle is fully charged.

What do people think?

Yes? No? My God, you're sexy Spawnsalot?

[Thorqemada]

Old...

[Spawnsalot]

Thank you for your valuable contribution, I'm sure a lot of thought and effort went into typing those six characters about a topic you aren't interested in discussing.

[Karl Streiger]

Oh he is interested in discussing this... .the problem is - this ideas where placed a hundred times - hell even before MWO made it into the Alpha - there was a discussion about the "bane" of pin point weapons.

What you describe is simple back to Closed Beta status... PPC with kind of splash damage - ACs didn't had a recoil but a short period of time before the shoot was "released" - and of course you had another "convergence" mechanic.... i guess 90% of the current AC 2 - AC 5 / PPC spammers won't hit a barn when - PGI would "patched" the Closed Beta version

So - this discussion is old - the Devs didn't care - any additional discussion will only bring the same arguments.... sry for that

[Bobzilla]

Idealy they need to raise the heat on ac's. Running cooler is their advantage over ammo-less energy weapons, but the heat on ac's (not the 2) is so negligable it doesn't affect them. So they end up doing pinpont damage faster, at better range, for a longer period of time vs energy weapons. I feel they should make them do either faster dps or longer sustained dps, not both (sustained burst dps?), espically when you consider they do pinpont.

Edited by Bobzilla, 08 April 2014 - 04:54 AM.

[Karl Streiger]

or you simple kill extensive ammunition use
No mech is allowed to have more as 3t of ammunition for a single weapon system.

You can still do extreme strong burst damage - but you ran faster dry as i need to type those words.

Edited by Karl Streiger, 08 April 2014 - 05:01 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Spawnsalot, on 08 April 2014 - 02:52 AM, said:

Yes? No? My God, you're sexy Spawnsalot?

Yeah.... About that...

[Spawnsalot]

Joseph Mallan, on 08 April 2014 - 05:02 AM, said:

Yeah.... About that...

[Joseph Mallan]

+1 Fantastic!

[Spawnsalot]

Bobzilla, on 08 April 2014 - 04:52 AM, said:

Idealy they need to raise the heat on ac's. Running cooler is their advantage over ammo-less energy weapons, but the heat on ac's (not the 2) is so negligable it doesn't affect them. So they end up doing pinpont damage faster, at better range, for a longer period of time vs energy weapons. I feel they should make them do either faster dps or longer sustained dps, not both (sustained burst dps?), espically when you consider they do pinpont.

They could do with a slight tweak in the heat department but not much, because as you say they're supposed to be the much cooler but ammo dependant alternative to energy weapons and if they generate too much heat per shot then people are going to drift towards their much lighter, smaller energy counter-parts and just pile on heatsinks, the pin-point issue would hopefully be alleviated by the addition of recoil to the weapons.

Karl Streiger, on 08 April 2014 - 05:00 AM, said:

or you simple kill extensive ammunition use
No mech is allowed to have more as 3t of ammunition for a single weapon system.

You can still do extreme strong burst damage - but you ran faster dry as i need to type those words.

Do you mean per equipped weapon or per weapon type? If I 3 AC/2s and I've only got 3 tons of ammo I'm going to chew through that before I've made much of a dent in anything, It wouldn't be worth taking an ammo based weapon if you can only a low amount of ammo - a mech with, let's say, 2xLRM15 would only have 18 salvos before running dry.

The extreme burst comes from the damage being front-loaded and focussed on a single component - if the weapon delivered its damage over .75-1 sec with noticeable recoil then the victim has the chance to mitigate some damage through moving, but a skilled AC user would also have the chance to control the recoil and try and put more round on the same component. Would that be an acceptable alternative?

[Bobzilla]

Spawnsalot, on 08 April 2014 - 06:27 AM, said:

They could do with a slight tweak in the heat department but not much, because as you say they're supposed to be the much cooler but ammo dependant alternative to energy weapons and if they generate too much heat per shot then people are going to drift towards their much lighter, smaller energy counter-parts and just pile on heatsinks, the pin-point issue would hopefully be alleviated by the addition of recoil to the weapons.

That is the point, people moving away from ballistics because they are on equal grounds with energy weapons. 2 weapons that are equal, the choice would be personal preference.

To gain the DPS of an AC10, you need 2 LL's. 2 LL's create 3.3 hps. Even with the extra tons going to hs, heat will be a factor that limits DPS further with the LL's where as an ac10 will be unaffected.

[Karl Streiger]

Spawnsalot, on 08 April 2014 - 06:27 AM, said:

Do you mean per equipped weapon or per weapon type? If I 3 AC/2s and I've only got 3 tons of ammo I'm going to chew through that before I've made much of a dent in anything, It wouldn't be worth taking an ammo based weapon if you can only a low amount of ammo - a mech with, let's say, 2xLRM15 would only have 18 salvos before running dry.

Yes this is exactly what i mean.
You are affraid that your tripple Small ACs eat through 3tons of ammunition in less than 30seconds? Simple fix: don't use tripple ACs take for example 2 Large Laser an a single AC 2 or 2 AC 2 and a Large Laser....
Because I have 3tons of ammunition on my AC20s, AC10 and Gauss builds....

But you have made a valid point - 2 LRM 15 also have in lore from time to time 4tons of ammunition to support that weapon. So what about Ghost Ammo: the first weapon of a kind can be supported by 3tons of ammunition and each additional weapon gives you 1ton of additional ammo load - in this case the tripple SAC support build (Anit Air, Anti Tank, Anti Infantry, Siege) can have 5tons of ammunition.

Well 4tons of ammunition for 2 weapons are more as enough - and if you start yelling but we have doubled armor - i can only say .- interesting so your shots hit the target at random pattern?