TWO Troll Warrior Online the game keeps on trolling; just as soon as you think you've got a good build "TROLL" it garbage and once again your grinding to get those C-bills to repurchase the weapons that were nerfed last patch but buffed in this latest one. Not enough time to grind and get those weapons back? Just pay us some green so we can do it AGAIN!!!
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67 replies to this topic
#62
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- Civil Servant
- 5,154 posts
Member
Posted 17 April 2014 - 01:05 PM
Balance could happen once certain things are clearly defined.
IMO, first we need to clarify what goals are of people posting. In a non-insulting manner, I believe some groups can be clarified.
Group Call of MechWarrior (CoMW)
This group like to promote frontloaded damage, ACs & PPCs, possibly poptarts. LRMs are seen as 'support' weapons, LBX, MGs and Flamers as 'trash tier,' SRMs and Lasers are 'easy mode.' Their goal is to promote balance with the end result being only 'skill' based weapons (skill = only weapons involving aim and frontloaded damage) should be good just like in other shooters such as Call of Duty (hence the group name).
Group LORE
Wants something resembling the Lore of CBT. Usually likes to promote similarities to TT though might be forgiving if something is dissimilar, still less so than others. Example, weapon balance should be one where all weapons have usage that you will see a variety in matches instead of some problems we still have today (Flamers anyone?). Wants fair matches though selling the idea of a 1 on 1 duel between a Spider-5K and a Victor-9S as a fair fight might be pushing it.
Group Closed Beta (CB)
Participated in it, heard a bunch of promises, has not seen them delived. Lack of CB goal achievement affects their behavior in game and on forums.
Group Not One Penny More (NOPE)
Tired of not getting what they want, has vowed to spend no more money on the game until some measure of goals are accomplished.
Group Shut-Up-and-Take-My-Money (SUTMM)
Doesn't care much about a lot of things, has some fun playing and is willing to pay for it. Found in lots of MMO and similar games.
Group I-Want-It-All-For-Free (IWAFF)
Also found in a lot of MMOs especially those advertising the ability of F2P in some form. Never wants to pay for a damn thing, all posts reflect this. Might have some opinions on certain subjects but always wants the free stuff.
Group Politics
Found in a lot of games going back before Internet and computer based ones. Always likes to use words, persuasion, etc. to cause division and stir the pot for a variety of reasons, cares less about balance than social effects of their actions. Usually causes 'sides' to form like a political discussion.
Group Anti-Politics
Found in a lot of games going back before Internet and computer based ones. Sick of the previous group, knows how to spot them, sometimes works against them, other times leaves to find a game Group Politics is not currently playing in.
Probably other groups I have not covered but once you know which one or more groups you are and others are, you get a better understanding of how balance can be difficult given the variety of goals in people within a gaming community.
Yes, it is possible to be in more than one group.
Any company will accept they cannot please everyone but they do have to try and please some, with conflicting player goals, where does the company go? Thus the balance problem simplified through understanding of social group types within a gaming community contributing to what they perceive as balance.
IMO, first we need to clarify what goals are of people posting. In a non-insulting manner, I believe some groups can be clarified.
Group Call of MechWarrior (CoMW)
This group like to promote frontloaded damage, ACs & PPCs, possibly poptarts. LRMs are seen as 'support' weapons, LBX, MGs and Flamers as 'trash tier,' SRMs and Lasers are 'easy mode.' Their goal is to promote balance with the end result being only 'skill' based weapons (skill = only weapons involving aim and frontloaded damage) should be good just like in other shooters such as Call of Duty (hence the group name).
Group LORE
Wants something resembling the Lore of CBT. Usually likes to promote similarities to TT though might be forgiving if something is dissimilar, still less so than others. Example, weapon balance should be one where all weapons have usage that you will see a variety in matches instead of some problems we still have today (Flamers anyone?). Wants fair matches though selling the idea of a 1 on 1 duel between a Spider-5K and a Victor-9S as a fair fight might be pushing it.
Group Closed Beta (CB)
Participated in it, heard a bunch of promises, has not seen them delived. Lack of CB goal achievement affects their behavior in game and on forums.
Group Not One Penny More (NOPE)
Tired of not getting what they want, has vowed to spend no more money on the game until some measure of goals are accomplished.
Group Shut-Up-and-Take-My-Money (SUTMM)
Doesn't care much about a lot of things, has some fun playing and is willing to pay for it. Found in lots of MMO and similar games.
Group I-Want-It-All-For-Free (IWAFF)
Also found in a lot of MMOs especially those advertising the ability of F2P in some form. Never wants to pay for a damn thing, all posts reflect this. Might have some opinions on certain subjects but always wants the free stuff.
Group Politics
Found in a lot of games going back before Internet and computer based ones. Always likes to use words, persuasion, etc. to cause division and stir the pot for a variety of reasons, cares less about balance than social effects of their actions. Usually causes 'sides' to form like a political discussion.
Group Anti-Politics
Found in a lot of games going back before Internet and computer based ones. Sick of the previous group, knows how to spot them, sometimes works against them, other times leaves to find a game Group Politics is not currently playing in.
Probably other groups I have not covered but once you know which one or more groups you are and others are, you get a better understanding of how balance can be difficult given the variety of goals in people within a gaming community.
Yes, it is possible to be in more than one group.
Any company will accept they cannot please everyone but they do have to try and please some, with conflicting player goals, where does the company go? Thus the balance problem simplified through understanding of social group types within a gaming community contributing to what they perceive as balance.
#63
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- Liquid Metal
- 765 posts
Member
Posted 17 April 2014 - 04:21 PM
(IWAFF) appears to have a monopoly on the game right now.The way AC/ are getting nerfted I'd say (CoMW) is losing badly.
As a side note I like ACs and am kind of repulsed by their actions and planned actions in canning them however I absolutly hate the fast paced status of COD. Now rather than helping other weapons like they did the LRM in the patch before they just utterly destroyed a weapon to make it balanced with all the other garbage. Garbage is garbage whether its surrounded by garbage or not.
1. Buff other weapons and quit nerfing stuff into garbage. Because not many people want to buy garbage.
2. Make your bloody matchmaker work! New players should not drop with or against people who have WLRs of 3/1 after they've played 2000 matches!
3. Map terrain needs to have better / more obvious variation. These maps where 3/4s of the map is inaccessible to mechs cause of arrow storms (LRMs) is ridiculous! The only "safe" spot on crimson is the tunnel and in HPG LRMs can even be fired UNDERNEATH the blasted central hub!
I know "Oh whine whine whine, this guys just angry that he's been killed by LRMs!", (insert vulgar insult here) no I've done better damage and gotten more kills with LRMs than a lot of other weapons systems I use and I already hated LRMs with thier dishonorable - don't even look at your enemy as you defeat them - crap. There are even structures on urban maps that stop ballistics but not missiles.... HSR cough cough.
If you look at MW4 the skyscrapers made mechs look tiny so why the heck are these ones so small... Hmm so lights can jump up them and so missiles can fly over them. Part of what makes weapons so leathal is skill yes but also... terrain, terrain, terrain. And when all the maps are generally the same layout of course the same lasted weapons are going to be used! Hmph half the maps you can shoot across with gauss and make someone shimmy into hiding (in their own blasted spawn). I can plink people who are still leaving their spawn in Tourmaline Desert and that's a "large" map!Complaining about weapon's balance is pointless if everything is broken.
Map Terrain = Broken
Map Variance = Broken
Map Size = Elephants in a jar.
Hit Detection = Broken
Match-Maker = Broken
MWO Patcher = Half Broken
UI 2.0 = ??? This is a UI?
Weapons Balance = Broken
Alignment with Lore = Name only
House importance = Laughable
Confidence in Devs = Missing from Vocabulary
Mech uniqueness = Broken / Bland
Tactics / Strategy = Non-Existent - If this was the true they'd been wiped out.
AI / PVE - Non-exsistent - New players can't hone their skills on something that's not going to go all battle squirrel on them!
Testing grounds - No AI so how the bally heck can you actually test your mech's performance if you're shooting cardboard boxes that just sit there!
MC purchasing system - Online - Hmmm well this works!
As a side note I like ACs and am kind of repulsed by their actions and planned actions in canning them however I absolutly hate the fast paced status of COD. Now rather than helping other weapons like they did the LRM in the patch before they just utterly destroyed a weapon to make it balanced with all the other garbage. Garbage is garbage whether its surrounded by garbage or not.
1. Buff other weapons and quit nerfing stuff into garbage. Because not many people want to buy garbage.
2. Make your bloody matchmaker work! New players should not drop with or against people who have WLRs of 3/1 after they've played 2000 matches!
3. Map terrain needs to have better / more obvious variation. These maps where 3/4s of the map is inaccessible to mechs cause of arrow storms (LRMs) is ridiculous! The only "safe" spot on crimson is the tunnel and in HPG LRMs can even be fired UNDERNEATH the blasted central hub!
I know "Oh whine whine whine, this guys just angry that he's been killed by LRMs!", (insert vulgar insult here) no I've done better damage and gotten more kills with LRMs than a lot of other weapons systems I use and I already hated LRMs with thier dishonorable - don't even look at your enemy as you defeat them - crap. There are even structures on urban maps that stop ballistics but not missiles.... HSR cough cough.
If you look at MW4 the skyscrapers made mechs look tiny so why the heck are these ones so small... Hmm so lights can jump up them and so missiles can fly over them. Part of what makes weapons so leathal is skill yes but also... terrain, terrain, terrain. And when all the maps are generally the same layout of course the same lasted weapons are going to be used! Hmph half the maps you can shoot across with gauss and make someone shimmy into hiding (in their own blasted spawn). I can plink people who are still leaving their spawn in Tourmaline Desert and that's a "large" map!Complaining about weapon's balance is pointless if everything is broken.
Map Terrain = Broken
Map Variance = Broken
Map Size = Elephants in a jar.
Hit Detection = Broken
Match-Maker = Broken
MWO Patcher = Half Broken
UI 2.0 = ??? This is a UI?
Weapons Balance = Broken
Alignment with Lore = Name only
House importance = Laughable
Confidence in Devs = Missing from Vocabulary
Mech uniqueness = Broken / Bland
Tactics / Strategy = Non-Existent - If this was the true they'd been wiped out.
AI / PVE - Non-exsistent - New players can't hone their skills on something that's not going to go all battle squirrel on them!
Testing grounds - No AI so how the bally heck can you actually test your mech's performance if you're shooting cardboard boxes that just sit there!
MC purchasing system - Online - Hmmm well this works!
Edited by Graugger, 17 April 2014 - 04:23 PM.
#64
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- The Blood Bound
- 1,466 posts
Member
- LocationLegendary Founder, Masakari Collector, Man-O-War Collector, Wrath Collector, Gladiator Collector, Mauler Collector
Posted 17 April 2014 - 04:31 PM
Aurien Titus, on 16 April 2014 - 11:36 PM, said:
The problem has never been lack of skill on a players part. It's always been a lack of communication, in particular, the lack of VOIP. As I've always said, back in closed beta me and 7 random people could roll pugs all night.
This is the truth. "If" the communication was solid per a team/lance, this game would play more strategic and badass... Nobody (almost nobody) reads chat. Its just to hard to get people to work together when you have to fight and avoid Gauss, LRMs and AC20 rounds at the same time. Push to talk is the answer....
#65
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- Liquid Metal
- 765 posts
Member
Posted 17 April 2014 - 07:42 PM
They were considering VOIP last I checked but you'd have to have active premium time to use it 
#66
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- The Ironclad
- 1,099 posts
Member
- LocationUSA
Posted 17 April 2014 - 09:17 PM
You see, so far everyone is missing the point.
It's not the weapons.
It's pilot error.
It's not the weapons.
It's pilot error.
#68
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- Survivor
- 841 posts
Member
Posted 17 April 2014 - 11:39 PM
Xmith, on 17 April 2014 - 09:17 PM, said:
You see, so far everyone is missing the point.
It's not the weapons.
It's pilot error.
It's not the weapons.
It's pilot error.
That's providing they're balanced, dude... That's providing that they are well within the Risk and Reward balance.
Any pilot can get good results on a weapon that's over powered.
Sometimes it IS pilots problem, and other times it isn't. People like you think that if you can do it then it must be fine but I dare say replicate your results over 50 matches with variations in each environment, then get the numbers, then come back and say its pilot error.
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