127 replies to this topic

[maniacos]

kamiko kross, on 22 April 2014 - 09:48 AM, said:

It could also be two factors, and before I continue I'm NOT directing this directly at you, ok?
#1 People tend to think they are better than they are. I do it, you do it-we all do it. When you lose because of this tendency people tend to look outside of themselves. It could quite easily be true however but just as likely not.

I think of myself that I am not the best pilot, I need quite a wile to learn a mech (thats why I also aim for mastering one and not being half-good at 10 different mechs). However when there are 12 random people in a team its quite impossible even for the worst pilot to lose all games.

Quote

#2 People usually tend to only remember negative experiences. They remember those 5 losses but forget that epic game they has 2 days ago.

Well, OP at least posted a whole row of bad matches and it just mirrors what others experienced too. When I lose 70 of 100 games after a few weeks, something is wrong with the match maker.

Edited by Jherej, 22 April 2014 - 10:11 AM.

[Malcolm Vordermark]

Jherej, on 22 April 2014 - 10:11 AM, said:

Well, OP at least posted a whole row of bad matches and it just mirrors what others experienced too. When I lose 70 of 100 games after a few weeks, something is wrong with the match maker.

Are those numbers coming from your stats page here on the website?

[Barkem Squirrel]

I have had days where it seemed all the games I was in were wins, or very close losses 10-12, 11-12.

Then, there are days where I just can not get on a winning team. Those I just stop playing for an hour, come back and see.


One thing I have found, use the chat to talk with the other lances. It really helps. One time on Alpine we fell back and just chatted for about 4 minutes. This in of itself spread the other team out When we came out from behind the hill in our little death ball, 4 mechs fell from the other team. Also the other team not making contact with us also drives people nuts and allows you to cull one or two inpatient opponents easily.


Next week I think the 3/3/3/3 rule comes out and we will have to talk about this again.

Edited by Barkem Squirrel, 22 April 2014 - 10:23 AM.

[Koniving]

Shar Wolf, on 22 April 2014 - 10:01 AM, said:

Actually, it isn't.

When you start (your trial period) you are several hundred Elo points below center - and they track (but do not apply) those changes during the trial period.
After the trial period you are then modified - and while you are near center, you are far more likely to still be below center.
Not dead center.

As Shar said. Though it's more than a few hundred from 'center.'
You actually start at tier 2 but on the borderline edge of tier 1 on this list. Specifically somewhere in the 1,100 to 1,250 range. Can't seem to find the specific post stating that though.

Source of image.

This is the "bell curve." The 'higher' the shading goes the more improved 'weight balancing' is within it. Or so I gathered from the source.

Source. Note this is pretty old.
Info on the current match maker (that's about to be changed away from in favor of 3/3/3/3).

Currently MWO is set to "1400" as its variable searching range for players. So if it targets a specific average, it can pull players from -700 to +700 of that range to throw players in (is what I gathered but could be wrong). Range found here.

[Harathan]

Koniving, on 22 April 2014 - 10:03 AM, said:

The upcoming 3/3/3/3 system is supposed to assist in removing more random elements. To me, this kills the tactics of the game even further.

I'm just curious as to why you think that'll be the case. Feel free to link me to another thread if you've already had this discussion.

[Koniving]

Harathan, on 22 April 2014 - 10:27 AM, said:

I'm just curious as to why you think that'll be the case. Feel free to link me to another thread if you've already had this discussion.

Signature, "What 3/3/3/3 cost us."
Also relevant, watch before you go there. The merc units, logistics, dropships, etc.

Also relevant.
Rolewarfare. Dev Blog 3. Dev Blog 4. <--completely alienated once "class"-based match making and R&R removal came into play. (Example: Purpose of scouting for the entire match turned to only being a scout for the first minute, turned to no need to scout; enemy is always dead center of the map. Fire support, (direct fire) role no longer has a genuine purpose or active role. Defenders have no reason to or desire to defend; purpose completely lost with game mode changes universally favoring total annihilation above anything else. List goes on.)

We were supposed to get a global tonnage-based limit to remove the need for class-based match making. Example, 800 tons. 12 players, 800 tons divided between them. Lots of lights and mediums there, very few heavies and fewer assaults. Instead of a tactical game with diverse elements and strategies to overcome, we will get "perfectly even classes" with maybe 5 to 6 different but similar strategies instead of hundreds of truly unique strategies. This ultimately defeats the entire notion of diverse role warfare based combat with unknown elements and enemy compositions.

Edited by Koniving, 22 April 2014 - 10:42 AM.

[Harathan]

Fair enough. I wasn't suggesting you were incorrect, merely asking for clarification.The threads in your signature should be required reading, as far as I'm concerned.

[Koniving]

Thank you, and sorry for the repeat quotes -- it happens every time something is edited or added. I didn't actually think I could find the Dev Blogs (there is no actual way to get to them. Seriously. They're essentially erased with no links to those specific posts that could be found through normal browsing). So when I did I got a bit excited and went on to add them, was gonna list a lot more points but decided to summarize it (and ultimately removed half of what I was gonna say as it just turned from expanding to an upset rant).

I was genuinely looking forward to that, and well all I can do is wait and hope that unlike what some claims have been (as no one has any 'proof' so far), that 3/3/3/3 will be for public match making (aka faction-based warfare), while the merc unit (and faction-allied 'special forces') warfare will still have that described system with global tonnage limits set by the dropship, garrison forces to defend planets where what you have is based on what you set up, and resupplies and R&R restored and all that jazz we're supposed to see.

This is, after all, described as "the thinking person's shooter," but it hasn't actually been that way since the month after R&R got removed and the fears of it quickly returning disappeared. That's when balance, rolewarfare, etc. went seriously downhill (as soon everyone picked up endo steel, stopped using ferro, slapped in DHS for every mech, got XL engines, etc).

Edited by Koniving, 22 April 2014 - 11:32 AM.

[Amsro]

Another Case of MWO's complete matchmaker failure.

ggclose

[BLOOD WOLF]

Amsro, on 22 April 2014 - 11:43 AM, said:

Another Case of MWO's complete matchmaker failure.

ggclose

yep, on the 29th, no more of this. The teams should be balanced enough as weight. Still curious on how the type of mechs will affect the MM

[AlmightyAeng]

BLOOD WOLF, on 22 April 2014 - 12:34 PM, said:

yep, on the 29th, no more of this. The teams should be balanced enough as weight. Still curious on how the type of mechs will affect the MM

As in their loadouts? Not at all.

[focuspark]

Onyxian, on 21 April 2014 - 05:14 AM, said:

I cannot use TS, too much RL around me. Kids, the tv is right next to the computer.

That shouldn't doom me. The game should be playable without HAVING to TS to have any success.

And I don't think you read closely... MY team had 9 assaults with 3DDCs. And we got slaughtered. Yeah, the one time I look at my team and think "Yes, finally a win". I can't remember the exact score, it was a couple weeks ago, but it was a stomp. 4-12 or worse.

Find a more senior person to team up with, doesn't matter who. You don't need voice chat, because that's the not the pointer. The logic is MM will average your values, pulling you out of the MM hell you're in.

Ghost Badger, on 22 April 2014 - 12:35 PM, said:

As in their loadouts? Not at all.

By weight class, and you understand the logic by only looking at weight class and not exact tonnage or loadout as well as anyone else, the devs have gone over this time and again.

[o0Marduk0o]

Onyxian, on 21 April 2014 - 05:37 AM, said:

That's exactly what I want to know. The other team is always always always better. Always.

Please look up your stats and tell me, how many wins and loses you have.

[BLOOD WOLF]

Ghost Badger, on 22 April 2014 - 12:35 PM, said:

As in their loadouts? Not at all.

It isn't always gonna find a perfect match. As with all technology it is flawed to a degree.

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 22 April 2014 - 12:39 PM.

[AlmightyAeng]

focuspark, on 22 April 2014 - 12:37 PM, said:

By weight class, and you understand the logic by only looking at weight class and not exact tonnage or loadout as well as anyone else, the devs have gone over this time and again.

Take a look at what I quoted from Bloodwolf. He referred to 'mech type' and how it affects MM. I was clarifying, because loadout won't.


By weight class, and you understand the logic by only looking at weight class and not exact tonnage or loadout as well as anyone else, the devs have gone over this time and again.

BLOOD WOLF, on 22 April 2014 - 12:39 PM, said:

It isn't always gonna find a perfect match. As with all technology it is flawed to a degree.

Yeah, they won't get exact tonnage matching. From what I recall, Paul or Russ said that if it can't find an exact match it'll go up or down 5 tons to find something in the same weight class.

Loadout isn't a factor.

[focuspark]

Ghost Badger, on 22 April 2014 - 12:40 PM, said:

Take a look at what I quoted from Bloodwolf...

Misunderstood your meaning, my apologies. Looks as though we agree :-)

[AlmightyAeng]

focuspark, on 22 April 2014 - 12:42 PM, said:

Misunderstood your meaning, my apologies. Looks as though we agree :-)

Takes a big man. Thanks for re-reading

[Amsro]

BLOOD WOLF, on 22 April 2014 - 12:34 PM, said:

yep, on the 29th, no more of this. The teams should be balanced enough as weight. Still curious on how the type of mechs will affect the MM

I hope you are right, truly!

[BLOOD WOLF]

Amsro, on 22 April 2014 - 12:45 PM, said:

I hope you are right, truly!

no more Assault family reunions on the map.

[Dan Nashe]

Corious what your overall win/loss is in profile-stats? I once called a coin flip wrong 11 times in a row!