76 replies to this topic

[Zookeeper Dan]

I know I'm not very good. But is it possible to be so bad you cause your team to loose 2-12?

Because that's what all weekend has been like for me.

I think my team has one once or twice in the 25 or so games I've played in the 2xp weekend.

I'm a medium pilot who gets 200 damage every other game and stays with my team mates. Not great, but I didn't think that was terrible. And it's not like I'm in an Atlas just waking into enemy fire.

Edited by Danth Reduviid, 08 March 2015 - 06:29 PM.

[RecklessFable]

Well, maybe, maybe not.

Most of my games lately have been very lopsided, but they'd generally gone both ways. I've won games with an assault disconnected, but also lost 12-0 with the other team short. There is usually a point in a match where a momet happens and the momentum swings.

That being said, 200 damage isn't that much for a medium. If you can consistently get near 300, you are a solid contributor.

[Silra]

Hehloes!

First thing to note: Damage is meaningless. If it is not converted into kills, it doesn't matter if you did 1 or 1000 points of damage. You can easily lose rounds in this game where you did over 1000 damage but because it wasn't converted into kills, the enemies were still able to destroy your team.

Second thing to note: Consistency. If you say you get 200 damage every other game, work into it so you get that 200 damage in every game. Then raise the bar, 250 damage every game, and so on while you're getting more comfortable with your mech and the game in general. The more consistent you are with your own play, the more likely it is that you're impacting your team's chances to win more.

Third thing to note: With the mechanics of this game being what they are, it's not that easy to 'carry' a game for your team. It's a team game, if you can cover the mistakes of your team mates, you're more likely to impact your win chance positively than going rambo on things.

Fourth thing to note: Atlas walking into the enemy fire actually wins a whole lot of games if people follow the Atlas. With good torso twisting and such, an Atlas can take a whole lot of punishment before going down, and the rest of the team has field day picking apart all the opponents so merrily focused on taking down the one Atlas.

Fifth thing to note: Don't worry about winnning or lose, worry about your own performance. Become more and more consistent and you'll start winning regardless of other factors.

[Drakkith]

It's impossible to say, really. Are you getting 200 dmg every other game because you seem to be one of the first to die in those other matches? If so, then you really, really need to work on your positioning. The first thing you should worry about as a new player is surviving, then killing. You can't kill if your dead.

That being said, it's unlikely that you are the primary cause of your team's defeat every game. I consistently win games where multiple players on my team do less than 200 damage.

And remember that MWO is very different from many other games you've played before. A single good player isn't quite as powerful as they are in other games. A few weeks ago I think I lost 13 games in a row despite finishing in the top 5 in kills/assists/dmg almost every game. Sometimes you just get ****** luck.

[Modo44]

Nobody can singlehandedly kill a match, except by deliberately teamkilling. The issue is with MWO's matchmaker. It tracks individual skill values for each weight class you play. When you switch between your good and bad mechs within a weight class, it gets confused -- generating undesirable, badly matched games. This was shown very clearly this weekend, because double XP means a lot of people were playing their bad mechs. Basically, everyone screwed with the already weak matchmaking. There is nothing you could have done to prevent that.

[bruceisnice]

No, it's not always your fault.

I broke my record (in a bad way) tonight. I had a 7 kill 1096 damage game. We lost.

We were up 8-3 in kills before I died. That means we had 9 mechs left and they had 4. The game ended with 3 of their mechs alive. Sad puppy face, I had.

That being said, and as others have said, if at some point your damage don't convert into kills, You're kinda useful, but kinda not that useful. Especially if you only do 200. I'm in no way a veteran player, in fact I started like less than 2 months ago. I remember I had a hard time getting above 200-250 at first too, but if you set your mind to it, you can really improve.

Keep at it, but remember you're usually only as good as your team is, more or less.

[Anunknownlurker]

I echo the OP's feelings. I am pretty new to the game and only just becoming aware of how much I have to learn. Only just got my first, non-trial, mech and feel like I am at the start of a very, very long journey. Great advice from Silra, may just print that out and stick it in front of me whilst playing.

My overall view is that it's almost impossible for me to throw the game for my team although, clearly, if I don't pull my weight then I am not helping a great deal; I've had one game in a Raven where I feel my contribution - spotting and generally being a pain in the arse for the opposition - made a real difference. Mostly though,at the moment, I am just making up the numbers. Hopefully,as I improve, this will change.

Lots of maps and lots of mechs to learn!

[Cervantes88]

Winning in solo queue is pure RNG in this game. You do your thing and roll the dice, win or loss. Try to get as much damage as you can and hopefully some kills so you get better rewards in Cbills and XP and that's it.

200dmg in an IS medium is below average tbh. In a Clan medium it's downright awful unless you're playing some stupid ****. You should be aiming for 300-400 dmg on average.

What medium are you playing ?

[mailin]

I want to stress what has been said before by Drakkith. Concentrate on surviving. In a medium you're faster than assaults and most heavies. As such, support the fatties and fire on what they fire on. Don't worry about damage, kills OR assists. Concentrate on surviving AND keeping the heavier mechs alive. Stay alive and keep them alive and all of your numbers will improve.

If your team has a DDC or Hellbringer with ECM, try to stay close enough to that mech to remain within their ECM bubble and add your firepower to theirs.

Also, use voip comms and lock your target. Generally DO NOT fire on an enemy until you get them locked. This will tell you where to hit them. If multiple targets present themselves, cycle through them to find the one that is the most damaged or has the most firepower and try to concentrate on that mech.

Generally speaking the team that wins is the one that works as a team. Voip is the single best, newest aid in that.

Good luck, and happy hunting!

Edited by mailin, 09 March 2015 - 12:47 AM.

[Rogue Jedi]

Danth Reduviid, on 08 March 2015 - 06:28 PM, said:

I know I'm not very good. But is it possible to be so bad you cause your team to loose 2-12? Because that's what all weekend has been like for me. I think my team has one once or twice in the 25 or so games I've played in the 2xp weekend. I'm a medium pilot who gets 200 damage every other game and stays with my team mates. Not great, but I didn't think that was terrible. And it's not like I'm in an Atlas just waking into enemy fire.

I was leveling Enforces over the weekend, on one of them I finished basic skills without getting the first victory of the day, as others have said I suspect most people were doing what I did, taking their unskilled Mechs and working to level them, this is not condusive to playing well, so if one team got players who were mostly working on Elite skills while the other team were mostly working on basics the "elite" team would have a significant advantage.

I do not think it is possible for a single player to cost your team the match short of teamkilling or taking command and suggeing very bad stratagies.

damage has little bearing on your teams sucess, staying alive and actively contributing are the most important things you can do to assist in a win, the importance of damage and kills change based on what Mech you are using, for example:
Few people would suggest that a Spiders job is to do damage, instead its job is to cause a distraction, locate the enemy and in the case of a SDR-5D provide ECM cover.

I just did some maths, out of 1927 matches in 88 Mechs I have played since the last stats reset (at the time or typing) 28of my Mechs with an average damage per match of 200 or more and 17 Mechs have an average damage of less than 100. 47% (about half) of my matches are wins but I only have a 0.57 Kill Death Ratio.

There is no correlation between my high damage Mechs, and my high KDR, or Win Loss Ratio Mech and kills/damage
Indeed a few Mechs which I had considered myself to be “bad” in are near the top of the list (purely based on damage per match) including the WHK-B and my despised Dire Wolf (way too slow and sluggish for me to enjoy piloting).

None of my favourite IS Mechs (Spiders, Griffins or Firestarters) have an average damage of more than 200 but they do have far higher KDR and WLR than most of my Mechs with 200+ average damage, only the Timber Wolf and Stormcrow have a better than 200 damage average with a good KDR and WLR

[dragnier1]

Hmmm......

I have games where i get 500-700 dmg and 2-3 kills.

I have games where i get 500-700 dmg and no kills.

There are games where i get 100-300 dmg with 1-3 kills.

Games where i get 100-300 without kills.

Of cause i get crap games with less than 100 dmg. Just had one some days back. After a while you can generally tell if you made a contribution or were just crap based off your performance.

Edited by dragnier1, 09 March 2015 - 04:35 AM.

[Morang]

Danth Reduviid, on 08 March 2015 - 06:28 PM, said:

I know I'm not very good. But is it possible to be so bad you cause your team to loose 2-12?

Because that's what all weekend has been like for me.

I think my team has one once or twice in the 25 or so games I've played in the 2xp weekend.

I'm a medium pilot who gets 200 damage every other game and stays with my team mates. Not great, but I didn't think that was terrible. And it's not like I'm in an Atlas just waking into enemy fire.

WLR is meaningless in the matchmaking environment controlled by Elo communism, complicated by often less-than-ideal PGI performance, not very numerous playerbase and additional criteria for the matchmaker besides Elo.

[Tarl Cabot]

200 dmg is not terrible, depending on med mech setup. The high damages you may see at the end of the game also contain ammo explosions and/or arty/strikes.

I have had games where heavy/assaults had generated 70pts of damage and won, mechs DC at the start of the game and never returned, etc. Lot depends on everyone working as a team, not going rambo but with most of the team still being more aggressive than the opponent.

What are your mechs and loadout? Does your mech shut down much? Are you one of the first to die? Do you stick with the main group? Where do you sit when the game has ended?

In the end though, how do you think you did? When spectating others in similar mechs, how is their play different or similar to yours? It is a team game, even in PUG matches. At the end of the day, win or lose, it boils down to how you think you are doing, what are you weaknesses, your strengths and how can yo do better next time?

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 09 March 2015 - 05:15 AM.

[Axeface]

The best thing I think you could try is to start noting down wins and losses in a tally. You might find that you are 'noticing' the losses more, confirmation bias I think they call it.

However (Now for some wild conjecture) I have noticed in my game (and my stats) that there are 'cursed' varients. I think PGI's programming takes your chassis AND name into account, and then choses which team you will spawn in, and in which lance. This decides a few things including on what side of the map you spawn on, this is really quite important due to the lop sided balancing of the many of the maps. I've also noticed that it often puts people with similar names in lances together. It shouldnt be doing this....
Just what I think I'm seeing after like 5k drops. I have stats that make no sense - a statistician would probably have a stroke looking at them.

Maybe try another mech if you are not?

Edited by Axeface, 09 March 2015 - 05:17 AM.

[aGentleWarrior]

I wish i would be that good!

i don't make many kills, and that weekend was very disappointing for me.
Lost like 9 of 10 games.
My DMG, sometimes it is below 100, sometimes above 400 - however that seems not to bother much for the win.

I once asked if there is much about lag and connection which makes me so bad. Answer was it could be.
Playing with Lasers & PPC it looks like i do much dmg, but debriefing shows usually poor results.

With my catapult LRM i do often massive dmg, mostly > 400, sometimes > 700, but nearly no components destroyed, no kills.
I still don't get if that damage helps my team by shaking and softening up enemies.
My LRM boat matches are 50/50 won. Again longer survived, more likely won.

I feel I contributed best in some battles with my fastest mechs which survived long or till the end.
Typical matches where I felt good was :
My Locust 1M on canyon network, where i survived long and kept shooting 2xLRM5 + 2xML on busy enemies from behind, running away as soon being noticed, repositioning, repeating ... Win, at least 10 minutes participating in battle, 1 kill (finishing off a badly damaged enemy), > 200dmg.

My Hunchback SP wich runs 90kp/h 4 medium lasers + 2xSRM6 on Frozen city. That story repeats often.
I keep running around blocks and shooting my SRMs and MLs. Often match ends with
Win, 1 or 2 Kill(s), > 300dmg, I survive with heavy crippeled mech like one SRM launcher + 1 or 2 MLs left.

The speed keeps me alive. In Assaults and heavies i die fast.
Which i don't get, because I am a slow player. I would like to snipe instead of running around, but I fail in that.
To get kills and deal dmg with other weapons then LRM I have to be below 200m. To get kills I have to survive long, to ensure the enemy is already damaged.

On longer distances it looks like I hit and do dmg, but ... it seems not really to happen.
Usually the crosshair shows I hit, but dmg with PPC, LL or ERLL is really poor.

I have Catapult K2, that one usually dies very fast because my PPC or ERLL shots look cool but seem not to do dmg, while the Catapult center torso is blown apart within 2 seconds under fire. Yes, I increased the default front armor. Yes, I twist torso after shooting...

I have Stalker 4N. Shooting 5 LL looks cool but again, that does not seem to do much.
I see another mech in front of me, I shoot multiple times, do 4-5% dmg (always aim at CT), while in same time I get destroyed. When I started to play the Stalker as a LRM 15/15/10 I felt more contributing, although I ignored quirks.

Yes, the longer I survive the more i influence I have, even just by distracting enemy fire.
However again, I enjoy more the sniping, shooting part then running, hiding etc...
So when i play the way I want to have fun, sniping shooting i will not have success.
When i play focused on surviving i have more success but less fun.

Edited by aGentleWarrior, 09 March 2015 - 06:07 AM.

[YCSLiesmith]

don't use LRMs at all. Use smurfy http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab and its forum, mechspecs https://www.mechspecs.com/ to build workable mechs. mechspecs guy is kind of dumb but there's good advice there and eventually you'll figure out what works and what doesn't. Pay attention to your mech's quirks.

don't put an XL engine in an assault, but put one in most lighter mechs.

dont always aim at the CT. aim for weak components. backs usually have more armor than fronts. Put all your own armor in the front of your mech, you only need 6 or 8 back armor. Instead of having strong back armor, stay with a group so you can cover one another. Don't wander off on your own, you'll get wrecked.

There are mechs where all their weapons are in one arm: learn what those mechs are and shoot that arm off to completely nullify that mech.

when you have a lot of weapons, don't alpha strike all the time. find out what the ghost heat limits are. three large lasers at a time can fire without ghost heat, for example, while 4 large lasers will give massive ghost heat. either chainfire or set different groups so you're never getting ghost heat.

put heatsinks in your engine preferentially, they are more efficient there than in other places.

know where weapons are on your mech. maybe they're all on your left side: if so, keep twisting so your right side is facing the enemy, using your right arm as a shield and only facing them head on when you are ready to fire. learn your weapon's optimal ranges and keep to them. being too close or too far away will mess you up. use cover.

turn down your mouse sensitivity, it's too high by default. switch your controls so that tapping w and s incrementally increases and decreases your speed by 10% instead of acting as a traditional accelerator. it will make you much better at controlling your stops and poking at enemies from around cover.

join a strong unit and get on mumble/teamspeak/whatever so that you're coordinating and sharing tips and builds.

[Nik Reaper]

@ aGentleWarrior

Then try this mech build: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...2ee0808156a3a74

[Stardancer01]

Medium mechs are very hard to play because they seem to be the jack of all trades master of none. Saying that I have seen the SRM medium mechs multiplying of late. It’s manoeuvrability seems to work well with packed SRMs but you lose out on ranged warfare which is 90% of the game.

[Mogney]

New players should focus on staying alive more than trying to do damage. Think of it like baseball, the best hitters say they hit the most home runs when they are trying to hit line drives. When they swing for the fences they just strike out. Dont worry about damage and kills, focus on staying alive as long possible while peeking and poking from safety. Before long you will notice you stats improving quite a bit.

good luck.

[Sonny Black]

Danth Reduviid, on 08 March 2015 - 06:28 PM, said:

I know I'm not very good. But is it possible to be so bad you cause your team to loose 2-12?

Because that's what all weekend has been like for me.

I think my team has one once or twice in the 25 or so games I've played in the 2xp weekend.

I'm a medium pilot who gets 200 damage every other game and stays with my team mates. Not great, but I didn't think that was terrible. And it's not like I'm in an Atlas just waking into enemy fire.

Short answer...YES. As the old saying goes...Sometimes you get the bear, sometimes the bear gets you.