24 replies to this topic

[Aggravated Assault Mech]

7ynx, on 02 June 2014 - 02:26 PM, said:

Ecm is only one of several counters to LRM's, let's see how many we can count?

LRM counters:
1. ECM
2. Range (>1000m or <180m)
3. Cover
4. AMS
5. fire LRM onto enemy LRM boats

Can any one think of any others?


To be fair, let us list the ECM counters?

ECM counters:
1. Counter ECM (ECCM)
2. Tag
3. PPC/ERppc
4. NARC
5. BAP
6. Seismic module

Are there any others?

So it looks like there are several counters to both ECM and LRM's, perhaps we as player need to adapt more and QQ less?

The thing is that ECM is so much more effective than its counters are... which is just a really bad design choice considering it's a passive piece of equipment.

To counter ECM with TAG or NARC or ECCM you have to actually shoot an enemy or yolo your mech into the enemy team. To counter all the LRMs in the game, you just have to park your ECM carrier next to the majority of the team.

When you use TAG to counter ECM, the ECM carrier is still 90% effective. When you counter LRMs with ECM, every LRM boat is probably only 40% effective even if they have personal TAG.

This literal definition of power without gameplay is just another reason why poptarts are preferred. Players adapt to ECM meta by simply not taking LRM boats.

[n r g]

CaptainDeez, on 27 May 2014 - 09:31 PM, said:

Ever since the patch that made LRMs more effective alot of players have begun using ECMs as a way to stay out of lock and off radar. But many players are now complaining that the ECM is unbalanced for these exact reasons. Since it's unlikely that PGI will axe the ECM or even tune it down, it only makes sense to adapt.

If you're having a problem with ECM's consider getting a Tag, with the exception of an ECM sitting on top of you a simple 1 ton tag can negate all of the ECMs main advantages, keeping the enemy off radar, and out of missile lock. Add a bap and close in ECMs have absolutely no advantages to fallback on. And since ECM mechs tend to play more aggressivley, encountering this combo can often mean a swift death by missile or gang bang.

You don't need missiles for a tag to be useful, alot of meta-game strategies simply fall apart once you start tagging enemies. ECM Ravens can't snipe in the open, teams are no longer safe hugging the ECM mech, and often an ECM mech will draw the rest of the team into strategically awkward posistions because they are all dependent on that one module. Not to mention missiles start hitting harder. Tag a few guys and they realize the ECM mech isn't keeping them safe and will often become more skittish because they are more visible and easier to counter-snipe.

Heck, my ECM spider has a tag just so i can provide the advantages of it to my team while negating it's advantages for the enemy. Not to mention a dedicated tagger can rack up credits very quickly even if they didn't do much offensive damage. You have to adapt to what's thrown at you, if the ECM is making alot of headaches for you, there are hard counters. It may mean one less medium laser, but what good is a ml when you can't get close anyways?

Interesting interpretation , I like it

[L Y N X]

vnlk65n, on 02 June 2014 - 03:09 PM, said:

The thing is that ECM is so much more effective than its counters are... which is just a really bad design choice considering it's a passive piece of equipment.

To counter ECM with TAG or NARC or ECCM you have to actually shoot an enemy or yolo your mech into the enemy team. To counter all the LRMs in the game, you just have to park your ECM carrier next to the majority of the team.

When you use TAG to counter ECM, the ECM carrier is still 90% effective. When you counter LRMs with ECM, every LRM boat is probably only 40% effective even if they have personal TAG.

This literal definition of power without gameplay is just another reason why poptarts are preferred. Players adapt to ECM meta by simply not taking LRM boats.

You took my post, which was intended as a rebuttal to someone else's post about how LRM's are overpowered. So I am not sure what your point is in quoting me. ECM is powerful and is supposed to be powerful, it is why not every mech can mount ECM. You might as well be arguing that water is wet, your argument is vacuous, or a weak thesis.

[The Great Unwashed]

vnlk65n, on 02 June 2014 - 03:09 PM, said:

To counter ECM with TAG or NARC or ECCM you have to actually shoot an enemy or yolo your mech into the enemy team. To counter all the LRMs in the game, you just have to park your ECM carrier next to the majority of the team.

So, the LRM mech which is hiding among the team members and usually behind a ridge cannot target an ECM mech which is hiding among the team members and usually behind a ridge?

It appears that both tactics have their mutual pros and cons.

The ECM mech hiding within a team is usually not the problem I worry about because then the entire team is hiding from direct fire; I worry much more about spotters and these have to expose themselves. (Plus, I haven't fired a single LRM since the stat reset)

Edited by The Great Unwashed, 03 June 2014 - 12:31 AM.

[Dunning Kruger Effect]

I got a good laugh at "ECM meta" - now that's a new one!

Oh the humanity! I for one welcome our new Cicada overlords....

Quote

So, the LRM mech which is hiding among the team members and usually behind a ridge cannot target an ECM mech which is hiding among the team members and usually behind a ridge?

This.