61 replies to this topic

[JC Daxion]

(i had a longer post, but the forums ate it..)



the nitty gritty,



Shadow hawk, griffin or wolverine... It is time to get the XL-275 i have had my eye on, and having a tough time deciding on which mech to get. I know a lot of people will say shadow hawk, but the wolverine has been pretty darn intriguing to me for at least for 2 of the variants. The griffin on the other hand does have that killer torso twist..

But as i already own the HBK's, i am wondering if the shadow hawk is just more of the same, but with JJ's and 5 more tons. The other two are missile based for the most part, and i do love me some missiles, But you know with the state of SRM's not really sure when those issues are going to be fixed, and i do already own Cat's, so i kinda use them to boat the LRM's..

It does have me wondering if the 55 toners, are more of skirmisher type boats, and not really sure how they fair in close range combat..

So what say you, any advice on what i should get?

[TercieI]

Most folks will say "Shadow Hawk, no question." My inclination is to agree because I have all five SHDs and they rock, but I haven't actually played the others, so I don't want to say that too much.

(I do feel obliged to point out that the XL275 is a lemon engine, weighing the same as the XL280. It's only optimum on the "other" Ravens, but fine if you have it)

[juxstapo]

JC Daxion, on 01 June 2014 - 06:32 PM, said:

So what say you, any advice on what i should get?

Peeps are different. Opinions and mileage vary... I'd say about 25% of the people who own them think Wolverines are great.
and about 80% of SHD owners say the same about their mechs. Personally I've found the Wolvies mmmeeeehh

I was about to jump up and yell "NAW MAN! Shawk's are wonderful! They ain't more of the same!!" But honestly it's been so long since I've seriously run my HBK's that the sentiment might very well be incorrect. However my Shawks were an awesome ride.

EDIT: OhYah! What Terc said. Don't buy a 275xl on purpose unless you absolutely have to. (We both gots 'em from the saber pack). 280 if the mech can fit it.

Edited by juxstapo, 01 June 2014 - 07:09 PM.

[JC Daxion]

Terciel1976, on 01 June 2014 - 07:00 PM, said:

(I do feel obliged to point out that the XL275 is a lemon engine, weighing the same as the XL280. It's only optimum on the "other" Ravens, but fine if you have it)

thanks for the info, but I have the two ravens in question, And a HBK 4sp, that i am dying to try a Steak build with.. I also have said XL-280.. the other mech i am getting is the stalker with the XL-255.. then i am done buying engines for a bit. .

[Samziel]

Kintaro is a 55 tonner too

Wolverines and Griffins seem to work too (Griffins a bit better), but they don't have as good hardpoints as the Shadowhawk. Instead they have better torso twist (if I've understood right).

[Redshift2k5]

How fast do you wanna go and what guns do you want to bring when you get there?

Go to smurfy, try some test builds. See what fits, see what you like. Browse mechspecs for a high volume of build ideas in one tidy location.

I love my Shadowhawks, so that's probably a good place to put your baseline- Do any of the others allow a build you want you but can't put on a Shadowhawk? Do you want ballsitics? Griffins make better fast SSRM anti-light mechs(and also have moar tubes for LRMs) but lack the ballistics to match a Shadowhawk in terms of long range direct fire.

[Glaive-]

ShadowHawks plays quite differently than the Hunchbacks, mostly because of the torso twist differences. Maybe I'm just used to my 50 tonners, but the 55 tonners feel a little sluggish to me, even with maxed efficiencies.

Overall, the ShadowHawk is the lest maneuverable of the JJ capable 55 tonners, because it has relatively poor twist range and generally carries only a small amount of JJs. but it is the most ballistic-capable out of the group, and the high weapon mounts are amazing.

I haven't noticed any major differences between my Griffin and Wolverine. The smaller twist range of the WVR hasn't really effected my performance, at least from what I've noticed. Same thing with the higher pitch range of the Wolverine.
I have yet to try the Wolverine 6R, but the arm mounted ballistics seem pretty interesting.

If you want something really solid, I'd go with the ShadowHawks. If you are looking for something more nimble, I'd go with the Griffins or Wolverines.

EDIT: Oh, and if you don't mind the lack of jump jets, the KTO-20 is pretty nice too.

Edited by armyunit, 01 June 2014 - 08:08 PM.

[TercieI]

JC Daxion, on 01 June 2014 - 07:17 PM, said:

thanks for the info, but I have the two ravens in question, And a HBK 4sp, that i am dying to try a Steak build with.. I also have said XL-280.. the other mech i am getting is the stalker with the XL-255.. then i am done buying engines for a bit. .

Keen. Why would you need an XL275 for a streak HBK-4SP? Mine ran two streaks and 5ML with a STD275 just fine (might have been the STD270, it saves a whole ton for a couple kph if you don't need the HS slot).

[JC Daxion]

Terciel1976, on 01 June 2014 - 08:08 PM, said:

Keen. Why would you need an XL275 for a streak HBK-4SP? Mine ran two streaks and 5ML with a STD275 just fine (might have been the STD270, it saves a whole ton for a couple kph if you don't need the HS slot).

because i wanna try this build... the idea is Long range support, lance protector/light hunter..

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...08a79da71ee8145

btw, for the people with the kintaro recommendations, i left that off the list as it does not have an XL-275 varriant. I wish it did, because i would of probably picked it

Edited by JC Daxion, 01 June 2014 - 10:45 PM.

[Denolven]

JC Daxion, on 01 June 2014 - 08:41 PM, said:

because i wanna try this build... the idea is Long range support, lance protector/light hunter..
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...08a79da71ee8145

Note that when using an XL engine, CASE does absolutely nothing. It doesn't prevent ammo explosions, it only prevents the explosion damage to travel to the next body part. But since you are dead when your ST is gone anyway (the only situation where damage would travel), CASE would only do something when you are dead already, which is no help of course.

Also note that you have 6 free slots, so there is absolutely no reason to put that heatsink into the engine (additional heatsinks are always 1.4x cooling, no matter if you put it in the engine or somewhere else). In fact, if you put it near your weapons, it would act as a crit buffer, increasing the chance that you keep your weapons a bit longer.

The Kintaro fits the role you describe perfectly fine, fielding two ERLL and 3-5 streak launchers and a bigger engine (XL300?). I field a Trebuchet doing the same, 3 streaks, 2 ERLL and jump jets. Pretty much every medium with access to 2+ missile hardpoints can fit this role, and none of them needs the XL275.
Really, if you don't have the XL275 already, there isn't any need to get it. But if you are set on this loadout, we won't stop you

Is there a specific reason why you want to use the Hunchback? Don't get me wrong, it's a fine mech, but buying a 55 tonner just to get an engine seems a bit around the corner. Because you know, the 55 tonner will be more expensive than just buying the engine


PS: Feel free to use the topic Which Mech you should buy next in the future

Edited by Denolven, 02 June 2014 - 04:09 AM.

[PhoenixFire55]

ShadowHawk is the best all-around medium hands down. There are other mediums who excel at certain tasks but none as versatile as SHD. Plus, its 55 tons, max weight medium. In a current state of the game JJs make all the difference, you can't even compare what you can do in a HBK and in a SHD.

Edited by PhoenixFire55, 02 June 2014 - 04:29 AM.

[Modo44]

I like the Kintaro 18 for one specific build (2xASRM6+3xSSRM2+2xML, XL300), but I would not recommend it. Shadow Hawk > Wolverine ~ Griffin > Kintaro.

Edited by Modo44, 02 June 2014 - 04:32 AM.

[MountainCopper]

JC Daxion, on 01 June 2014 - 07:17 PM, said:

thanks for the info, but I have the two ravens in question, And a HBK 4sp, that i am dying to try a Steak build with.. I also have said XL-280.. the other mech i am getting is the stalker with the XL-255.. then i am done buying engines for a bit. .

About the part with buying XL-engines, some of your future buys in the 55t area might include a XL275, as you can see at smurfy:

GRF-3M, SHD-5M, WVR-7K

[MountainCopper]

I played Hunchbacks before Shadowhawks. I haven't played any other 55t Mech yet.
In direct comparison, I like Hunchbacks more than Shadowhawks because of more agility, greater torso / arms twist angles and better visibility out of the cockpit. But as SHD builds will mostly contain a XL-engine and JJs, these are more poptart friendly, hence the popularity.

Shadowhawks put their emphasis on ballistics, whereas apart from one Wolverine variant, all Wolverines, Griffins and Kintaros are energy/missile hybrids. That's 8 Mech variants with only energy and missile hardpoints...

Where Wolverines and Griffins have JJs, the Kintaro doesn't, but will have one additional hardpoint. And if I then look past how the Mech looks or sounds inside the cockpit, I would prefer Kintaros over Griffins and Wolverines because of better hardpoint locations.

In the 55t range, Shadowhawks are good, which in addition to my personal dislikes mentioned at the beginning, also suffer ingame from having a too large Mech model (e.g. taller than a Cataphract).

Edited by GoldenFleece, 02 June 2014 - 07:20 AM.

[TercieI]

Modo44, on 02 June 2014 - 04:31 AM, said:

I like the Kintaro 18 for one specific build (2xASRM6+3xSSRM2+2xML, XL300), but I would not recommend it. Shadow Hawk > Wolverine ~ Griffin > Kintaro.

Two hitbox passes later, the KTO is much better than people think. The 18 can do a bunch of things, the 19 is passable for LRMs and the 20 may be better than a CN9 for SRM brawling now. It's a seriously underrated chassis (though still maybe the weakest of the four overall)

[GLIZZY GULPER]

Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhadowhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhawk.

[Modo44]

Terciel1976, on 02 June 2014 - 05:48 AM, said:

Two hitbox passes later, the KTO is much better than people think.

It was OK as released in my opinion -- even more XL friendly then. It loses purely due to the lack of jump jets.

[Jody Von Jedi]

Terciel1976, on 02 June 2014 - 05:48 AM, said:

Two hitbox passes later, the KTO is much better than people think. The 18 can do a bunch of things, the 19 is passable for LRMs and the 20 may be better than a CN9 for SRM brawling now. It's a seriously underrated chassis (though still maybe the weakest of the four overall)

The only thing that has kept me from getting into Kintaros is the lack of Jumpjets. They are solid chassis otherwise. My play style is jump brawler and they just don't fit.

So as Terciel says, if you don't mind the lack of JJ, then give the Kintaro a try.

Jody

[process]

Shadowhawks are easily the most useful. Wolverines are probably the next best, since they are capable of almost everything Grffins are, plus they're the size of Hunchbacks.

Generally, I differentiate Shadowhawks, Griffins and Wolverines as platforms for ballistics, LRMs and SRMs, respectively.

[Marmon Rzohr]

JC Daxion, on 01 June 2014 - 06:32 PM, said:

(i had a longer post, but the forums ate it..)



the nitty gritty,



Shadow hawk, griffin or wolverine... It is time to get the XL-275 i have had my eye on, and having a tough time deciding on which mech to get. I know a lot of people will say shadow hawk, but the wolverine has been pretty darn intriguing to me for at least for 2 of the variants. The griffin on the other hand does have that killer torso twist..

But as i already own the HBK's, i am wondering if the shadow hawk is just more of the same, but with JJ's and 5 more tons. The other two are missile based for the most part, and i do love me some missiles, But you know with the state of SRM's not really sure when those issues are going to be fixed, and i do already own Cat's, so i kinda use them to boat the LRM's..

It does have me wondering if the 55 toners, are more of skirmisher type boats, and not really sure how they fair in close range combat..

So what say you, any advice on what i should get?

Go with a Shadowhawk, IMHO. It's the best of the lot.

However, whichever mech you go, don't buy an XL engine for a medium mech. STD engines will allow you to fit every viable loadout and make you mech significantly more survivable. The tradeoff for speed isn't worth it, especially on mechs like the Shadowhawk, Griffin and Wolverine which can tank damage very well for a light chassis.