68 replies to this topic

[Boogie Man]

With the gap in power IS mechs already are facing again clan mechs I think it might be time to get rid of the single side torso core on IS XL engines. Make them like Clan XL's where you need to blow out both side torsos. IS mechs are already penalized 2 more critical slots vs clan mechs on their XL engines. The single side torso core seems like overkill to me.

[Lootee]

The 2 more critical slots are the reason they die when a side torso is gone.

Are you saying remove them and turn them into Clan XL engines?

A mech is out of the game if it loses 3 Engine Crits, whether it's from a body part being destroyed, flooded, normal critical hits, through armor critical hits, wutever.

Edited by PanchoTortilla, 13 June 2014 - 09:10 AM.

[Bagheera]

No.

Next question.

[Rofl]

Bagheera, on 13 June 2014 - 09:09 AM, said:

No.

Next question.

Why is the sky blue?

[Bilbo]

As much as I'd love to run an XL in my Atlas again. I'd have to say no.

[Malcolm Vordermark]

Rofl, on 13 June 2014 - 09:15 AM, said:

Why is the sky blue?

Scattering of light from nitrogen in our atmosphere.

I feel like were making a lot of progress in this thread.

[DONTOR]

Maybe after IS ballistics get the DoT treatment. In other words there are checks and balances in place that are making up for our tougher XL engines.. such as FLD.

[verybad]

Rofl, on 13 June 2014 - 09:15 AM, said:

Why is the sky blue?

Dead fairies that have been hit by airplanes.

Regarding the XL question. NO, absolutely not. IS tech is SUPPOSED to be less effective. Don't be a pansy and cry about it, just fight on against these invading nutcases./

Edited by verybad, 13 June 2014 - 09:21 AM.

[ChapeL]

Sure give IS mechs the Clan XL engine treatment... and give the Clans upgradable and mobile FF and Endo.

[General Taskeen]

There have been ideas in the past,

Like IS XL:

Lose one Torso (speed reduced, torso turn reduced)
Lose both XL Torso (speed reduced, can't turn torso at all - locked at last position)

Clan XL

Lose one Torso (speed reduced, torso turn not reduced)
Lose both XL torso (speed reduced, torso turn reduced)


There are ways of doing so, that is if pgi would prefer longer TTK and not direct 1:1 TT conversion.

Or you know, they could make CASE protect XL engines from ammo explosions. A number of possibilities.

Edited by General Taskeen, 13 June 2014 - 09:23 AM.

[Sephlock]

Bull Frog, on 13 June 2014 - 09:21 AM, said:

Sure give IS mechs the Clan XL engine treatment... and give the Clans upgradable and mobile FF and Endo.

Or just do the latter.

Or better yet, take a more Canon friendly route and give us THE KODIAK! non-omni Clan mechs!

[verybad]

Sephlock, on 13 June 2014 - 09:25 AM, said:

Or just do the latter.

Or better yet, take a more Canon friendly route and give us THE KODIAK! non-omni Clan mechs!

I would be surprised if the Kodiak doesn't show up in a "second wave" mech release.

Edited by verybad, 13 June 2014 - 09:26 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Boogie Man, on 13 June 2014 - 09:07 AM, said:

With the gap in power IS mechs already are facing again clan mechs I think it might be time to get rid of the single side torso core on IS XL engines. Make them like Clan XL's where you need to blow out both side torsos. IS mechs are already penalized 2 more critical slots vs clan mechs on their XL engines. The single side torso core seems like overkill to me.

You are only looking at one small piece of the puzzle (quoting from another post because I am getting wore out typing, lol)

Casual play, the MM goal is to match Clan Mechs, too. Thus if You Drop with a Timberwolf, if possible, the other team with have a Timberwolf or Summoner.

So I see that as pretty self balancing.

Where IS mechs excel, is they have more JJs available, more ECM available, more FLD available (even if Paul ever finally nerfs Poptarting). And in General, while aside from the CT of the Direwolf, I ran into no glaring bad hitboxes on Clan Mechs, I also saw no real OMG this is great, hitboxes.

You got mechs like the 55 tonners, Centurion, Firestarter, Victor, Battlemaster and Highlander that have massive arms that protect relatively small STs, and thus by twisting can tank massive damage. Clan Mechs, while they have the better XL, don't have those damage intercepting arms, in general, and a lot of their firepower is in those arms, so if they do absorb damage, they lose a lot of firepower.

Also, the "zombie" term is highly misapplied to Clan Mechs, because yes, even with an XL, while they can lose ONE side without dying, lose both ST, and they die. (Plus few have CT or head weapon slots)

Another MASSIVE weakness is very few Clan Mechs have any arm reflex. And in fact, you mount LPL,. ER PPC, Gauss, Heavy ACs, you end up with the same arm movement as a Stalker, Jenner or Jagermech.

As for weaponry, I ran a Dual ER PPC, 4 MG, Dual UAC20 Dire Wolf for part of the night. Sounds pretty scary, right? BoomJagers deal out damage far more effectively. My JM6-DD with 2x LBX, 4 MG and 4 Medium Lasers is far more dangerous, overall.

Because (qouting from another answer)
FLD alphas is the deciding factor in this game.

Clan AC are now DoT
Clan Lasers have wicked long beam duration and are ALL affected by Ghost Heat.
Clan Missiles are stream fire and easily picked off by AMS.
Clan LB have the same damage spread as IS, SRMs likewise spread, and the SSRMs have insanely long cooldowns.

Literally the only serious FLD weapon they have is the ER PPC, which is hot as all get out, same as the IS, so more than 2 are rarely effective. And they don't have FLD Ballistics to sync with them.

So those are my thoughts based off of an admittedly limited window into the Clans, which are NOT, according to Russ in their final June 17th Patch form as yet.


And yes, there are certainly going to be balance issues in coming weeks to months, but the "XL Conundrum" is not one of them, when one focuses on the whole picture.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 13 June 2014 - 09:27 AM.

[ChapeL]

verybad, on 13 June 2014 - 09:26 AM, said:

I would be surprised if the Kodiak doesn't show up in a "second wave" mech release.

Isn't the Kodiak missing a few variants to be elligible ?

[Spheroid]

Bad idea and not forward thinking. If you make the XL a two slot item what reason will people have to take the future light engine? You invalidate its entire reason for existence.

Your suggestion would reduce build variety, invalidate stock builds and runs contrary to lore.

Edited by Spheroid, 13 June 2014 - 09:34 AM.

[Zerberus]

Bwahahahahahaahahahahahahahaha.

No.

For reasons why refer to Bishops Post preceding mine.

[SgtMagor]

gonna have to agree that IS mechs can tank damage way better than a clan mech, even with an XL engine.

[verybad]

Bull Frog, on 13 June 2014 - 09:33 AM, said:

Isn't the Kodiak missing a few variants to be elligible ?

The Mauler has apparently been selected as a future mech for the game, and at this time, it is also, so...

[DEMAX51]

Yeah... no.

[Haakon Magnusson]

SgtMagor, on 13 June 2014 - 09:37 AM, said:

gonna have to agree that IS mechs can tank damage way better than a clan mech, even with an XL engine.

Can you please elaborate on this?