78 replies to this topic

[Raigner]

Pale Jackal, on 13 June 2014 - 11:30 AM, said:

Except you encourage PGI's ridiculous behavior.

If MWO was released like a normal title, $60, it'd receive horrible reviews regarding its lack of content. However, since it's a "free to play" title, that gets rubes to pay... what, up to $440 if you went Legendary + Overlord + Warhawk package?

So, as you can see, I have nothing but contempt for people who encourage such business behavior. I have contempt for free to play games, and the only reason I'm here is because it's a Mechwarrior title.

I don't have a problem spending $60 or $120 per year. If PGI gave me the option of paying $120 per year to have access to all the content in the game, I'd do that. But they don't. If you buy premium time, you still have to grind for content. If you want to play around with an Ilya, you need to drop $15 to $30.

Yeah, the free to play model is stupid, and people like yourself encourage it.

Anyhow, Community Warfare will be here any moment, right guys? Oh, that's right, PGI can't charge you ridiculous sums for that, so they'll just make some more hero 'mechs instead.

I could easily pay $60 to $120 for 'mechs. But I won't, since I'm not stupid enough to give money to a company that has repeatedly disappointed the community. No 3PV and no coolant flushes, right? PGI promised! LOL.

Good, if the clan pack is there ridiculous behavior. then I hope to see a lot more of it. i also do not mind 3pv or coolant, and a lot of people could honestly care less, use those features or do not, but I am tired of your prattle without substance.

[Sarlic]

Raigner, on 13 June 2014 - 11:08 AM, said:

I do not need nor care for your opinion on my spending habits, i am supporting what i want and buying what i find of value to me, whether you agree with it is completely inconsequential, i had an amazing time yesterday PGI blew my expectations out of the water, i have no regrets. laugh all you want but your the only one who cares.

Exactly. Your expectations and your money throwing at them. It's just a shame that you dont look further then your nose.

[Jack Corban]

ShadowVFX, on 13 June 2014 - 08:40 AM, said:

I'm not here to complain about Clan mechs being OP or anything like that. I just knew that when they were released it would completely throw the balance of MWO out of whack (and seeing the gameplay footage from yesterdays test just reinforce that notion) for a minimum of 2-3 weeks, if not 2-3 months. I suspected this would be the case for months now.

Once the Clans hit, I will likely force myself to take a break from MWO until all the dust settles. I'll probably play for a few days after the Clan launch to reaffirm what I've seen from the tests, but if the results are similar, I will not be in-game for a while until PGI brings things back into balance again.

Clan mechs aren't nearly as OP as I was afraid they could have been. However, they still easily trump their IS counterparts with ease. I've heard the argument that games might still be balanced, because there should be close to equal numbers of clan mechs on each side, so it all balanced out. This might be true in many cases, but they have still divided the player community into two groups; the haves and the have-nots. And the have-nots get to be the second line, the B Team, the reserves. Their equipment simply can't compete with the Clan tech.

I feel PGI is aware of this and will strive to fix this and return balance to the force game, but I know it won't be immediate or instantaneous. It will take weeks or months and be a slow process. Also, since C-Bill clan mechs are coming out at a snails pace, those of us who don't want to "pay2play" (for a variety of reasons ranging from being poor to not wanting to support PGI after many setbacks) will have to wait a long time before we can join a match and not feel like a liability to our team.

So, I will be playing June 17th and maybe even the remainder of that week. However, if the balance feels too out of whack between IS and Clan, I'll probably just take a hiatus until things balance out a bit, or until I can buy some of the Clan mechs I want with C-Bills.

I'm curious if any of you are planning to do something similar? It feels like a large number of people pre-ordered a Clan pack in some form or another.

Ok let me set some things straight here.

You come of as very whiny.

To be truthfull PGI allready made the Clans a bad joke in terms of what they are able to actually do. If i had to decide it they would have come into the game without any attempt to balance them out against IS. The reason beein they are not supposed to be ballanced Techwise.

If i had to say what has to be done in this game.

1. MM Clans in clan only teams. Either against Clans or against IS. Never mixed teams ever.
2. Unbalanced introduction of pure clan Tech withough this bullshit balance.
3. Bigger maps Alpine is a good start
4. Up to 20 player support for both teams (4 Clan Stars of 5 vs. 5 lances of 4 at max)
5. Battlevalue. The MM assembles teams not by Tonnage or by composition of Classes but from Battlevalue. If that means 2 Stars of medium Clanners fight 3 Lances of heavy IS mechs so be it.
6. Remove Ghostheat
7. Give Doubleheatsinks a full 2.0 cooling factor
8. Introduce Hardpoint limitations via Hardpoint sizes ala MW 4 (Go to the archives and search for my Thread about it)
9. Introduce Stockmatches for the Hardcore BT Fans.
10.Finally play a Mechwarrior Game worth of the description.

My work here is done.

P.s.: I am a Kurita Pilot so no this is not an entitled Clanner speaking. My Favorite mech was and will allways be The HBK-4G.

Cheers

Edited by Jack Corban, 13 June 2014 - 11:58 AM.

[Pygar]

Sarlic, on 13 June 2014 - 11:07 AM, said:

If you do not see the serious flaws in this game and the behaviour of the marketing departement, then with all respect you should get robbed from your money.

I don't feel ripped off at all- the Clan package I bought is my plan for my video game budget this summer (mostly...if something else good comes around I might spend more), and the mechs I got are to keep me entertained until I can buy the other ones I didn't get with Cbills instead. (and they probably will.)

[Zerberus]

Sarlic, on 13 June 2014 - 11:49 AM, said:

Exactly. Your expectations and your money throwing at them. It's just a shame that you dont look further then your nose.

Becasue you pushing YOUR expectations and expecting everyone else to want the same thing or they`re "insert random insult here" is somehow more honorable, right?

Yeesh, talk about pots and kettles.....

One notable diffeerence being: He`s paying money, so they actually have a valid business reason to listen to him, becasuse he`s actually helpoing them to stay in business and make changes that people may or may not want.

You always gotta ante up if you wanna play poker with the big boys... otherwise nobody cares what your cards are.

Edited by Zerberus, 13 June 2014 - 12:08 PM.

[Sarlic]

Zerberus, on 13 June 2014 - 12:05 PM, said:

Becasue you pushing YOUR expectations and expecting everyone else to want the same thing or they`re "insert random insult here" is somehow more honorable, right?

Yeesh, talk about pots and kettles.....

What insult? I dont see any. — Like said before if people keep throwing money they are just encouraging 'bad behaviour'. It's not that hard to understand.

But the main problem was he didnt see the flaws from present and history

Edited by Sarlic, 13 June 2014 - 12:14 PM.

[Suko]

From what I can see, Zerberus likes to pretend insults exist where they don't. He then he writes a 4 paragraph rant full of insults at the author(s) and claims he's the better man and more "mature". He then waits for a response, rinse and repeat. How else do you get 2500 forum posts in two years? Certainly not by writing well thought out posts that aren't inflammatory and derisive.

This is great fun. Who's next?

Edited by ShadowVFX, 13 June 2014 - 12:18 PM.

[Zerberus]

Sarlic, on 13 June 2014 - 12:11 PM, said:

What insult? I dont see any. — Like said before if people keep throwing money they are just encouraging 'bad behaviour'. It's not that hard to understand.

But the main problem was he didnt see the flaws from present and history

And of course there`s absolutely no way on earth that he could know about those flaws (which in many cases not all even agree are flaws) any merely not view them as radically as you? Becasue there is only oine "right" opinion, and that just happend to be yours?

Implications of ignorance, accusations of short-sightedness, loaded questions and a condescending tone are just as insulting as any word, but yes, on that technicality you are correct.

ShadowVFX, on 13 June 2014 - 12:16 PM, said:

blah

{redacted}

Edited by Dakkath, 13 June 2014 - 04:04 PM.
Removed passive aggressive stuff.

[Black Arachne]

Clan Tech is Batter - that's the Point - despite the nerfs - improved xl engines/endo steel/dhs etc...and this is why the MM should of been set up to use BPV and the clans left as is.

[Zolaz]

Raigner, on 13 June 2014 - 11:08 AM, said:

I do not need nor care for your opinion on my spending habits, i am supporting what i want and buying what i find of value to me, whether you agree with it is completely inconsequential, i had an amazing time yesterday PGI blew my expectations out of the water, i have no regrets. laugh all you want but your the only one who cares.

I was going to give some facts about why you are wrong, but I dont think you would listen. I only assume that from your previous stances and the fact that you have a super run on sentence there. Periods are your friend, my friend.

[Pale Jackal]

Zerberus, on 13 June 2014 - 12:05 PM, said:

One notable diffeerence being: He`s paying money, so they actually have a valid business reason to listen to him, becasuse he`s actually helpoing them to stay in business and make changes that people may or may not want.

You always gotta ante up if you wanna play poker with the big boys... otherwise nobody cares what your cards are.

That presumes he isn't willing to spend money. I have spent money. PGIs behavior has shown that it's wiser not to give them money. Like the completely useless Founders mechs (except maybe the Jenner F) and Phoenix Primes.

You don't understand how this works. If you complain AND STILL GIVE THEM MONEY they have no incentive to change.

Edited by Pale Jackal, 13 June 2014 - 01:17 PM.

[Primetimex]

ShadowVFX, on 13 June 2014 - 08:40 AM, said:

So, I will be playing June 17th and maybe even the remainder of that week. However, if the balance feels too out of whack between IS and Clan, I'll probably just take a hiatus until things balance out a bit, or until I can buy some of the Clan mechs I want with C-Bills.

I'm curious if any of you are planning to do something similar? It feels like a large number of people pre-ordered a Clan pack in some form or another.

ggclose and don't let the door hit you on your way out! But seriously, yes PGI has made many mistakes in the past and also with the Phoenix Pack, but the PTS session was the first time I had some SERIOUS fun in MW:0 in a long, long time - battles were drawn out and interesting and I even dropped with a friend who also came back FROM an extended break just to test out the Clans.

He had A LOT of fun and agreed the Clan pack is the right step forward - overall it was a positive feeling in game and matches.

All I can say is, you should have bought at least one Clan Mech a-lacarte then try them out on the PTS and judge for yourself.

Just coming to the forum and posting based on theories and other peoples videos then asking for balancing and saying it's all bad just really gets old.

Trust me I do have my fair share of vs-PGI criticism, but they've done good with the Clans.

AND as for the Clans being OP: please stop: my other buddy in his SRM6 SHD2K still does his 600 - 800 damage plus few kills in the PTS - so please please no more qq-ing, whinging, crying etc.

Edited by GetterRobo, 13 June 2014 - 01:19 PM.

[Suko]

Zerberus, on 13 June 2014 - 12:18 PM, said:

You`re cute when you run out of both tangible arguments and straws, can I pet you? Or will I have to bite back?

Wait wait wait. You just truncated my post to "blah", then make a snarky comment about petting me and you claim I'm out of tangible arguments!?

I bow to your superior debate skills good sir!

I wish I lived in your mind's world. It must be like living as the main protagonist from Saints Row The Third.

Black Arachne, on 13 June 2014 - 12:25 PM, said:

Clan Tech is Batter - that's the Point - despite the nerfs - improved xl engines/endo steel/dhs etc...and this is why the MM should of been set up to use BPV and the clans left as is.

Mmmmmm, batter dipped clan tech. Sounds delicious.

Edited by ShadowVFX, 13 June 2014 - 01:24 PM.

[Whaler]

Love threads like this. More Drama then any other TNT show out there. /popcorn

[C E Dwyer]

Zolaz, on 13 June 2014 - 10:09 AM, said:

Clan tech is so OP everyone is buying it. That should tell you something. Clan tech will be OP right up until it comes out for cbills or the Hero mech comes rolling out for the chassis.

And I did play on the Test Server for about 8 hours. I havent given PGI any money for Clans and I played in my IS mechs. Clan mechs are just plain better in every regard. Think your favorite build, then make it a zombie mech with more damage going down range. The only saving grace to Clan tech is that it doesnt make the people playing them any better. However, I watched as my team mates picked up 1200 damage matches in brawler builds.

Either buy in or take a brake.

so the same old same old from PGi ?

We don't want to make IS mechs obsolete over night was crap as usual ?

feeling that getting my daughter into aion is going to be a benefit

[Pygar]

Cathy, on 13 June 2014 - 02:33 PM, said:

so the same old same old from PGi ?

We don't want to make IS mechs obsolete over night was crap as usual ?

feeling that getting my daughter into aion is going to be a benefit

Eh, he's being panicky... the balance between the two tech lines is amazingly good. (I didn't think it was going to be that way before yesterday's test at all.)

[C E Dwyer]

Pygar, on 13 June 2014 - 08:46 AM, said:

Well if nothing else, I would assume PGI will make Clan mechs available as trial mechs fairly soon, if not right away after launch. They haven't said anything about it, but it's practically a given because A: It helps them sell the product, and B: They have done about everything else in their power with the Clans to avoid this turning into a "Have vs. Have Not" situation like you are describing.

Also, IS mechs with good builds and pilots can still do well from what I saw yesterday.

I'm not really interested in playing any form of clan mech and if I can't be competitive with the 137 mechs in my stable they get zip no more money out of me period, its sounding more and more like I predicted over a year ago PGi introduce clans they make everything other than clan mechs targets.

[Pygar]

Cathy, on 13 June 2014 - 02:39 PM, said:

I'm not really interested in playing any form of clan mech and if I can't be competitive with the 137 mechs in my stable they get zip no more money out of me period, its sounding more and more like I predicted over a year ago PGi introduce clans they make everything other than clan mechs targets.

The mechs you own are fine... the way this is going to work is Clan mechs have more damage output, but much of it is lost in D.O.T. mechanics- against moving targets the extra damage tends to disappear into the ether- on the other hand, Clan mechs really aren't that much more difficult to kill than IS mechs...so IS mechs that can survive and get kills in the current environment are still going to work next week post launch. (and it may even turn out that "meta" mechs as we know them now might not change that much at all, until the new JJ nerfs hit.)

Like I said in my above post- Before I saw it all in action yesterday on the Test Server I didn't think PGI's plan for keeping the Clans in balance was going to work at all...after seeing it all in action I'm really impressed, PGI did the best possible job of keeping the Clans feeling like they have the advanced technology, while at the same time not leaving the IS pilots out in the cold. (Due largely to IS mechs being much better than they actually should be, as well as the clever ideas PGI and the community came up with for the Clans)

Edited by Pygar, 13 June 2014 - 03:04 PM.

[Rofl]

The funny thing about F2P models, and how people say to vote with your wallets, is people are doing exactly that. They are voting.

You think object X is awesome? You pay for it. But then someone else comes along and says object X is terrible and why did you pay for it and it's only encouraging bad behavior!

It's just like real world politics, gentlemen. Ask a hardcore lefty, they'll say the right is insane. Ask a hardcore righty, they'll say the opposite is true. Meanwhile the people in the middle watch the biggest multi-billion dollar whine fest the world has ever known. The great part is, people will equate the example and say something along the lines of this is exactly why voting with your wallet is important and not to give in when presented with a bad product.... but it offers no defense if the person thinks the product is worth the money.

[Zolaz]

Pygar, on 13 June 2014 - 02:47 PM, said:

The mechs you own are fine... the way this is going to work is Clan mechs have more damage output, but much of it is lost in D.O.T. mechanics- against moving targets the extra damage tends to disappear into the ether- on the other hand, Clan mechs really aren't that much more difficult to kill than IS mechs...so IS mechs that can survive and get kills in the current environment are still going to work next week post launch. (and it may even turn out that "meta" mechs as we know them now might not change that much at all, until the new JJ nerfs hit.)

Like I said in my above post- Before I saw it all in action yesterday on the Test Server I didn't think PGI's plan for keeping the Clans in balance was going to work at all...after seeing it all in action I'm really impressed, PGI did the best possible job of keeping the Clans feeling like they have the advanced technology, while at the same time not leaving the IS pilots out in the cold. (Due largely to IS mechs being much better than they actually should be, as well as the clever ideas PGI and the community came up with for the Clans)

So you are comparing Clan mechs with Basic skills vs Inner Sphere mechs that are probably Mastered? Clan tech will bring back brawling, able to do more damage and take more damage. Yep, sounds real balanced.