41 replies to this topic

[Soulblight]

oh god THIS ABSOLUTE PILE OF **** of a mech. Worthless is an utter understatement !

You get focused in a group of mechs, because you are skyhigh and shield your core with arms lead to what ? Yes, they take out the fully armored arms. Im so disgusted of this thing.
It has NO ROLE on a battlefield. You are not fast enough to lead the attack. You get focused in the back. You can snipe, thats the ONLY ROLE an Atlas can have. But every freaking poptart is better at that.

LRM boats, Sniper poptarts and fast stuff are clearly the winner in this game. Heavy bulky mechs are ******* preys. This game has no balance when it comes to that.

---edit--
**** this, i put 4 Er ppc on it, and aplha **** from 50Km away. Assault mech ? pfff, more like a skyhigh lightweight with 35Km/H. Or i boat that trashmech. useless fictional so-not-tabletop-trash

Edited by Soulblight, 26 June 2014 - 02:44 AM.

[Soulblight]

As predicted, with a fast medium i punch way harder and its even easy to take out the big guys. Run around them and hit from the back. Run away. Rinse and repeat. Its an almost braindead way to make goo ddmg and contribute and you dont even rely on the team (i treat my team a enemy now, since they are useless)

[Tarriss Halcyon]

Now, see, that's where you have a problem. Atlas is by no means an easy mech. I'm teaching a new guy to play, which means he only has access to the trial mechs. First thing he went for, the trial Atlas. He got picked to shreds in under two minutes because the rest of the team, barring my Summoner, went too far from him to be of any help.

If you want to play Atlas, you can brawl with it, or build like Konniving showed and laserboat. But, in both cases, YOU MUST RELY ON YOUR TEAM. If you want to solo, don't run a slow assault. I soloqueue in Dire Wolves and Stalkers, and I have to admit, my success with those mechs is dependent on both my strategy, any team strategy my pug group can come up with, hell, even the old "follow the frakking Atlas" adage.

But, do not view your teammates as useless, or whine about poptarts. This is not an easy game by any definition of the word. The learning curve is immense, and you have to find your own playstyle before you can really get comfortable. Seriously, if you need help, follow the advice you get offered, and don't just shoot your mouth on the forums. Besides, the damage doesn't really matter, it's more whether or not you pull your weight. For me, that's through kills just as much as damage. For most early players, it's survival time. If they survive the match, then they're doing great.

Also, that last statement "I treat my team as an enemy since they are useless" is in total contradiction to your thread title, "I'm a total liability to the team". Raises the question which is true - is the team bad, or are you simply out of practice?

[Tim East]

Well, I'm mostly a psychotic light driver these days, but assaults have their place. That place is in a group. I can't back-core you at leisure if your buddy will one-shot me for moving at your speed.

Also, I see that you mention the ERPPC in your post. I know that many people complain about the hit detection for these being spotty at times, and using that many of them undoubtedly causes you to contend with ghost heat, either by not alpha-ing or shutting down. I don't really see pure sniper Atlases very often on the field these days, given how slow they are and how meta builds do what they do much more efficiently. Have you considered fielding yourself as a brawler? Most Atlases can (and do) fit a variety of armaments suitable to such a setup.

I'm not really the best person to ask about assault setups, but if I remember correctly, you can fit at least one of the newly improved SRMs and an AC20 onto every Atlas chassis, which should give you a solid close-range punch.

Also, lol-ninja'd on the "don't go it alone" part of my rant. Ah well, such is life.

[Soulblight]

i stick with sniper setup. i can alpha stuff. well i overheat after one strike and enemies take me out during that period.1 kill is good enough.

[Itsalrightwithme]

If you solo pug most of the time, you know that in order to do well you have to be able to undo the mistakes done by other pugs. So that means either you can move fast, or kill quickly, or preferably both.

That's why top solo puggers like builds like the 6xMLas Jenner F, or Ember, or 8xCERMLas Nova, or 2xCERPPC Gauss TBR, or at the top end of tonnage the Dire Wolf with lots of weapons or maybe the brawler D-DC.

The thing is, the better D-DC builds run 60 kph. Most of its weapons are in RT/LT, so the arms are sacrificial.

Long story short, the RS is in a bad spot right now. Running a PPC RS build is terribad because the arms are so low and the mech is either slow, or too hot, or both.

If you like PPCs then get a CTF 3D with 2PPC 1Gauss or 2PPC 1AC5. You can build it either with XL or STD, for pugging I rather have XL so that I can undo the mistakes of pugs more quickly and efficiently. For team drops you can do STD so that you can tank better.

[Pekiti]

Soulblight, on 26 June 2014 - 04:05 AM, said:

i stick with sniper setup. i can alpha stuff. well i overheat after one strike and enemies take me out during that period.1 kill is good enough.

To me, this translates to

I'm determined to BE a liability to my team, by fitting the worst weapon package on the biggest tonnage mech we're allowed to bring, using poor fire discipline, and then dying uselessly. I'm totally OK with that, since I consider every other mech on the battlefield (blue, green and red) to be my enemy. While I wait for the match to end and unlock my mech, I'll go to the forums and troll people about the Atlas.

All assault mechs are meant to be paired with a lighter/faster mech. The assault provides the serious firepower and tankage, the more agile partner provides close defense and early warning of threats, as well as contributing firepower. If you insist on dropping solo, then playing solo, you will DIE solo on a regular basis. Adjust your build so you have some capacity to help at long range while you drive to the Big Fight. Pay attention to cover around you and use it. Keep torso twisting even when you are not taking fire - this will prevent you from being surprised by flanking threats. Use your R key to target the things you are shooting at - no it won't help you hit them, but it will tell your team mates that there is a threat, and you might get some help. Your job in the Atlas is to avoid getting heavily damaged in the early part of the match, so that you will fresh in the latter part- where a fresh, fully armed Atlas at close/medium range is a thing of terror for the enemy.

EDIT: If you are constantly firing then shutting down because of heat, either your build needs adjustment (including weapon grouping) or you need to change the way you fire at things - it is almost never a good idea to shutdown on a battlefield. Seriously, if you know you're going to shutdown because of heat on the next trigger pull, and you do it anyway, it better be the match winning shot or you've got no excuse to complain about it on the forums.

Edited by Pekiti, 26 June 2014 - 04:39 AM.

[Tim East]

Soulblight, on 26 June 2014 - 04:05 AM, said:

i overheat after one strike and enemies take me out during that period.1 kill is good enough.

Actually, no it kind of isn't. Trading an Atlas for whatever you shot with it before you overheat and get ganked/explode is AT BEST an even trade. You really should be looking toward longevity in your builds if you want to perform well in terms of C-bills and XP. Shutting down is even more terribad nowadays than it used to be, since you damage your CT through armor based on how far over the heat limit you go.

[Itsalrightwithme]

Soulblight, on 26 June 2014 - 04:05 AM, said:

i stick with sniper setup. i can alpha stuff. well i overheat after one strike and enemies take me out during that period.1 kill is good enough.

That's not sniping, that's suicide-rushing.

[Anubis Ka]

I run the D-DC variant with 2 Large Lasers, 2 AC5 and a SRM6. 4 tons of AC5 ammo, 1 ton of srm ammo and loaded with double heatsinks.
Those MadCat/Timberwolf all are afraid of get crushed like the kittens/puppies they are.
I can take up to 3 before I loose all weapons. The reason is the Atlas can take the damage as well as dealing it.

Edited by Anubis Ka, 26 June 2014 - 05:46 AM.

[Kyynele]

I hope that you do take into consideration that practically everyone in your team and enemy team are piloting mechs with maxed efficiencies, which make a huge deal in battle performance.

I'm saying this because, if you had full elites or mastery on Atlases, you'd probably own the D-DC already and wouldn't bother with the RS except for intentionally goofing around.

Sadly, the main reasons you see Atlases in game:
1) It's the D-DC. It's big, decently powerful, and has ECM. ECM makes up for most of the Atlases huge flaws.
2) It's the Boar's Head or the Founders' D. It has a C-Bill bonus.
3) It's the RS(C) some poor soul has mistaken to pilot as trial. Sub-100 damage to be expected.
4) It's some of the other bad ones someone is piloting to grind efficiencies to elite the D-DC.

Edit: anyway, here's something I've used in a Stalker when I've just wanted to alpha stuff: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7326b355464ebd5

Edited by Kyynele, 26 June 2014 - 06:28 AM.

[Bigbacon]

dude don't feel bad....

Up until the clan launch I thought I was a medium skilled player and now I am not....I am mostly worthless now even in mechs I used to be very good with. I get nothing done, end up with a lot of rounds now where I did absolutely nothing to help even though I attempt to help the most that I can...

I don't want to blame the clans because I do use the Nova but they have drastically changed the game at least on my end/skill level to the point I SUCK at this game now.

on the other end I keep having a lot of rounds now where I end up with like 500-900 damage dealt but zero kills and zero components destroyed...like I damage stuff but never enough or in the same place. still helping the team but at the same time sort of not.

Edited by Bigbacon, 26 June 2014 - 06:18 AM.

[Koniving]

I want to see your build, Soul, because something is fairly wrong here. Also are you familiar with ghost heat?
It triggers when you fire certain weapons together or too many. If you're not you should mention it so we know.

Also, more Atlas vids. I'll be taking some today in the field against clan mechs as well.

Spoiler

A joke build loosely supported by an ECM light. (My voice is the only one in the match; the other voices are in a separate match in the same TS as the camera man didn't record his own voice. It's literally only me and the light recording me in this joke build with 2 tons of ammo per weapon and grossly underweight.) Note that I have a LOT of rear and front armor or this mech would NEVER survive this abuse from being surrounded.


The second match here has my Atlas RS where I'm isolated from the team and picking off enemies. It's all about positioning. It's the SHS laser boat. Starts at 4 minutes. Notice that even isolated, there is still support.


Kon, Shar, Himself. This is how Atlases are meant to be run. Constantly advancing, but supported by others. With two Atlases and a Centurion support mech leading a charge, the rest of the team will follow or lose. Notice that this is an endurance build, designed to never shutdown even though I push it right to a shutdown anyway. Shutdown without support = death. You can't build a machine to shut down. (I love the music in this one)


In this one, multiple meta Miseries are taken out in rapid series in the second match. In the first, it shows how to deal with River City assault in a productive way when you have a brawling rig. Also fun colors because green night vision sucks.

[Rogue Jedi]

Bigbacon, on 26 June 2014 - 06:15 AM, said:

dude don't feel bad....

Up until the clan launch I thought I was a medium skilled player and now I am not....I am mostly worthless now even in mechs I used to be very good with. I get nothing done, end up with a lot of rounds now where I did absolutely nothing to help even though I attempt to help the most that I can...

I don't want to blame the clans because I do use the Nova but they have drastically changed the game at least on my end/skill level to the point I SUCK at this game now.

on the other end I keep having a lot of rounds now where I end up with like 500-900 damage dealt but zero kills and zero components destroyed...like I damage stuff but never enough or in the same place. still helping the team but at the same time sort of not.

getting a kill is great but helping the team get the kill is just as important, I am frequently geting 3 kill games in a Kit Fox, often with about 150 damage, I am not intentionaly stealing kills, what I do is provide ECM cover to freindly Assualts, in exchange I oftern get cheep kills (fire the last shot that kills the enemy), I have appoligised before in chat when a single MG bulit or fraction or a Laser beam kills a mech, only to get a reply something like "no prob thanks for ECM"

damage and assists/kills show how helpful you have been, if you suvive having caused 500 damage and 1 assist on a win it sugests you were not especialy helpful (you would have removed all armor from an assult but not killed it), 500 damage and 3-10 assists suggests you were of great assistance, 50 damage and 6 kills (yes I have seen it) means you may have been of little help, just finishing off crippeled mechs.

I have won a game for my team but done 0 damage, a spotter or ECM support mech (or a light capping in conquest) can be instrumental to the teams victory but never fire a shot, while a charge by a single mech can score a lot of damage but loose you the game

Edited by Rogue Jedi, 26 June 2014 - 06:51 AM.

[AlmightyAeng]

Soulblight, take a deep breathe! Let me point out how a few things have changed, and what the Atlas can currently do very well.

1) The Atlas does not snipe as well as other mechs that are now available. Why?
A) They have low-slung arms, making "hill-humping" difficult. You outline your whole silhouette as a target in order to bring your weapons to bear, and everything fires at you.
B ) In order to take enough heatsinks to fire a bunch of PPC's for sniping effectively, your engine is small. Small engine means you can't reposition effectively, which is important for a Sniper.
C) They don't have JJ. Jumpjets allow poptarting, and allow repositioning. They aren't ESSENTIAL on a sniper, but on an ASSAULT sniper, the added mobility is a godsend.

2) The Atlas does not "lead the charge" effectively. Why?
A) You are big. You are a known weapons platform. You are seen as a threat.
B ) When an Atlas crests a hill first, your enemy thinks the following. "Oh ****, an Atlas. Those things carry a lot of weapons. But, they also have a big CT...I'll shoot at that first." They all think this...together, and you DIE."

3) The Atlas DOES brawl effectively, however, and is an EXCELLENT mech to have just BEHIND the tip of the spear (A Stalker is probably THE best mech for leading a charge).
A) To brawl effectively, you want at LEAST a STD 325 engine...in my D-DC I run a 350. This helps your mobility in terms of sticking with your team, but also makes your torso twist FASTER, allowing you to soak damage in your arms.
B ) PGI recently unfucked SRM's...take advantage of this and brawl with them. They hit like they're supposed to again.
C) Try something like THIS BUILD for your Atlas-RS.
D) With a STD 350, and decent to middling heat efficiency, you'll be able to get close, and do the alpha-twist-alpha-twist repeat dance in a brawl...and when you aren't the focus of the enemy, just bear down and UNLOAD firepower.
E) The SRM4 spread is pretty tight, even without artemis, and with the increased refire rate, I actually prefer them to SRM6 WITH Artemis. Use them with your AC/20 and Medium lasers inside that 270m butter zone.
F) The 2 LL will hit like 4 additional ML's, but give you some longer range utility so you don't feel helpless outside 270m, and if you can keep 2 on target, a lot of pilots WILL duck back into cover, giving you the opportunity to close using cover.

4.) The Atlas is scariest close up...so an Atlas that can get close up BETTER is scarier than one that cannot. Enter, the King of Atlases, the D-DC.
A) With ECM, you don't have to worry as much about missiles, and more importantly, you can be an Atlas Ninja. Better yet, you can make your GROUP a ninja, and then go support it. With ECM covering your signal, you also aren't identified and targeted as quickly. This is why the D-DC is often considered the BEST Atlas...but the others are still very effective.

Hang in there! And, if you want to try other roles, let us know...we're happy to recommend good chassis for various jobs.

See you on the field, Soulblight.

Edited by Ghost Badger, 26 June 2014 - 07:02 AM.

[Itsalrightwithme]

To quote the French Marshal Pierre Bosquet, upon seeing the folly that was the Charge of the Light Brigade:

C'est magnifique, mais ce n'est pas la guerre."
("It is magnificent, but it is not war.")

Edited by Itsalrightwithme, 26 June 2014 - 07:19 AM.

[Bacon_Warrior88]

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...0cc7aca0c1365cb

[AlmightyAeng]

Tiggo Bitties, on 26 June 2014 - 07:37 AM, said:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...0cc7aca0c1365cb

Very similar to mine...but significantly hotter, larger spread on your SRM's, and marginally more range utility with the ERLL.

I would not giggle at seeing this mech, but treat it with respect on the field...but would run it slightly differently, as in my post above.

Edited by Ghost Badger, 26 June 2014 - 07:38 AM.

[xXBagheeraXx]

Soulblight, on 26 June 2014 - 04:05 AM, said:

i stick with sniper setup. i can alpha stuff. well i overheat after one strike and enemies take me out during that period.1 kill is good enough.

If you're going to run a "sniper setup" and dont want to overheat and die after one shot.....

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7b954bd3cf55042

Actually been quite successfull with that build....drummed it up during the last lurmagheddon.

It also helps that NOBODY expects long range configs on atlases, so at distances where you are usually ineffective people will stop and poke at you. then you deck them in the face...

Edited by xXBagheeraXx, 26 June 2014 - 07:48 AM.

[Soulblight]

Hodor!

Once again thank you for all your input and advice. There is - at long last - light at the end of the tunnel. Or its the flash of my lasers milliseconds before the enemies die.


1. Sniper-Setups
Oh Ghost Badger, thats spot on what you said

Spoiler

Quote

) The Atlas does not snipe as well as other mechs that are now available. Why?
A) They have low-slung arms, making "hill-humping" difficult. You outline your whole silhouette as a target in order to bring your weapons to bear, and everything fires at you.
B ) In order to take enough heatsinks to fire a bunch of PPC's for sniping effectively, your engine is small. Small engine means you can't reposition effectively, which is important for a Sniper.
C) They don't have JJ. Jumpjets allow poptarting, and allow repositioning. They aren't ESSENTIAL on a sniper, but on an ASSAULT sniper, the added mobility is a godsend.

Better players may work around this....but i cant make sniper setups work. My setup included a standard 200 engine and 4 ERPPC + Gauss (and some stripped armor here and there). The sheer madness ´made me giggle tho


2. Brawling-Setups
Several of guys posted brawling/close-range setups and tried them all Long story short, it worked. The Atlas-RS does not shine with it, but its workable and i can contribute again in a meaningful way. Personally i found the advice to conserve Health as much as possible very good, because thats what im doing now. Bounce between cover and open field, draw out missilesw, go back in cover and giggle. Ignore early rushers/suiciders . Then steamroll the enemies with good health and the help of teammates. Its not failsafe, but doable.

I was reluctant to buy the 350 std engine because ~expensive~ and ~safe weight for pew~. However, the brawling setup doenst work without it. _Absolutly not_ With them its kinda sweet and you can follow the pack rather nice. In the end i chose a close range setup (med pulse+AC20+SRM4). This is another extreme, I lose medium engagement capacity and thats quite a big blow, but i can make up for it with the facemelt-potential and cautious gameplay.

One last thing: i never considered myself much of a ballistic guy, but i was pleased how well the AC20 performs. Lobbing little volkswagons at enemies is unusually satisfying and the sheer amount of dmg awesome.


3. Switch to Atlas D-DC
Encouraged by the fact that the Atlas is not the pile garbage i thought - even if played solo - i finaly bought the D-DC-Varaint.
Yes, i can see why everyone plays it. Sometimes it feels more like catherding 1 o2 lances, but it such a sweet things to walk around like a little god,more or less safe from missiles. Its dangerous in its own may, because you suddenly feel a little to safe maybe, but the Atlas finally made click for me. Applying the tactics outlined in this topic, close range setups seem to work even better (well, thats what you would expect with ecm cover anyway) and since mechs gather around me naturally its actually enjoyable, even as SOLO-Atlas Dont regret the decision to buy this thing at all.

Anyway, thanks for your advice again, As you can see, it was not in vain, it helped i can do ~things~ now and i also kept my sanity