9 replies to this topic

[Zordicron]

I am going to put my opinions of clan hitbox performance here. I am not making this thread as an IS hitbox debate, or complaining stage for "why IS mechs arent done yet" and the like. Please make your own thread to talk about IS mech hit box issues. Please feel free to comment with your own opinions on hit box for clan mechs.

I would like to see this remain objective, as a short term tool for PGI to browse when looking for possible tweaks.

That said:

Kitfox-

I find hitbox to be rather good. I notice fairly good dmg spread on torsos and arms. Needed to keep the slower light mech alive. So far it has been rare to die from concentrated fire to one area, though it can happen. It SHOULD happen occasionally if you eat dual AC20 or gauss etc, as this is just a light mech. Overall, I am satisfied with hitbox layout on this mech.

Adder-

I find hitbox to be quite good here also. DMG spread on torsos is good, arms can shield and legs follow cannon a bit and are somewhat hidden and more difficult to hit on this mech. I tend to lose an arm before death on this mech, which I actually like because it means I got good use of my armor. Not tanky by any means, it is still a light mech and focus fire boils it alive in short order as it should. but, in a mobile longer range trade off, it doesnt feel like one alpha could be the end of the match. Overall, I am satisfied with this mech.

Nova-

I find hitbox to be lacking slightly here. I tend to see my CT take too much dmg compared to sides and legs. Arms shield OK, but only from fire directly from the side. i think this mech could use some Ct shrink down, and maybe a little of the shoulder moved to arm box so ST can expand into CT area, making dmg spread more. IMO, pelvis area should be split 50/50 with legs, it is really low slung on this mech and it would also help the Ct out some. Overall, I am about 70% satisfied with this mech. It needs some work, but it is no barn door either. (edit) did more matches, found loadouts I like better/fit chassis a little better. Still think CT is slightly too big, ST need to move in slightly to the center to spread. Using my JJ I have been able to spred dmg to legs a bit more, trick is to jump at idiotic times to trick enemy into shooting low. Works well enough I have been legged a couple times now, still dont lose ST almost ever, and arms is maybe 50% of matches, which isnt too bad, but could improve. I think the CT getting spread into ST(shrink CT) would almost completely finish this chassis.

Storm Crow-

I have not played this one yet. I will update in the future when I have some matches with them. As enemy mechs that i shoot at, they seem to do well in spreading dmg and survive fairly well for a medium mech.

Summoner-

I have only a few matches here, so i reserve this section to edit in the future. my only loadout I have run so far is 2 UAC5 in torsos and 4 ERMl in arms, and so far it is agile and a decent mid range twisty/jumpy brawler. In the few matches I have run, dmg spread was very good. Again, I havent tried many loadouts at all, so I will edit this with more detail later. EDIT/update... after playing several matches in my custom prime, and several in stock loadout(other two variants) Summoner tanks dmg like a boss. This thing is the centurian of the clan mechs, with JJ. It can be light on firepower, but it is brawly, and can take a beating. Likely the best designed/balanced hitbox of all clan mechs, possibly in the game right now.

Timberwolf-

I have not played these at all yet, will update. As an enemy, They share a tiny bit of the weakness to full front facing assault with a catapult, wherein the nose takes almost all Ct dmg from even things like SRm etc. From any angle though, the dmg spreads fantastically well, and I have only seen a few lose a side torso before the associated arm was at bad internals already. I will update this when i play it.

Warhawk-

Hit box on Warhawk is suitable for longer range fights. it takes far too much CT dmg in closer range fights. I am not sure what the culprit is here. I do tend to not lose arms at all on this mech, rather the side torso will take the arm with it. I play prime with 4 ppc, and the other two I loaded with Uac20, SRm's and one has ERLL, the other ML's. while dmg spreads ok from longer range, I attribute this to pilot innaccuracy more then hitbox, as the weakness of CT is shown when the range factor(and subsequent aiming erraticness) is removed. Overall, I am 75% pleased with this mech. I would like to see the arms move inward somehow to take a little more ST dmg, and the CT hitbox reduced in some way. Possibly with ST, but I think that removing the pelvis area completely and putting it on the leg boxes might also do the trick. Possibly taking the top "shelf" area and splitting some of that into ST may also work.

Direwolf( post recent patch)

I find hit box to be quite decent now that the CT issues have been reduced. This is another mech where the arms arent quite as good at dmg spread, but overall it takes dmg decently now. I would say i am about 85% satisfied with hit box on Direwolf(up from about 35% before patch). I would like to see pelvis are put onto legs 50/50, as I never worry about losing a leg, and even though it would completely neuter the mech(OMG slow at half of 48kph) no one aims there because the torsos are too easy to hit comparitively. I think the legs should take more dmg away from the 3 torsos both to help in survivability( it is the big bad of the clans) and also so players dont start shaving 50% of the armor off legs because of no risk.





Overall I find the dev team did a respectable job on the hit box design of these clan mechs, now that Direwolf has seen a review. With a little alteration on a few others the clan mechs would be future proof in regards to hitbox performance.

* edited nova and summoner feedback sections after more playtime in them. 7-10

Edited by Eldagore, 10 July 2014 - 07:37 PM.

[Lynx7725]

Sorry, DW had CT fixes? Don't recall seeing patch notes on it?

EDIT: Silly of me. Missed the last line on the patch notes.

Edited by Lynx7725, 02 July 2014 - 08:29 PM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

On the Warhawk hitbox, you say somehow tweak the arms so the thing takes less ST damage? How bout like this picture of it? Where the arms are shorter and kinda higher overall then what we have now.




Then lengthen the gun barrels on lasers and stuff....also, higher mounted guns would help it not have to be totally exposed to fire like it is now. id like if we got to see the end of hte gun barrels like we did in Mechwarrior 2...

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 02 July 2014 - 09:44 PM.

[Mekanïk Destruktïw Kommandöh]

I have mastered almost every clan chassis at this moment, so, here is my 5 cents:


KitFox

Uller is defiantly oversized, but the real problem is his wide spread geometry:
- legs are huge and tall and could be shot from every angle
- arms are sooo spreaaad and has so few armor that are instantly blown off
- on top of that he has huge CT too


His limbs are huge, poor covered by armor and wide spread.
So, you could see limbless Uller almost every match, seemed this is pretty normal for him.
And very few of those crippled poor creatures will survive till the end of game.
Yes, he has ECM and this is the only excuse, this mech could arrive on the battlefield.
In summary, Uller is a very-very sad mech.

And as I said many times before, 106 km\ph is a death sentence to light.



Adder

Adder is even more overblown in size than Ully and has huge CT and torsos.
His arms are spread too, but not so wide as Uller's.
The real problem are his torsos.
May be my bad luck, but I so often were shot in back (including my teammates) and half of Puma get vaporized in moment...

Cicada is oversized too, but at least, she has compact geometry.
But Puma doesn't.
Addy is big and slow as a giant tortoise.
The only good thing I could say about Puma, is that he loses limbs not so often, as Ully.

BUT WAIT!
Everything what could do Puma, could do Ryoken, but faster, well-protected and armed, with more tons of ammo and heatsinks.
So, here we have a bitter end: Adder is THE worst chassis not only among clan mechs, but may be even among spheroids too.

And as I said many times before, 106 km\ph is a death sentence to light.


Nova

BlackHawk is THE most oversized mech in game at this moment.
What were devs thinking when modelling this mech, is beyond my understanding.
Nova is a bit shorter than IS mech with same tonnage, but is so freaking wide, that makes even Awesome look a bit skinny.
Surprisingly enough, Nova has good survivability and could spread damage very well, thanx to JJ.
Most vulnerable are legs.
I do not know why Ryoken has significantly bigger legs, but gets legged rarely, unlike Nova.
Sidetorsoes are extremely huge in size, but fears only pin-point shots.

So, BlackHawk is a sntrange, yet beautiful creature supposed to be a brawler, but has XXXL size.
As a second-line assistant he sucks.

StormCrow

At first glance, Ryoken is just another overgrown clanner.
His legs are so huge and tall, Heidi Klum will be envy.
But despite first impression, surviveability of Ryoken is beyond any expectations.
The only drawback are his spreaded arms that sucking a lot of damage no matter how active you are spinning your a$$.

So, Ryoken is a kind of Centurion of clanners - fast, maneuverable, thin-boned yet well armored and has fierce firepower.



Summoner

Good-old buddy Thor, what have they done to you?
Ah, the war, you said.
Then OK.
Anyway, in terms of gameplay, Thor shows an example of exceptional surviveability.
All his parts behave right as you could expect, there are no any hidden flaws.
The only part, thats suffers the most, are his legs.
But that's OK for fast and maneurable mech with 5 JJ.
This is not bug, it's a feature: legs must suffer a bit to let you live in the heat of battle.

So, Thor is the most solid and firm from all the clanners and in right hands could survive in unthinkable situations.
If you could accept his minimalistic loadouts, you will love this tough agile mech.



Timber Wolf

The ikon of the whole franchise is not only crazy fast and moblile, but pretty well build to withstand in any fight.
At first, I thought he will be something like Stalker with narrow CT anh wide vulnerable sidetorsos.
But in fact, despite of his big nose, MadCat doesn't attract every shot nearby and could spread damage very well.
All of us knows what a pain in the a$$ are gauss-PPC metards: not only they pin-point alphas, but the fact that they took a lot of efforts to take them down makes MadKitty may be the most dangerous enemy on the battlefield.
As a hint: try to focus their torsos from sharp angles , especially the right one, where 2\3 of their armaments usually are.

So, Kitty is propably the most balanced mech at this moment in terms of firepower\speed\agility\armour, right as he must be, depending on mech-fan expectations.



WarHawk

Masakari is another pretty-shiny clanner that will surprise you in a good way.
For a 85-tonned assault he is very agile and fast.
Despite of his reasonable size, all his locations are pretty narrow and predictable.
I mean, even when the fight is not in your favour, you know that right at this moment you will sacrifice this particulary part, but will live and probably win.

So, with good amount of armour, Masakari is extremely reliable, solid and enough agile assault with the only one but bitter flaw: poor CERPPC hit-detection (but this is the theme for another thread).



Dire Wolf

What would you expect from 100 tons of clan technologies on two legs?
Freaking-crazy firepower in a most protected shell that will pierce through any obstacle in flares of weapons and smoke of enemy corpses.
As for the first part of suggestion, yes, this is true: 50+ tons of free space allow you to provide your wildest dreams to live.
But as for the second part, here we have some serious troubles.
Not only Daishi is the slowest mech on the field with his 53 km\ph.
Before patch, all his frontal projection was one gigantic CT.
Any damage you will take, all will be referred to CT.
And with Daishi we have got an oxymoron: unparalleled firepower that lives less than a second under not even heavy fire.
3 poptarts alphas - you a fried chichen.
WARNING INCOMING MISSILES more than from one boat - you a fried chicken.
One single enemy light without an attention - you a fried chicken.
And so on...
The only way to survive is long-ranged weapon and hiding behind teammate's backs.
But wait!
Is this a 100 tonned assault or what?!

With last patch, our Boeing becomes a much tougher, and it takes some time to bring him down.
But anyway, his aerodynamic nose is still so damn huge, he eats all the bullets flying near.
May be it is too early to make decisions, but I think, Atlas is far tougher enemy to kill in terms of accurate hitting, than Daishi.

So, Daishi has amount of firepower like no one else, but to convert all his guns in damage and kills, you are forced to take a role of a second-line assistant that is always aware of surprise butt-sеx.
All because of his speed and the fact, that his father was 747 airbus.

Edited by Mekanïk Destruktïw Kommandöh, 03 July 2014 - 01:36 AM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Mekanïk Destruktïw Kommandöh, on 03 July 2014 - 01:21 AM, said:

<Mech review>

Your broke up English made this post amusing and funny in some parts, especially in the end about the Direwolf.

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 03 July 2014 - 03:27 AM.

[Bobzilla]

I didn't notice the CT changes to the DWF. I still got cored with no other armor even being breached, or ended the match with only the CT armor gone. And I was running a build for alpha twist alpha twist.

[Ultimax]

Mekanïk Destruktïw Kommandöh, on 03 July 2014 - 01:21 AM, said:

I have mastered almost every clan chassis at this moment, so, here is my 5 cents:

Your review was informative and amusing, but this was my favorite part.

Mekanïk Destruktïw Kommandöh, on 03 July 2014 - 01:21 AM, said:

Summoner

Good-old buddy Thor, what have they done to you?
Ah, the war, you said.
Then OK.

[Ovion]

Sizes of the Clan Mechs seem fine to me:

Spoiler

Locust is around 9M tall, Atlas is 18M tall. Clan Mechs are pretty much fine for their sizes.

Admitedly some things are off, like the Catapult vs Stalker argument, but most of it's 'ok'.

[Shae Starfyre]

Didn;t someone use to do mechlab pictures of the hitboxes; I'd like to see this for the Direwolf with the new CT changes.

[Mekanïk Destruktïw Kommandöh]

LordKnightFandragon, on 03 July 2014 - 03:27 AM, said:

Your broke up English made this post amusing and funny in some parts, especially in the end about the Direwolf.

- What happen ?
- Somebody set up us the bomb.
- We get signal.
...
- You have no chance to survive make your time.
- For teh great justice! :3

Edited by Mekanïk Destruktïw Kommandöh, 03 July 2014 - 02:29 PM.