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#21 Shar Wolf

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:06 PM

View PostOvion, on 14 July 2014 - 01:49 PM, said:

This build FIREBRAND can be ran on any Jagermech, and is very effective.

You could drop the BAP and put in an extra 1.5T of ammo, but I've found the faster target locks and sensor range, plus ECM countering is worth it so I can focus my crit-seeking boomsticks.

You basically find a target and just don't stop shooting till its dead.
I've taken this build to 800 damage myself. I've seen others (better pilots than me) break 13-1400 in it.

It's possibly my best performing mech.

You tried the 2xLBAC 4MG JM6-DD yet?

#22 BigFatGator

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:17 PM

Here is the 3AC5 loadout without the XL on a JM-S
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...6855b1cdf97ff06

Dual LB10X on JM-S
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...61f33bf4907da34

LB10X effectiveness depends on map and team. I've had epic awesome games with it on brawling maps, and some frustrating matches on Alpine.

Advantages to LB10X- runs cooler than AC10, is a ton lighter, and one less crit.
If you're going to suffer with an XL in a Jager, might as well go dual AC20 or gauss though.
The LB10X on Jager should only be used with STD engine IMHO.

#23 Ovion

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:22 PM

View PostShar Wolf, on 14 July 2014 - 02:06 PM, said:

You tried the 2xLBAC 4MG JM6-DD yet?
Sadly not.
I am out of Mechbays, and a bit skint atm, so don't have a DD yet.

Debating selling my Thunderbolt off, as I don't especially care for it, doubly so witth 2 other (better) 65T mechs in the Cats and Jagers.

But once I do, I'll try it out.
Then on to the DapperJager for it.

#24 Tarriss Halcyon

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Posted 16 July 2014 - 09:37 PM

LBs are devastating weapons on Clan mechs, and pretty darn effective on IS ones as well. As long as you have something to cause armor damage (lasers, primarily, although my Grid Iron uses SRMs for the same reason), then it's at it's maximum damage. For example, my Grid Iron shot it's LBX into a Hunchback charging at me during a rather large team brawl. Enemy Hunchback was crit over both side torsos and CT. My shot took off both arms, both side torsos, AND the CT. That's right. One shot destroyed all of his upper body barring head. Sure, he was already damaged, but the fact that I got five component destructions is something I adore. I've also got kills with a delay before - landed the LB shot from my LB Dragon on a Jager's crit LT, and after three seconds (and some allied LRM fire hitting his armored CT and RT, I got a kill given to me, despite not shooting at him over that time. Why? The LB had crit ammo, and the resulting explosion took out his CT.

Watch out in close-quarters against Dire Wolves, as well - I run a LB10X/2xLB5X build with PPCs for range & armor stripping, but I saw someone who was running 2xLB20X/2xLB5X - 50 points of crit-seeking damage. It all comes down to the role you're aming for - damage or kills. They aren't the most effective damage weapons (although they're more accurate than the C-UACs due to burst fire), but they are incredibly dangerous in brawls due to the chance of crits.

#25 SaltBeef

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Posted 16 July 2014 - 10:52 PM

Clan LBX's are going to be able to use both types of ammo from what the devs said before. you will be able to switch between 2 types of ammo standard and cluster. Just like the tech readout states.
They will become very popular then. Work on them with the standard ammo whence armor is reduced on target keystroke to Cluster round and shotgun boom down he goes.
I am sure there will be a clank sound while round is dumped reloaded.

Edited by SaltBeef, 05 August 2014 - 12:37 AM.


#26 The Basilisk

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Posted 16 July 2014 - 11:43 PM

View Postxeromynd, on 14 July 2014 - 10:48 AM, said:

Think of the LB10 as a shotgun.
-Spread fire weapon.
-10 bullets per fire, each does 1 pt of damage
-Less range, and damage is spread out (not pinpoint)
-Higher chance to hit criticals (when hitting an opponent's internals)
-Takes up less tonnage and (i believe) less slots

Think of the AC10 as a rifle.
-Single shot
-10 pts of damage per 1 bullet
-Higher range
-Greater pinpoint damage (all dmg is delivered to a single location)

Personally, I LOVE the LB10 over the AC10 because of the sound and I think it's an intimidating weapon when you blast it at someone's face. I've also found the thing about crits being true, I tend to blow off a LOT more components with the LBX.

vv Important vv
But the current meta really does NOT favor short range combat, (unless you like doing nothing for the first 5 minutes of a match) so for now I'd stick with an AC10.


Öhm no the AC10 has a lower range than the LB-X ( AC10 450m and LB-X 540m )
Further more the AC10 has a slower projectile speed an higher dmg fallof.

AC10 delivers tedium dmg at low projectile speed and low range for insane weight, space and ammo consumption.
In addition to that it generates heat, not terribly much ( like PPC ) but too much to be effective when you use additional hotter weapons like SRM and Lasers or PPC.
Never take a AC10 if you can get a PPC.

The LB-X isn't exactly for doing the primary dmg on a Mech with full health.
Its a reliable, cool and easy to aim support weapon with medium refire rate and okish dmg output.
Used against dmged, slow or very large Mechs its a devestating weapon that delivers not only crippling internals but considderable shake and will block sightlines through VFX.

Again its not a primary weapon until you use more than one at ranges below 300m !

#27 Ovion

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 12:06 AM

It's even longer range than that.

The AC10 is 450/900M.
The LBX10 is 540/1620M.

It's a devastating weapon overall, you just sandblast the enemy to death. : D

#28 xeromynd

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 07:26 AM

View PostOvion, on 17 July 2014 - 12:06 AM, said:

It's even longer range than that.

The AC10 is 450/900M.
The LBX10 is 540/1620M.

It's a devastating weapon overall, you just sandblast the enemy to death. : D


Wow that is...odd. Never even compared the two, I always thought the LBX was shorter range.

#29 kosmos1214

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 02:14 PM

well heres what i run on my jm6-dd
2lbx ac10s
2mlazers
4mguns
250 xl engine
7 tons lbx ac 10 ammo
3 tons mgun ammo
you will need to use eather farro or endo steel mine has farro but im working a changeing it to endo

#30 Ovion

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 02:27 PM

Endo. Ferro is just not worth it past Light Mechs imo.

I'd drop a ton of MG for another ton of LBX10 ammo tbh.
That's 1000 rounds an MG, and 60 shots an LBX10.

Looking forward to running a DapperJager, or variant thereof Soon™

#31 kosmos1214

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 02:56 PM

um 1 ton of lbx ammo is 15 shots man
and yah my jager was built b4 i fully under stood the diferance between endo and ferro

#32 Ovion

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 11:05 PM

View Postkosmos1214, on 17 July 2014 - 02:56 PM, said:

um 1 ton of lbx ammo is 15 shots man
and yah my jager was built b4 i fully under stood the diferance between endo and ferro
Yes, and and -1T MG, +1T LBX, you'd have 4 tons per cannon, for 8T, 120 shots total, or 60 each.

#33 Greyboots

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 02:50 PM

View PostVallin Shae, on 14 July 2014 - 10:38 AM, said:

I was wondering because I'm kind of new to he game. Is the LB 10-X AC a really good weapon or should I take an Ac/10 or maybe even a AC/20 ?


The LBX autocannons are a "second half" weapon. Time after time I see people trying to use them in the first half of the game when everyone is sitting 500m+ from eachother and armour is fresh and shiny. They don't do very well as a general rule and it's pretty much a waste of ammo.

Wait until the second half, however, and LBX cannons come into their own at midrange and shorter (about 400m or less). The LBX cannon has an increased chance to crit and a damage bonus when critting meaning you'll disable enemy weaponry quite quickly in close-in fights provided you have armour holes to shoot into. This means is'a a DEFENSIVE weapon that helps you live longer so, naturally, the damage on them isn't "uber".

Despite what many people think, they are GREAT weapons with the drawback being that they are also situational weapons. People who love LBX cannons generally love them because they understand the situations in which they excel. It's best to think of them as if they have a max range of about 450 meters, don't waste ammo on anything beyond that range. and concentrate on stuff other people are shooting at so you can capitalise on the armour holes they're making.

Should you take something else? Well... That depends. Do you want to be throwing damage across the battlefield at range? Then yes, take something else. Do you want to be making armour holes? Then it's probably a good idea to take something else but you can do this at the right range and plenty of ammo, take the LBX is you think you can swing the ammo required. Do you want to be shredding already damaged opponents in the last half of the match? Take the LBX cannon.

My 2 cents anyway.

#34 Vassago Rain

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 02:56 PM

LXB is one of the worst weapons in the game, but conversely also one of the most fun.

It's devastating against less experienced players, who panic when their entire paperdoll starts flashing. As an actual weapon? Very bad.

#35 Void Angel

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 03:24 PM

Not necessarily; certainly not always. For example, take a Brawling D-DC. Since you have two ballistic slots on that chassis, your close combat choices are the AC/20 - or two LB-10Xs. If you go with the LB stack, you have two scatter weapons with the same total damage as the AC/20; many people stop thinking at this point and conclude that the AC/20 is clearly better. However, the LB stack is firing sixty per cent faster. That makes a huge difference, particularly at the close quarters you need to use your SRMs anyway. The LB-10X is an excellent part of an Atlas brawler setup.

Now, I'm not using it currently; not because I found its firepower inferior - quite the opposite - but because I was fiddling with the effects of a faster engine to counter the extreme Hide At Them Till They Break behaviors I was seeing in my teammates. My conclusion is that it largely depends on your playing style, and who you're playing with/against. If you're up against skilled meta-humping poptarts... well, the Atlas is weak against that stuff no matter what you bring. However, the metagame is changing, or at least fluctuating, with the advent of Clan Battlemechs. If the current trends continue, I may very well drag out my Hillbilly Shotgun Atlas and go varmint hunting.

#36 Flak Kannon

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 03:27 PM

HI V.

The LBx10 is good, it just doesn't shine.

The AC10 is all or nothing.. if you miss, you miss. With the LBx10, it's hard to completely miss.

Another thing to consider, it weighs 11 ton, the AC10 weighs 12 tons. That one ton savings will allow you to carry one ton more ammo for the same weight of the AC10.

So 15 Tons will get you LBX10 and 60 rounds or AC10 and 45 rounds.. that's a plus to the LBX10.

Max range of the LBx10 is 1620 meters.. albeit rather scattered..
Max range of the AC10 is 900 meters.

Another plus to the LBX10.


Also, the critical chance to the internal components is high with the LBX10, so late game you can saw off arms and legs.. and blow out torsos. But the pinpoint damage of the AC10 can end a mech in the same way to a specific component... but it is harder to hit a specific area on a damaged mech sometimes in the heat of battle.. It say the trade off is a wash.


AC10s are good early round and good late round. LBx10's are ok early round, and great late round.



One of the best mechs Ive ever run is my Ilya Muromets with 3 LBX10s and 3 Medium Lasers... it's wow factor and it's scare factor used to be really high.. haven't run it in a while. I might try it again.

#37 Void Angel

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 03:31 PM

PS:

View PostOvion, on 17 July 2014 - 12:06 AM, said:

It's even longer range than that.

The AC10 is 450/900M.
The LBX10 is 540/1620M.

It's a devastating weapon overall, you just sandblast the enemy to death. : D
Uhm, no. Patch notes for the win, bud.

View Postxeromynd, on 17 July 2014 - 07:26 AM, said:

Wow that is...odd. Never even compared the two, I always thought the LBX was shorter range.

Well, it's got an effectively shorter range, because of the spread. The pellets do damage out to longer ranges in part as a way to mitigate the effect of all that scattering; but because of that same scatter, its effective damage at longer ranges will be less at any range the AC/10 is still doing anything at all. :P

If you're not hitting with the center of your LB-10X spread, you're using it wrong. The LB-10X has faster projectiles, so hitting a fast target with the center of your spread is much easier than hitting with the AC/10 round - but if anyone is thinking of taking it as a hedge against bad marksmanship, they should stop right away. Because of the LB-X series' scatter, it is imperative that your own accuraccy be dialed in.

Edited by Void Angel, 18 July 2014 - 03:32 PM.


#38 Vassago Rain

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 04:30 PM

View PostVoid Angel, on 18 July 2014 - 03:24 PM, said:

Not necessarily; certainly not always. For example, take a Brawling D-DC. Since you have two ballistic slots on that chassis, your close combat choices are the AC/20 - or two LB-10Xs. If you go with the LB stack, you have two scatter weapons with the same total damage as the AC/20; many people stop thinking at this point and conclude that the AC/20 is clearly better. However, the LB stack is firing sixty per cent faster. That makes a huge difference, particularly at the close quarters you need to use your SRMs anyway. The LB-10X is an excellent part of an Atlas brawler setup.

Now, I'm not using it currently; not because I found its firepower inferior - quite the opposite - but because I was fiddling with the effects of a faster engine to counter the extreme Hide At Them Till They Break behaviors I was seeing in my teammates. My conclusion is that it largely depends on your playing style, and who you're playing with/against. If you're up against skilled meta-humping poptarts... well, the Atlas is weak against that stuff no matter what you bring. However, the metagame is changing, or at least fluctuating, with the advent of Clan Battlemechs. If the current trends continue, I may very well drag out my Hillbilly Shotgun Atlas and go varmint hunting.


No, the LBX is simply bad.

Despite firing faster, you have almost zero killing power. I play twin LBX in my 'fun' DDC, and AC20 in my main DDC. You can't even compare the two.

They should have buffed the pellet damage to 1.5 or 2 years ago. Until they finally see reason, it'll remain the worst ballistic.

#39 Ovion

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 04:30 PM

View PostVoid Angel, on 18 July 2014 - 03:31 PM, said:

PS:
Uhm, no. Patch notes for the win, bud.

Well, it's got an effectively shorter range, because of the spread. The pellets do damage out to longer ranges in part as a way to mitigate the effect of all that scattering; but because of that same scatter, its effective damage at longer ranges will be less at any range the AC/10 is still doing anything at all. :P

If you're not hitting with the center of your LB-10X spread, you're using it wrong. The LB-10X has faster projectiles, so hitting a fast target with the center of your spread is much easier than hitting with the AC/10 round - but if anyone is thinking of taking it as a hedge against bad marksmanship, they should stop right away. Because of the LB-X series' scatter, it is imperative that your own accuraccy be dialed in.
Nope.

Check Smurfy (pulled directly from the game files), in game (hover stats), and in combat (mount one, find a target at 1500-1600M and watch the reticule go red).

Even today I shot a few people at 1200-1400M, so they're still hitting that range and making people think twice about going in that direction.

The LBX isn't classed as an Autocannon as such.
So the ranges are:
AC/2 - 720/1440
AC/5 - 620/1240
AC/10 - 450/900
AC/20 - 270/540

LB 10-X AC - 540/1620

C-Ultra AC/2 - 810/1620
C-Ultra AC/5 - 630/1260
C-Ultra AC/10 - 540/1080
C-Ultra AC/20 - 360/720

C-LB2-X AC - 900/1800
C-LB5-X AC - 720/1440
C-LB10-X AC - 540/1080
C-LB20-X AC - 360/720


As for always hitting with the center - not always.

Used at long range especially, hitting them with the edge, and having the slew of explosions in front of them makes them go the other way, to avoid moving into the wall of lead, which means you can guide a target to some degree.

However, since I switched to using LBX10s over AC10s / 20s my damage output (on those mechs that use them) has increased 3-4 times, my overall K/D has gone up .7pts, and my Jager is one of (if not the) best mech I use in terms of damage dealing and money making.

It's because you just don't have to stop firing.

12 Heat Sinks is enough to run heat neutral just shooting the 2 LBX10s. So with a 250+ and double heatsinks, you only need 6 engine heatsinks to cover the LBX10s and engine heat. That leaves 4 internal DHS (equal to 8HS) to cover the 2 Medium Lasers (on my Jager at least).

The means you can just fire nonstop till you run out of ammo if you need to, without overheating - even in Caustics Caldera and Terra Therma in general, and just flay your target to death with continuous fire and copious amounts of screen shake.

#40 Vxheous

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 04:47 PM

I run my Dire Wolf B as a troll build, and use 2x Clan LBX-10, and 2x Clan LBX-20. I am deadly within 300m, and like most people have said, a wrecking ball in the 2nd half of the game. I just have to buy time for the enemy to get tired of the sniping and make a push.





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