Jump to content

45 Ton Mech Engines!


65 replies to this topic

#1 Foxwalker

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Knight Errant
  • Knight Errant
  • 962 posts
  • LocationLost on Thunder Rift

Posted 13 August 2014 - 08:27 PM

I would like to propose that the standard engine cap for Blackjacks and the soon to come Vindicators be increased from 235 to at least 250. Similar to the Hunchbacks and Centurions, that got a bump from 260 up to 275.

I think this is a needed boost to bring them inline with the other mediums for agility.

#2 Vassago Rain

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Bridesmaid
  • Bridesmaid
  • 14,396 posts
  • LocationExodus fleet, HMS Kong Circumflex accent

Posted 13 August 2014 - 08:46 PM

No robot should ever be stuck with less than 250 engine max.

#3 FDJustin

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 440 posts

Posted 13 August 2014 - 08:49 PM

Uhh... Sure... But I want to see those huge torso yaw boost quirks go away in that case.

#4 John1352

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 1,025 posts
  • LocationConnecting....

Posted 13 August 2014 - 08:52 PM

I agree, at least that way mediums will be able to run away from timberwolves as they are annihilated.

View PostVassago Rain, on 13 August 2014 - 08:46 PM, said:

No robot should ever be stuck with less than 250 engine max.


If this happened, the first thing I would do is buy a locust!

#5 Heeden

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 792 posts

Posted 13 August 2014 - 08:58 PM

I'd like to see mediums get a general speed increase, they're out-gunned by lights at higher speeds and heavies at middlish speeds; they need a sweet spot to shine in.

#6 Carrie Harder

    Clone

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 678 posts
  • LocationCarrying pugs up Mount Tryhard

Posted 13 August 2014 - 09:06 PM

View PostVassago Rain, on 13 August 2014 - 08:46 PM, said:

No robot should ever be stuck with less than 250 engine max.

It wouldn't be so bad if the first 10 sinks you need were all located inside the engine itself, rather than needing to allocate some outside. Then you'd get the full benefits of Trudubs™ as well as not being taxed of critslots.

(Yes, engine weights would be adjusted accordingly to represent all the sinks inside them, but the end result tonnage would be the same. You'd just save critslots).

Edited by Carrie Harder, 13 August 2014 - 09:07 PM.


#7 Y E O N N E

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Nimble
  • The Nimble
  • 16,810 posts

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:00 PM

View PostJohn1352, on 13 August 2014 - 08:52 PM, said:

I agree, at least that way mediums will be able to run away from timberwolves as they are annihilated.



If this happened, the first thing I would do is buy a locust!


You would only get ~2.5 tons (3 if you shave the head to 5 armor) to do stuff with, assuming Ferro and Endo and max armor. You would be super fast, though. Mind the bumps!

In canon, there are a versions of the Locust with XL 240 and XL 280. However, they don't show up until much, much later.

#8 Mcgral18

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • CS 2019 Top 8 Qualifier
  • CS 2019 Top 8 Qualifier
  • 17,987 posts
  • LocationSnow

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:02 PM

It wouldn't be so bad if they weren't gimped by the heat system and losing Cap and Dissipation.

I won't argue with buffing my BJs though.

#9 627

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Wrath
  • Wrath
  • 4,571 posts

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:03 PM

View PostYeonne Greene, on 13 August 2014 - 11:00 PM, said:


You would only get ~2.5 tons (3 if you shave the head to 5 armor) to do stuff with, assuming Ferro and Endo and max armor. You would be super fast, though. Mind the bumps!

In canon, there are a versions of the Locust with XL 240 and XL 280. However, they don't show up until much, much later.


3 ML at a speed of what, 200kph? Would be enough ;)

#10 Kiri117

    Member

  • PipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 41 posts

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:08 PM

Their engine and terrain can't handle 200kph though, because they have no idea what they're doing. Somehow Living Legends could make fighter jets flying much faster work though. Hmm

#11 Yiazmat

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Spear
  • The Spear
  • 531 posts
  • LocationCentral CA

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:17 PM

Agreed. It's my belief that all medium mechs in this game need to be able to run at 105-110 kph. As it is most heavies run 90, medium mechs are at a disadvantage. Hell, my wife watched me play a few times and asked "so if you're 25 tons less, how is it he's still running circles around you? " referring to me in my ac20 hunch fighting a timber meta tool. She was right. And she had no idea about anything in this game.

Also, who let Foxwalker out of his cage?

#12 Y E O N N E

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Nimble
  • The Nimble
  • 16,810 posts

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:17 PM

Regarding the comments on Blackjacks, what are you going to do with a larger engine? The STD 225 puts it in a very good spot: you get to run at 89.1 kph, which is pretty damn quick, and you get to mount relatively heat-efficient, high-output weapons. A high-speed build is more or less going to relegate you to boating energy weapons and we've already got the BJ-1X to do that, and there's no Blackjack better at it. Not even the BJ-3.


View PostKiri117, on 13 August 2014 - 11:08 PM, said:

Their engine and terrain can't handle 200kph though, because they have no idea what they're doing. Somehow Living Legends could make fighter jets flying much faster work though. Hmm


An XL 240 puts it at 194.6 kph, so yeah, about 200 kph. I want one!

Edited by Yeonne Greene, 13 August 2014 - 11:19 PM.


#13 Carrie Harder

    Clone

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 678 posts
  • LocationCarrying pugs up Mount Tryhard

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:19 PM

View PostYeonne Greene, on 13 August 2014 - 11:17 PM, said:

An XL 240 puts it at 194.6 kph, so yeah, about 200 kph. I want one!

As for the other comments on Blackjacks, what are you going to do with a larger engine? The STD 225 puts it in a very good spot: you get to run at 89.1 kph, which is pretty damn quick, and you get to mount relatively heat-efficient, high-output weapons. A high-speed build is more or less going to relegate you to boating energy weapons and we've already got the BJ-1X to do that, and there's no Blackjack better at it. Not even the BJ-3.

The larger engines give you more Trudubs and you don't get taxed of critslots due to external DHS required by the engine. They are more optimal for the majority of builds.

#14 Wolfways

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Mercenary
  • 6,499 posts
  • LocationIn a shutdown overheated mech near you.

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:22 PM

Imo all mechs should have non-customizable stock engines ;)

#15 FDJustin

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 440 posts

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:24 PM

View PostKiri117, on 13 August 2014 - 11:08 PM, said:

Their engine and terrain can't handle 200kph though, because they have no idea what they're doing. Somehow Living Legends could make fighter jets flying much faster work though. Hmm

Network code is some of the hardest code to make, every step of the way is a different compromise.
Or it might be a limitation with the CryEngine. It's a pretty engine for sure, but it's documentation is atrocious, and people I've asked who work with it say it's very... Heavy.

#16 Impyrium

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Bad Company
  • Bad Company
  • 2,104 posts
  • LocationSouth Australia

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:29 PM

View PostWolfways, on 13 August 2014 - 11:22 PM, said:

Imo all mechs should have non-customizable stock engines ;)


Actually, I'm not sure if you meant that as a joke or not, but I'm with that. I'm sick of this whole 'Mechs have to be fast to be viable' mechanic this game has grown. It's very anti-MechWarrior/BattleTech. IMO. :\

#17 Wolfways

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Mercenary
  • 6,499 posts
  • LocationIn a shutdown overheated mech near you.

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:31 PM

View PostAUSwarrior24, on 13 August 2014 - 11:29 PM, said:


Actually, I'm not sure if you meant that as a joke or not, but I'm with that. I'm sick of this whole 'Mechs have to be fast to be viable' mechanic this game has grown. It's very anti-MechWarrior/BattleTech. IMO. :\

Oh i was serious, but nobody listens to me anymore ;)

The game was much better in closed beta when it was slower and more tactical.

#18 Y E O N N E

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Nimble
  • The Nimble
  • 16,810 posts

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:34 PM

View PostCarrie Harder, on 13 August 2014 - 11:19 PM, said:

The larger engines give you more Trudubs and you don't get taxed of critslots due to external DHS required by the engine. They are more optimal for the majority of builds.



Not sure if you were being serious, but in case you were and at risk of looking way too concerned:

With both Ferro and Endo, a STD 250 leaves you with 15.5 tons to do stuff on a 45 ton 'Mech, shaving two points off of the head to level it out. A STD 225 leaves you with 18 after including the required DHS.

With 18 tons, you can fit two AC/2, three tons of ammo, and six Small Lasers. Alternatively, you can go with an LB-10X, three tons of ammo, two Medium Lasers, and four small lasers. Or how about two machine guns with a ton of ammo, two large pulse, and four small lasers? Two machine guns with one ton of ammo, two ER large, and four mediums with two extra heatsinks? There are a great many things you can do with 18 tons.

Now, with a STD 250, we can only get two AC/2 with three tons of ammo OR one ton of ammo and four small lasers/two mediums. Or we get one LB-10X, two tons of ammo, and two mediums. Or two large pulse and a medium. Or two ER large, four mediums, and no machine guns or extra heatsinks. Or we can just boat lasers like a BJ-1X.

No matter how you slice it, it's an inferior setup to place a 250-rated engine into a Blackjack that is doing something other than boating energy weapons. A 250 engine also only puts you up to 99 kph which, while better than 89.1, is not exactly enough to save your life against a Timberwolf chasing you down. The BJ-1X works because it runs significantly faster at 116+ kph. Even with a lower-rated 280, it's still faster than the Clan light 'Mechs at 110+.

Edit for formatting.

Edited by Yeonne Greene, 13 August 2014 - 11:35 PM.


#19 pulupulu

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 183 posts

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:42 PM

View PostAUSwarrior24, on 13 August 2014 - 11:29 PM, said:


Actually, I'm not sure if you meant that as a joke or not, but I'm with that. I'm sick of this whole 'Mechs have to be fast to be viable' mechanic this game has grown. It's very anti-MechWarrior/BattleTech. IMO. :\


All pgi have to do for that is either decrease map size so no one have anywhere to run, or increase number of mechs per match to the point that most of the map is filled with mechs.

#20 Kiri117

    Member

  • PipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 41 posts

Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:51 PM

View PostFDJustin, on 13 August 2014 - 11:24 PM, said:

Network code is some of the hardest code to make, every step of the way is a different compromise.
Or it might be a limitation with the CryEngine. It's a pretty engine for sure, but it's documentation is atrocious, and people I've asked who work with it say it's very... Heavy.

Again, MW: Living Legends somehow made it work. With the CryEngine. Stock loadouts, lore values, tanks, aerospace fighters, elementals, huge maps, things going fast, things going slow, people worrying about AA and anti-infantry. Somehow it was pretty balanced, or as balanced as MWO is, with much more going on and much more CONTENT and solid mechanics.

Then it's shut down for this piece of **** that hasn't even managed to nail half the stuff that was in that game in what's by now a similar timeframe. MWO might even have MORE development time now, and the best part: Living Legends was a free mod, not a cashcow.

Bonus immersion fact: You spawn in an elemental, pick what mech you want out of a menu you pull up, then physically go down to the hangar and jump jet to your mech's cockpit, get in and power up to stomp out of the base. Or, if you want an aerospace fighter, you go next door to the runway and pick which jet you want, then take off. How awesome is that compared to "Spawn in set area, away from teammates, on small maps"





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users