112 replies to this topic

[Lefty Lucy]

xe N on, on 17 August 2014 - 08:33 AM, said:

I think one of the greatest advantage of the clans is the CERML and Clan-XL.

- range of CERML could be reduced to 320 meters.
- If Clan-XL looses side torso, movement speed should be half.

Disagree with the range. Just make it do a tad less damage, and give the ISML one less heat. That way the Clan version will be longer ranged at the cost of heat, and the IS version will be for sustained brawling. Make IS and Clans play differently.

[xe N on]

Lefty Lucy, on 17 August 2014 - 08:35 AM, said:

Disagree with the range. Just make it do a tad less damage, and give the ISML one less heat. That way the Clan version will be longer ranged at the cost of heat, and the IS version will be for sustained brawling. Make IS and Clans play differently.

To be on par with IS ML the damage need to go down to 4 oder 5. I think this would create more rage then reducing the range to 320 - 350.

[Oderint dum Metuant]

Reducing the range of a extended range weapon. .......

[xe N on]

DV McKenna, on 17 August 2014 - 08:43 AM, said:

Reducing the range of a extended range weapon. .......

It's still longer then the IS version ...

[Blacksoul1987]

xe N on, on 17 August 2014 - 08:45 AM, said:

It's still longer then the IS version ...

I prefer they keep the longer range and just make the IS ML better for brawling. later on IS will also get their own ERML and if they are not different enough there is no reason for both to exist.

[Oderint dum Metuant]

xe N on, on 17 August 2014 - 08:45 AM, said:

It's still longer then the IS version ...

10 above the IS one would still be longer but these are supposed to be extended range; significant upgrades.

There is no need to Nerf anything until the IS medium laser has its heat reduced back to where it used to be.

Blacksoul1987, on 17 August 2014 - 08:47 AM, said:

I prefer they keep the longer range and just make the IS ML better for brawling. later on IS will also get their own ERML and if they are not different enough there is no reason for both to exist.

Precisely and people don't think about this at all.

Next when the LG is introduced people will clamour to reduce its range because it's op it can hit from long range...There is such an abundance of fear over weapons that out range their opposite counterparts...

[Bront]

There's a few problems with this tourny.

1) Not all the clan mechs are available publicly for CBills (earlier this week). Heck, only 1 is, and 3 for MC. So you're mostly only seeing folks who paid for the mechs playing them. (First time I've been offended by PGI, making a clear Pay to Win tourny, but it's the first time they've done such a thing)

2) As a result, scores below the top 3 on most of the Clan leader boards are lower than they should be (scary thought) as there isn't as much competition.

3) Doing this on a weekend where folks are also piloting mechs they may not enjoy to get a free mech bay means there's likely more deadweight targets/easy kills out there, skewing the numbers even more.


That said, don't dismiss the names on the list as bad pilots. It takes some skill to get on that list, and much of that skill works fine in a real team game. You'll recognize several names there from the Team Tourney a few months ago.

[Gyrok]

MischiefSC, on 15 August 2014 - 06:54 PM, said:

The point though is to make the IS heavies TW caliber. I absolutely agree on Clan energy weapons - lasers need dialed back in range and damage. ACs are alright, missiles are alright.

IS heavies need hitboxes reworked so they're not so fragile. They need some 'hardpoint inflation' and buffs across the board in perks to make them rock solid and fun.

That's the difference. The TW is *fun* to play. It's not about having an advantage; I love playing my TW against other TWs and Clan mechs. IS mechs, conversely, are often unfun to play - on purpose. Needlessly fragile, having limited variants of which all but 1 are nerfed to be less enjoyable to grind *on purpose*. Most of the IS mechs are all around garbage - *on purpose*.

That's the issue. Balance weapons, balance Clan XL, but make the TW the new benchmark. Everything should be that FUN to play. It's a game. All the balance decisions that have treated FUN like it's some reward for having suffered enough or that not everything should be FUN, like it's some OP perk like ECM that only certain mechs get....

That's a fundamental design flaw of the game. That needs fixed.

The only weapons the clans have that are worth anything are the energy weapons, everything else is rubbish...

Leave that alone...they already run MUCH hotter and are not significantly better in general...the CERLL is basically a trashcan weapon at this point...

[Vassago Rain]

Maxx Blue, on 16 August 2014 - 07:50 AM, said:

I don't know about IS vs. Clan balance, but so far this event has taught me that when all the good people come out of the group queues, my average match score drops by about 1 kill and 300 damage.

Such is life in the steering wheel underhive.

[Lefty Lucy]

Gyrok, on 17 August 2014 - 08:54 AM, said:

The only weapons the clans have that are worth anything are the energy weapons, everything else is rubbish...

Leave that alone...they already run MUCH hotter and are not significantly better in general...the CERLL is basically a trashcan weapon at this point...

Yeah, 12-ton gauss and half-weight missiles are trash. Nobody should ever run SRMboat timbers because they're super bad. Just trust me on this one.

Edited by Lefty Lucy, 17 August 2014 - 09:52 AM.

[Ebonkosh]

Don't need this competition to point out the Clan heavy and assaults are more powerful than IS counterparts. Lights may be slightly tipped in IS with the right build. The med is where we may get some data though it will be muddy data due to PUG teams. Unless you make a 12 on 12 thing you will not see true data on what skilled players using role warfare and tonnage limits would bring. Just take a look at WOT to see what they have gone through each time a new flavor was released for their game.


Ebon

[Fire and Salt]

Looking at it from an IS vs Clan perspective.... (full teams)


The clans have a durability advantage from their XL engines (except the adder and dire, which seem to be CT cored)
However, the clans have a durability disadvantage due to the fact that IS weapons are more pinpoint.


Therefore, IS vs. IS should be the least damage per kill, because the weapons are more precise and the mechs are less durable.

Clan vs. Clan should be the most damage per kill, because the weapons are imprecise (burst ACs, long duration lasers) and the mechs can survive the loss of a side torso.

The way that the tournament rewards damage, rather than a clean kill, gives a huge advantage to the clan mechs.

Additionally, the tournament gives you points for an assist, even if you only do 1 damage to that mech. The ERLL is basically the perfect weapon to rack up assists, due to its long range, and its (normally disadvantageous) long burn time.


TLDR:
Results will be inconclusive.

[wanderer]

Until the multitude of missing pieces and hitbox tricks (no engine damage, Timber Wolf bunny hops that screw with it's hitboxes, etc.) are fixed and put in, Clanners will have advantages that IS 'Mechs do not. That is, they will always seem OP because PGI slapped them into the game missing critical pieces of design, and will remain that way until those pieces are put into place.

That I can blow the shield side off a Timber Wolf and gouge off 2/3rds of it's engine cooling system without visible effect while it does freakish contortions to spread damage by tapping the space key is the poster child for this one, but there's plenty of smaller ones in there.