93 replies to this topic

[JudgeDeathCZ]

maybe bcuz no1 gives a **** about bad weapon...it was bad weapon be4 nerf and no1 except kitfox ecm,1jj,2xERLLas,ECM srsly used them...and even there 2xERPPC is better.
And now if it is even worse not even those kitfoxes use them...I rly do not understand that nerf...but hey its PGI so w/e

[MischiefSC]

Damage 10, burn time 1.5, range 800 or so.

[Archon]

I think more people need to be bitching at the devs on twitter about it, honestly. 2 second burn time is an eternity in this game and just leads to more friendly fire.

[Newtype]

I think either changing the damage to 10-10.5 or just reduce the range to 700-750 would work better than this 2 sec. burn time.

[Bishop Steiner]

00ohDstruct, on 18 August 2014 - 12:57 PM, said:

I've seen quite a few "petitions" floating about the forums from very concerned players, but I can't say I've seen "Clan ER Large Lasers" at the top of the list, even after the "Balancing."

I'm wondering if it is because everyone is satisfied with how PGI balanced them?

Personally, my biggest issue is the excessive burn time for the laser. After this weeks Marik Challenge, I realized how well light mechs, especially Ravens can sport the IS ER LG Lasers and do some decent damage quickly (9 damage in one second I believe?) and then quickly maneuver away after doing its full damage. The Clan ER Large Laser does what... 11.25 damage in 2 seconds? Sure Clan lasers have some more range than the IS counterparts, but at least the IS can safely USE those ER Large Lasers when closing in and entering brawling range.

Clan with a 2 second burn time, there is a high risk of hitting friendly mechs, or wasting your shots by hitting a mech for one second then aiming the laser into the ground or up into the sky because you can't stop the beam while leading your target in battle as it maneuvers in front of friendlies. I guess the issue is an IS mech is more likely to dump its full damage of an ER Large Laser in one second as compared to a Clan ER Large Laser in two.

Are those who run Clan Mechs and previously used ER Large Lasers happy?

Are those who play IS mechs seeing a reduction in ER Large Laser use from Clan, and are they having more fair and balanced fights now?

12 heat, 10 damage, just like TT, 1 second burn time. Guarantee it would have solved the issue, but made boating them very very unhealthy, especially with a hefty GH multiplier.

That would be a 10% damage reduction, and a 33% heat increase. More than compensates for the slight damage boost (which would still be useful with the 1 second burn) and range.

The whole reason they were so popular is their heat is ludicrously low, especially for their range.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 18 August 2014 - 02:52 PM.

[Sephlock]

POWR, on 18 August 2014 - 02:27 PM, said:

Clan ER Lasers are breaking the game. The engagement distance is through the damn roof. I have played all night now and most games I don't even break 100 damage in my mechs with mediumlasers/short range autocannons because ... why, the engagement distance is most of the time 500+ meters and noone will move closer to the enemy than that. Which means? THat either you go out and die and hope to maybe get in a few points of damage, or you just sit doing nothing at all, because hey you spent all your playing time mastering and upgrading mechs that are useless without short range weapons and the tradeoff in tonnage and heat those provide for damage.

This is all new for you? Maybe you just moved up an Elo bracket?

[J0anna]

POWR, on 18 August 2014 - 02:27 PM, said:

Clan ER Lasers are breaking the game. The engagement distance is through the damn roof. I have played all night now and most games I don't even break 100 damage in my mechs with mediumlasers/short range autocannons because ... why, the engagement distance is most of the time 500+ meters and noone will move closer to the enemy than that. Which means? THat either you go out and die and hope to maybe get in a few points of damage, or you just sit doing nothing at all, because hey you spent all your playing time mastering and upgrading mechs that are useless without short range weapons and the tradeoff in tonnage and heat those provide for damage.

Screw clans. I did not used to think this, but after playing this week, I can see that they have absolutely broken the game for me.

This is so typical of PUG games. Players move to the same location 'X' as before and try to snipe. If you're fighting with IS weapons against Clan weapons at range, you are losing. Clan weapons have higher DPS at range, so sitting back and playing the range game doesn't work out well. This is why Groups don't have as many issues - groups move together and close in the above situation, where the lower heat IS weapons with front loaded damage works far better. People need to remember that MWO was setup for groups first - the game has been (and should be) balanced against groups. To fight against the Clans - you need to rethink the tactics that you are using. However, PGI is going to try 10 v 12 - so rebalancing weapons before that is tried is counter productive. Try 10 v 12 and after those results are in, look at any rebalancing of weapons.

Archon, on 18 August 2014 - 02:35 PM, said:

I think more people need to be bitching at the devs on twitter about it, honestly. 2 second burn time is an eternity in this game and just leads to more friendly fire.

Like I said, lets see what happens with 10 v 12 before we "rebalance" any more weapons. Personally, I just removed all ERLL's from my builds. I have found that to be the quickest way to get PGI to boost a weapon (i.e. nobody use it) it will take them a few months, but it eventually works. For example, one of my adder builds was 2xERLL's, 2xERML's - now it's just 4xMPulse Lasers and a TCII - I haven't seen a huge drop off in effectiveness. Sadly, the forums are almost all bitching these days, I really can't blame PGI for not paying them much homage.

[Ultimax]

Archon, on 18 August 2014 - 02:35 PM, said:

I think more people need to be bitching at the devs on twitter about it, honestly. 2 second burn time is an eternity in this game and just leads to more friendly fire.

I tried, not sure they got my message. I sent it a few times.

Bishop Steiner, on 18 August 2014 - 02:50 PM, said:

The whole reason they were so popular is their heat is ludicrously low, especially for their range.

Also because 6 tons for a 1.3s LPL isn't really optimal.

That left cERPPC or cERLLAS as your long range energy options.


The funny part about the low heat, is that they don't have an instant heat spike, the heat is stretched out over the beam's duration.

So making them have a long beam contributed to them running so cool in the first place.

Edited by Ultimatum X, 18 August 2014 - 03:20 PM.

[Turist0AT]

i have so many issues with the "balance" (Ghost heat is one) I dont even bother anymore. When it becomes to much, i just play something else.

[Kiiyor]

Vassago Rain, on 18 August 2014 - 02:32 PM, said:

It was a pre-emptive nerf to make sure we didn't end up with campfests.

And TBH, once I settled into boating three of them (ghost heat be damned) I was indeed sitting comfortably behind rear-ech, sipping coffee and spit taking whenever some poor IS sap threw medium lasers at me in exasperation from 1.5k away.

I can see why the change was made to young cerll, because without PPC's being go-to, the hordes would have likely gravitated towards her and her nubile antics. It just seems to be near useless now, to me anyway. I find myself doing more damage more reliably with two cermlas now.

[Sephlock]

Kiiyor, on 18 August 2014 - 04:15 PM, said:

And TBH, once I settled into boating three of them (ghost heat be damned) I was indeed sitting comfortably behind rear-ech, sipping coffee and spit taking whenever some poor IS sap threw medium lasers at me in exasperation from 1.5k away.

I can see why the change was made to young cerll, because without PPC's being go-to, the hordes would have likely gravitated towards her and her nubile antics. It just seems to be near useless now, to me anyway. I find myself doing more damage more reliably with two cermlas now.

The pitchfork crowd is already after "the other woman" as well . Enjoy it while it lasts.

[Ultimax]

Kiiyor, on 18 August 2014 - 04:15 PM, said:

And TBH, once I settled into boating three of them (ghost heat be damned) I was indeed sitting comfortably behind rear-ech, sipping coffee and spit taking whenever some poor IS sap threw medium lasers at me in exasperation from 1.5k away.

I can see why the change was made to young cerll, because without PPC's being go-to, the hordes would have likely gravitated towards her and her nubile antics. It just seems to be near useless now, to me anyway. I find myself doing more damage more reliably with two cermlas now.

There were a number of ways to nerf the range, if the range was the problem.


You don't nerf range by just making the weapon totally useless.


Hell they could have given a harsh drop off for cER LLAS past it's optimal range, or just....nerfed the range....

[Kiiyor]

Sephlock, on 18 August 2014 - 04:20 PM, said:

The pitchfork crowd is already after "the other woman" as well . Enjoy it while it lasts.

But... she's so HOT

[Livewyr]

Bishop Steiner, on 18 August 2014 - 02:50 PM, said:

12 heat, 10 damage, just like TT, 1 second burn time. Guarantee it would have solved the issue, but made boating them very very unhealthy, especially with a hefty GH multiplier.

That would be a 10% damage reduction, and a 33% heat increase. More than compensates for the slight damage boost (which would still be useful with the 1 second burn) and range.

The whole reason they were so popular is their heat is ludicrously low, especially for their range.

As usual, Bish hits just about right. (Although I would probably go for 11 heat.. do not want it to be close to ERPPC heat, IMO)

[OznerpaG]

Bishop Steiner, on 18 August 2014 - 02:50 PM, said:

12 heat, 10 damage, just like TT, 1 second burn time. Guarantee it would have solved the issue, but made boating them very very unhealthy, especially with a hefty GH multiplier.

That would be a 10% damage reduction, and a 33% heat increase. More than compensates for the slight damage boost (which would still be useful with the 1 second burn) and range.

The whole reason they were so popular is their heat is ludicrously low, especially for their range.

yes.


i tried dual cERLLas on my Kit a couple days ago - USELESS. i kept losing 20-50% of the beam because it was TORTURE having to go into full frontal view (being the arms are so low, and good luck jump-sniping a 2sec beam) and be exposed for an hour long 2 seconds with a 30 armour CT

[lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol]

The quirky thing is, I thought clan tech was supposed to have "evolved" and gotten better... not worse. I can't imagine everyone standing around and saying "You know... we've gotten too good at killing. How about we take our technology and make it less efficient and SLOWER!"

I dunno, maybe its just me, but the whole thing seems bass ackwards.

[Zen Idiot]

Ultimatum X, on 18 August 2014 - 02:02 PM, said:

It's because most of us realize Paul isn't listening to the forums, and doesn't care how many weapons or mechs he needs hammer into mediocrity to "normalize" all the things.

It's because the forums have a plethora of man-babies who actually have a grudge against fictional "clanners" that they have been holding onto for decades of actual, real time, in their lives.



The cERLLAS is trash, maybe we'll get lucky and in 6 months Paul might deign to make it suck slightly less.

I'm not holding my breath.

if paul doesn't read the forums then how did the 'man-babies' get through to him.
i don't care one way or the other; just logical fallacy.

[Ultimax]

ZenIdiot, on 18 August 2014 - 08:47 PM, said:

if paul doesn't read the forums then how did the 'man-babies' get through to him.
i don't care one way or the other; just logical fallacy.

I was being facetious.

I don't think Paul listens to the general forums.

I do think he at least reads or peruses the feedback threads where he specifically asks for feedback (or someone distills it for him).

In that Gauss/PPC thread it was noted several times that people would likely shift to ERLLAS, but its also likely they talk to specific players or player groups for direct feedback and got the information that way.

One particular clan was running very heavy all cERLLAS teams on DWs right before the nerf and prior.

[Johnny Reb]

00ohDstruct, on 18 August 2014 - 12:57 PM, said:

I've seen quite a few "petitions" floating about the forums from very concerned players, but I can't say I've seen "Clan ER Large Lasers" at the top of the list, even after the "Balancing."

I'm wondering if it is because everyone is satisfied with how PGI balanced them?

Personally, my biggest issue is the excessive burn time for the laser. After this weeks Marik Challenge, I realized how well light mechs, especially Ravens can sport the IS ER LG Lasers and do some decent damage quickly (9 damage in one second I believe?) and then quickly maneuver away after doing its full damage. The Clan ER Large Laser does what... 11.25 damage in 2 seconds? Sure Clan lasers have some more range than the IS counterparts, but at least the IS can safely USE those ER Large Lasers when closing in and entering brawling range.

Clan with a 2 second burn time, there is a high risk of hitting friendly mechs, or wasting your shots by hitting a mech for one second then aiming the laser into the ground or up into the sky because you can't stop the beam while leading your target in battle as it maneuvers in front of friendlies. I guess the issue is an IS mech is more likely to dump its full damage of an ER Large Laser in one second as compared to a Clan ER Large Laser in two.

Are those who run Clan Mechs and previously used ER Large Lasers happy?

Are those who play IS mechs seeing a reduction in ER Large Laser use from Clan, and are they having more fair and balanced fights now?

Um Raven can't equip clan erll so that is IS erLL. Also, coming after the nerf I like to run mt Kit with 2 of them.

[LordKnightFandragon]

2s duration is way to damn long. 1.5s was pretty much borderline where it needed to be. Personally, I woulda put it down to like 1.3 or something, changed the heat and damage around....but 2s? sweet jesus......

Alot can be shot ones direction holding a beam on target for 2seconds, let alone in 1 spot.....yikes.