319 replies to this topic

[Riverboat Sam]

Russ;

I've seen you pop up in the forums for weeks now talking about taking the hard stop off of game mode selection as the, "fix", to group drop queue play imbalance.

With respect Sir, would you please just get on with it!

Personally, i don't see any way it will make any real difference. I think it's a very weak attempt at solving the problem and it will fail. The longer you debate and discuss with us about it the longer it will take you to find out for yourself and then, hopefully, move on to some sort of solution that might work.

As it stands now I try to log in and play a couple matches grouped with my son and his friends and get the same result over and over. We are one of three or four small groups put up against a 12 man and we get brutalized. Rolled over like we're not even there. I have to tell the boys the only solution is for us to disband the group and start dropping PUG. Then we have fun. My point is that under the current system you have set up the group queue is unplayable for new players or small groups. Please do something. Anything would be better than more jawboning at this point.

[9thDeathscream]

Seconded.

I can't play with my 2 sons in groups. Being stomped continually by 10-12 mans = no fun for 10 + 11 year olds. Or me either.

[Ryokens leap]

Akulla1980, on 22 September 2014 - 08:10 AM, said:

Seconded.

I can't play with my 2 sons in groups. Being stomped continually by 10-12 mans = no fun for 10 + 11 year olds. Or me either.

You let you're 10 and 11 year olds play a murder simulator?

[9thDeathscream]

Yeah big robots shooting each other is the worst thing i could find online for em to play.


Plenty kids around that age playing BF4 COD, god knows what else. At least MWO isn't a Fp shooter, shooting simulated real guns at simulated people.

Edited by Akulla1980, 22 September 2014 - 08:16 AM.

[Kirkland Langue]

Should be teaching your kids to shoot real Machine Guns and build pipe bombs. What kind of parent are you?

As for Russ "getting on with it" instead of talking about possible fixes - good luck with that.

[SI The Joker]

Ryokens leap, on 22 September 2014 - 08:13 AM, said:

You let you're 10 and 11 year olds play a murder simulator?

Hoping this was tongue in cheek.


Otherwise... meh. If you're in a group, play with groups.

Edited by SI The Joker, 22 September 2014 - 08:28 AM.

[TLBFestus]

It would be nice if they could fine tune the MM (Yes, I know...I can hear the laughter and tears) to allow you to select a more diverse set of drop options, ie. Single, 12 man organized, Groups 2-4, groups 4-6.

Of course without CW the organized 12 mans will scream about being unable to find opponents (to roll over and pad stats). Perhaps when CW shows up they will find a home.

[NeoCodex]

Seconded. I feel the pain of the OP, I wish they would fix that. Dropping with a group of 1-3 friends is borderline masochistic right now.

[kapusta11]

It appears someone doesn't pull his/her weight.

[Joseph Mallan]

Ryokens leap, on 22 September 2014 - 08:13 AM, said:

You let you're 10 and 11 year olds play a murder simulator?

Heck yes!
Nobody ever dies in this murder simulator.

[1453 R]

How much do you guys wanna bet that if Russ secretly started diverting 2-4 man groups back into the solo queue, without telling a soul, that the Puglandia population wouldn't even notice.

2-4 man Beer Night casual groups were never a problem in Puglandia, no matter how much the frothing-at-the-mouth "MY LOSS IS EVERYONE AND EVERYTHING'S FAULT EXCEPT MY OWN", blame-the-evil-baby-eating-premades, blame-the-matchmaker, blame-the-Clans, blame-Paul, blame-the-alignment-of-the-stars types all wanted to use it as the latest reason why they weren't putting out the 9.4 W/L 15 KDR Super Elite performance they're truly capable of.

2-4 man Beer Night casual groups being thrown against competitive units scrimmaging their latest drop decks and league fits? More of a problem. I'd much prefer that small units be thrown into the solo queue with an Elo modifier to account for their potential Comms-unism than be constantly forced to drag my new-to-the-game buddy in his not-even-basic'd Catapult up against 9-man murderclanz every other match. To the point where he's told me that he's not sure he wants to play with me anymore because even though he got the game installed specifically to do so, the solo queue is the only place where he feels like he can meaningfully contribute to a match.

When someone barely out of his cadet bonus can see a striking difference in match quality and fairness between group and solo queues, something has gone pear-shaped. I'm all for making sure both queues are fair, and any measure to change things up like this again would have to be closely examined, but the number of mothers and fathers I've seen who say they can't play with their kids anymore is both telling and damning.

[Sandpit]

The fastest and easiest way to solve this is to post a thread for those interested and plan out some private match times. I just don't see enough of them to warrant a separate queue in my opinion and groups are not going to be allowed into the solo queue.

Post a thread, get some interest with players in similar situations and start a "family" type casual gaming group for MWO. Then you guys can play in those small group sizes.

[9thDeathscream]

Sandpit, on 22 September 2014 - 09:49 AM, said:

The fastest and easiest way to solve this is to post a thread for those interested and plan out some private match times. I just don't see enough of them to warrant a separate queue in my opinion and groups are not going to be allowed into the solo queue.

Post a thread, get some interest with players in similar situations and start a "family" type casual gaming group for MWO. Then you guys can play in those small group sizes.

Why should we have to do that. Families have as much right to the queues as anybody else.

Thats like saying u should only group up with ur mates in private matches. Nu uh. Don't see that happening!

Oh and why should we pay while others get it for free?

Edited by Akulla1980, 22 September 2014 - 10:02 AM.

[Grimlox]

Now when I first started dropping with a couple of RL friends that we play all sorts of games together it was fine when you couldn't have more than a 4 man group, but since the new group queue was created from 2-12 everyone was getting too frustrated to enjoy playing in this group setting. That's the reason we play, to enjoy stomping around in our mechs and have a beer while giving each other a hard time on comms a couple nights a week.

What I have done is joined a great group of folks in a unit so I can drop with more than just me and my friends. It took some adjusting to dropping in a bigger group and frankly it's not as enjoyable as running around with RL friends but it's necessary if we are to have a chance. Despite this I've been struggling with the group queue. It's probably partially my fault because I don't play enough to drop in organized well oiled machine type setups and I play after the peak times when the practices occur. Also I'm married with 3 kids so I can't commit to a practice schedule or anything too organized. Right now when I drop in a group even with the unit to drop with we still lose a lot more than we win most nights. My last run started with 6 losses in a row which was pretty disheartening.

So at this point due to personal life commitments I will never be able to compete but whenever dropping in the group queue I'm against people that are generally pretty competitive. I didn't sink money in this game to play solo but that's the only place where I can win my fair share of matches. So either not have fun in solo because well it's solo or struggle to have fun in group because I have to play with strangers (not that I don't like the people in my unit but they aren't my RL friends) and even still lose majority of matches.

As a reference I don't think I'm terrible and I feel like I pull my weight. I have a KDR or 1.76 despite losing more games than I'm winning. Before the queue change up I was about 2.5KDR with more wins than losses. I have mechs where I average around 550dmg/match according to the stats screen but I can't drop with friends and reasonably expect to win very many matches. Even dropping with larger groups to get the numbers and voice comms I still lose most group games and it's rather frustrating.

I'm not blaming PGI because I have my responsibility in this (I will never be able to commit to the timetable required for competitive organized groups) but I used to be able to drop with friends and at least win half my games and had fun both the wins and the losses, due to changes made in the MM I can't do that any more and that sucks. I've tried to make some changes on my end to accommodate (joining larger unit) but it's still not there yet.

TLDR:
I'd really appreciate if PGI could do something to make it fun for the 2-4ppl casual groups again.

[Kirkland Langue]

1453 R, on 22 September 2014 - 09:31 AM, said:

How much do you guys wanna bet that if Russ secretly started diverting 2-4 man groups back into the solo queue, without telling a soul, that the Puglandia population wouldn't even notice.

I'd bet you any amount you wanted.

The first time you dropped as a pug and were paired up against 4 people from the same Unit, with none from that Unit on your own team, you will say something.

The first time you drop as a 4 man group, and all 20 other players are from random units or no units, you will know what happened.

I'd bet that it takes no more than 100 such drops before the community knew what was going on.

[1453 R]

Sandpit, on 22 September 2014 - 09:49 AM, said:

The fastest and easiest way to solve this is to post a thread for those interested and plan out some private match times. I just don't see enough of them to warrant a separate queue in my opinion and groups are not going to be allowed into the solo queue.

Post a thread, get some interest with players in similar situations and start a "family" type casual gaming group for MWO. Then you guys can play in those small group sizes.

I’ve often found, Sandpit, that people who are part of large, well-organized, populous units such as yourself don’t really get the small-groups issue that the solo/group queue split brought up.

It’s not your fault, and I don’t blame you for it, but most of the big-unit folks figure it’s no sweat whatsoever to find a 12-man to drop with, that anyone can do it and (more importantly for this conversation) that there’s no reason not to do it. They can understand in their heads why the 12-Man Queue (to use its proper name) would feel oppressive to small, casual groups or the occasional two-man buddy team or family drop, but they can’t really figure out why those folks don’t just…well, start a thread to make an organized event of it, or find a big ol’ unit to join and solve their problems by being on the other end of the 12-man versus hodgepodge small-unit stew equation.

Here’s the thing: if I had the time or inclination to make a big freaking production out of finding a bunch of other folks in my same sort of situation and organizing a Family Play Time thing where people could swing by my TS3 server I don’t own and drop in pre-arranged “hodgepodge family-friendly lances” against each other in private matches, I wouldn’t be in this situation in the first place. I’d be in a unit, or I’d have started a unit. Telling the casuals and the parent/child teams to just go and play in private matches already doesn’t accomplish anything, because people with the time and inclination to do that sort of thing have already joined a unit and are devoting their required 10h training time a week w/unit-designated comp fits as it is.

When I log onto MWO with my new-player buddy, or my limited-free-time Army brother, I’m not there to spend an hour organizing a big stonkin’ hullaballoo I don’t even get to participate in because I’m too busy administrating it to actually find a drop. I’m there to play games with my friends and my family.

I don’t really expect Piranha to do anything to help the casual two-man drops or the family-bonding groups, as they’re caught between a rock and a hard place where the small-group issue is concerned. It would be nice, however, if big-unit players wouldn’t patronize us and solo Puglandians wouldn’t ostracize us. We’ve already lost our place to play; do you guys have to be snide or condescending when we occasionally pine for the days when we still had a place to play?

[1453 R]

Kirkland Langue, on 22 September 2014 - 10:39 AM, said:

I'd bet you any amount you wanted.

The first time you dropped as a pug and were paired up against 4 people from the same Unit, with none from that Unit on your own team, you will say something.

The first time you drop as a 4 man group, and all 20 other players are from random units or no units, you will know what happened.

I'd bet that it takes no more than 100 such drops before the community knew what was going on.

Spoilers: I'm not in a unit and have no [TAGS] to give me away. The same is true of anyone/everyone I'd care to drop with. I'm not talking about the lance-sized scrimmages from ultracomps, I really, truly am talking about casual buddy drops. Which are no longer a thing, since they're constantly used as filler in Clash Of The Titans matches between a 12-man and a 10-man plus two random guys just looking to shoot the breeze a bit.

[UnsafePilot]

The more I think about it the more I'd rather 2-3 person groups just get dropped into the pug queue.

[Ghogiel]

Me and single LORD can't carry the bads to a 100% win rate. We were only getting like a 75% win rate. Please fix.

[orcrist86]

If you have indeed read what Russ has been saying then you know that there is one huge thing that will fix mm. Player population. If mwo went steam and tripled it's population everything would be much better. Until then expect compromises and votes instead as a way to put the issue in your hands not the mm.