27 replies to this topic

[Angel of Annihilation]

Well honestly this is a really good time to discuss this. The new Clan mechs, particularly the Mist Lynx and the Ice Ferret with their very limited tonnage are going to be severely handicap by hot extremely hot Clan weapons are, particularly the C-ER ML which will be their go to weapon. Now the Ice Ferret at least will have 10 DHS in the engine but the Mist Lynx won't have this luxury which is going to make it very hard for them to compete with IS lights like the Jenner, Firestarter and Spider which are faster, cooler and more heavily armored.

Now some may claim that a 25 ton mech shouldn't be trying to compete with 30-35 tons mechs but what other light mech does the Clan have that can compete? Kit Fox and Adder are pushing at top speed of 106 kph and the only fast mech is going to be a 40 ton medium which unfortunately can't fill the light spot in your dropship for CW.

[Xarian]

Viktor Drake, on 06 October 2014 - 11:40 AM, said:

Now some may claim that a 25 ton mech shouldn't be trying to compete with 30-35 tons mechs but what other light mech does the Clan have that can compete?

I actually haven't seen anyone arguing that the Locust or Commando are good; at best, you get "useful" or "fun". These ultralights have plenty of issues - disproportionately low structure points, for example - but the ultralight engines being awful doesn't help them at all.

The main reason that these engines were so terrible in TT was due to the Battle Value system - mechs with these engines were priced in a way that reflected how terrible the engines were. We don't have that luxury any more, because it's always 1 player = 1 mech.

[stjobe]

Xarian, on 06 October 2014 - 10:36 PM, said:

I actually haven't seen anyone arguing that the Locust or Commando are good; at best, you get "useful" or "fun".

Hey, don't diss my 'mandos, they're surprisingly useful little things:

Xarian, on 06 October 2014 - 10:36 PM, said:

These ultralights

Ultralights is actually a real weight class - sub-20 ton 'mechs. Most of the 'mechs in that class are apocryphal, but there's a couple of canon ones.

Xarian, on 06 October 2014 - 10:36 PM, said:

have plenty of issues - disproportionately low structure points, for example - but the ultralight engines being awful doesn't help them at all.

Being penalized for not being able to mount a 250+ engine is a bit harsh, yeah. There's also been a slow but sure decline in the viability of lights, as well as the incentives for playing one, as the game had progressed. To the point that it's now rare to see the light queue over 10%, and it's not unheard of for it to be zero.

Edited by stjobe, 07 October 2014 - 08:55 AM.

[Xarian]

Even when light populations are high, the population is utterly dominated by 35t mechs - Jenner, Firestarter, and Raven. You will very rarely see a Spider, and seeing a Commando or Locust (or Spider/Raven without ECM) is maybe once per 50 games.

They are the same size as heavier mechs, run the same speed, don't have jump jets (Commando and Locust), carry less weaponry, have less armor, and have significantly less structure. Why would you even want to run them? Because the Commando has a helmet?

[kapusta11]

Just fix dissipation, add Heat Scale and suddenly you don't even need to sacrifice crit space for double heatsinks to cool down that 4-5 MLs or SRMs.

Edited by kapusta11, 07 October 2014 - 08:37 AM.

[Mcgral18]

Viktor Drake, on 06 October 2014 - 11:40 AM, said:

Well honestly this is a really good time to discuss this. The new Clan mechs, particularly the Mist Lynx and the Ice Ferret with their very limited tonnage are going to be severely handicap by hot extremely hot Clan weapons are, particularly the C-ER ML which will be their go to weapon. Now the Ice Ferret at least will have 10 DHS in the engine but the Mist Lynx won't have this luxury which is going to make it very hard for them to compete with IS lights like the Jenner, Firestarter and Spider which are faster, cooler and more heavily armored.

Now some may claim that a 25 ton mech shouldn't be trying to compete with 30-35 tons mechs but what other light mech does the Clan have that can compete? Kit Fox and Adder are pushing at top speed of 106 kph and the only fast mech is going to be a 40 ton medium which unfortunately can't fill the light spot in your dropship for CW.

The Lolcust is getting a leg IS buff to equal the current 35 tonner IS, which is pretty big.

Perhaps the 25 tonners will get something as well.

Edited by Mcgral18, 07 October 2014 - 08:37 AM.

[FupDup]

kapusta11, on 07 October 2014 - 08:35 AM, said:

Just fix dissipation, add Heat Scale and suddenly you don't even need to sacrifice crit space for double heatsinks to cool down that 4-5 MLs.

Fixing those things would still require engines rated under 250 to allocate sinks externally rather than having all 10 of the base sinks internal.

Edited by FupDup, 07 October 2014 - 08:38 AM.

[Xarian]

Mcgral18, on 07 October 2014 - 08:37 AM, said:

The Lolcust is getting a leg IS buff to equal the current 35 tonner IS, which is pretty big.

Perhaps the 25 tonners will get something as well.

It's a huge change for a locust, but legging Ravens isn't exactly difficult. A huge reduction to fall damage (like 80%) would go a long way toward helping with the leg problem.