8 replies to this topic

[1453 R]

The new Treb Champion is just depressing. Here's what it should have looked like:

TBT-7M(C)

This one's got a much better engine weight - those five extra points make a BIG difference when half the reason to buy Champs is to get a useful engine weight for your hangar - and a more sensible armament. As 'sensible' as anything involving Streaks gets these days, anyways. It uses all three missile hardpoints, which is a big reason to own a 7M in the first place, and the energy armament actually makes sense. It's not fantastic - no Trebuchet is, poor things - but I've used models very similar to this on my 7M to pretty good effect. Yeah, the lack of Ferro costs it some effective weight, but I'd rather have the extra equipment space and jump capability than the ton-odd of extra weight I couldn't put into anything useful anyways.

May I request some more community involvement for future Champion 'Mechs, Piranha? Some of the recent Champion designs are just baffling. I still haven't figured out the logic behind the CTF-3D(C). Given that these things are the first experience of any new player in the game, it behooves both you, as the developer looking for player retention and sales, and us, the player base looking for quality matches and a richer experience, to make these Champion Trials as effective as we can.

The new TBT-7M Champion is not as effective as it could be. It's just not.

[LORD ORION]

1453 R, on 07 October 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

The new Treb Champion is just depressing. Here's what it should have looked like:

TBT-7M(C)

This one's got a much better engine weight - those five extra points make a BIG difference when half the reason to buy Champs is to get a useful engine weight for your hangar - and a more sensible armament. As 'sensible' as anything involving Streaks gets these days, anyways. It uses all three missile hardpoints, which is a big reason to own a 7M in the first place, and the energy armament actually makes sense. It's not fantastic - no Trebuchet is, poor things - but I've used models very similar to this on my 7M to pretty good effect. Yeah, the lack of Ferro costs it some effective weight, but I'd rather have the extra equipment space and jump capability than the ton-odd of extra weight I couldn't put into anything useful anyways.

May I request some more community involvement for future Champion 'Mechs, Piranha? Some of the recent Champion designs are just baffling. I still haven't figured out the logic behind the CTF-3D(C). Given that these things are the first experience of any new player in the game, it behooves both you, as the developer looking for player retention and sales, and us, the player base looking for quality matches and a richer experience, to make these Champion Trials as effective as we can.

The new TBT-7M Champion is not as effective as it could be. It's just not.

Putting an XL on a mech that large that has close range weapons.... One DerpWolf shot...

But yeah, putting the main energy weapon in the left side is a much better idea when it comes to shooting partially exposed around corners.

[Sevronis]

Well from what I see for the Champion mechs is the obvious usage of meta builds. At least during certain 'patch eras' MWO has over time. When I saw the build for the Champion 7M, I was not impressed at the loadout but also not surprised. My 7M was my first medium (and Treb) I mastered a while back and I had it set up like a brawler. 325XL, 3 Med Lasers, 1 SSRM2 I put in the LT for lights and SRM4s in the RT and LA. I think I had BP in there too for the streak. The rest of the tonnage went to at least 1 or 2 JJ and then DBL HS. It was a really effective build for me and I didn't need the kind of loudout the champion one has.

[1453 R]

The Champ Treb, as listed, is a very confused sort of 'Mech. It's definitely geared more for close-quarters striking with the Surms and pulsebeams, but then that PPC doesn't really do it any good in close-quarters fights. And leaving one of the three missile hardpoints empty just rubs me the wrong way on the 7M. People buy the 7M specifically for the trio of launcher hardpoints (and the jets, but hey). If you're going to go for Streak launchers rather than straight SRMs, to the point where you're throwing on a Fuzzy Puppy Detector to let them break ECM, you may as well pack all three on there.

Even leaving aside my own preference for max or near-max jump jets, you could do this to get the ferro armor back on there. This way you get all three extra in-engine heat sinks, three jump jets over two, and still have an extra ton of SSRM ammo over the current Champ config. It's faster, better armed, with more ammunition endurance, better jump mobility, and improved cooling. Even leaving aside how horrid pulse lasers are on both sides of the tech divide right now, it's just bad form to saddle new players with a 'Mech whose main gun can't readily be used at the same ranges as the entirety of its supporting armament. At least this way the player can use the ERLL in close if he needs to and still deal damage with it.

Edit: Rebuilt the Smurfy link

Edited by 1453 R, 07 October 2014 - 11:42 AM.

[Molossian Dog]

Leaving aside how terrible Trebs are nerfed by their size, the champion is a joke. If do not even want to imagine how the gaming experience of a new player would be if he tries it.

2 Jump Jets ... why? Just why?
It has a Beagle to support what...a total of 2 Streaks? A waste.
I´d rather have a 3rd. Or better, no SSRMs at all!
Then it sports one of the most unpopular energy weapons out there. 2 Medium Pulses.
But no, it doesn´t group them in the same arm, so you could more effectively use cover.
No, sir, that would make way too much sense.
And then it adds a PPCs on top. Because synergy...

Resizing the model is out of the question (because moneyz!) and everything else PGI does with the Treb is done in just such a careless way that you know PGI designated it as a hopeless cause. The designer probably didn´t spend more than 5 minutes on this champion mech and it shows.

You could as well etch on its breastplate: "Go buy a Clan Mech!"

Edited by Molossian Dog, 07 October 2014 - 03:36 PM.

[1453 R]

My favorite 'Mech these days is my Stormcrow, but prior to the Clan release, my Trebs were actually pretty well up there.

I might - might - be willing to try and skirmish with a Stormcrow in the End/Ferro 325XL model in my second post. I'd lose, but I feel like I could get enough damage out there, and more importantly hold the thing's attention well enough, to help the team if'n it's a choice between me dueling a Stormcrow or said Stormcrow rampaging unopposed behind my team's lines. I'd absolutely try my luck with that Treb against a Nova. The Nova may outgun me to hell and back, but I've got it on mobility and heat dissipation, and at least neither of us has a hitbox advantage over the other >_>.

The Champ as listed, I would not willingly engage a (properly built) Stormcrow with by myself unless given absolutely no choice whatsoever. I wouldn't feel great taking it up against a Nova, either. That weapons mix is just not good. I can't see it working out well when your close-quarters armament consists of two medium pulse lasers and a Streak SRM-4.

C'mon, Pirahna. You can do better than this, and if you can't, you've got an entire forum-full of people who can.

[Molossian Dog]

My problem with the Champion Treb is not that its concept is harebrained, but that it is also very poorly executed. It reeks of neglect and disinterest.

[Jeon Ji Yoon]

1453 R, on 07 October 2014 - 11:39 AM, said:

The Champ Treb, as listed, is a very confused sort of 'Mech. It's definitely geared more for close-quarters striking with the Surms and pulsebeams, but then that PPC doesn't really do it any good in close-quarters fights.

I often make mechs like this though if they have a ton of close ranged weapons, have 1 long ranged weapon that its soul purpose is to be fired when I can't close.

oh, and plus mixing ranges (adding something you can't fire all at once, helps with heat so you don't freak out and alpha and over heat lol

Edited by Jeon Ji Yoon, 08 October 2014 - 09:36 AM.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

As someone that mastered every treb, this is what I personally would've given as the trial: TBT-7M

Another would have been this one: TBT-5J

And if then the belly/20 treb: TBT-7K

ANY of those would have been preferable to the one they released.