87 replies to this topic

[Nightmare1]

R Razor, on 13 October 2014 - 04:21 PM, said:

...

*Chuckle* You're amusing; I like your style. I think I'll probably debate with you again in the future.

Good job highlighting the velocity of the weapons; I had overlooked that and recognize my mistake.

G'night!

[Zensei]

this is where the the mutliposters tell you to learn to play, good luck with that.

[cSand]

Burktross, on 12 October 2014 - 06:38 PM, said:

You shouldn't experience "you can't play the game anymore" amounts of nightclub raving in your face from the sheer overload of autcannon rounds
we should make every weapon do this then.
especially mgs
mmmm

lol

turn torso

problem solved.

/thread

[Pendraco]

I understand getting caught by a 6 CUAC DW can suck. However, these weapons are borderline useless on anything besides a DW. Take away shake and blast, your left with near worthless damage that tickles a mech in several places.

Edited by Pendraco, 13 October 2014 - 04:59 PM.

[Kmieciu]

Shake = Damage * Impulse

Source: http://mwomercs.com/...68-18-dec-2012/

C-ULTRA AC/5 0.033
ULTRA AC/5 0.040

This means that IS UAC5 does more "total" shake, but Clan version shakes you longer since the UAC burst lasts 0.3 second.

BUT: The explosions are not scaled at all.

Edited by Kmieciu, 13 October 2014 - 11:09 PM.

[STEF_]

It always amazes me when a 2012 player's thread show me that he still didn't learn to play.....

IS AC are far better than Clan, man!

[Hades Trooper]

AntiCitizenJuan, on 12 October 2014 - 05:31 PM, said:

I'll keep it simple.

Radically reduce cockpit shake from Clan Autocannons
and
Make them not have the explosion effect (which blinds the player).

Keep the damage and fire rate the same. This keeps them as formidable weapons, lets mechs like the DWF keep their firepower, and removes an extremely annoying aspect of facing them in the field.

This also provides the IS Autocannons a benefit not shared by their clan counterparts, because they would retain the screenshaking and blinding effects.

No, suck it up buttercup, what else do you need to kick the clans in the balls? they spread there damage out and now you want to remove the screen shake and smoke already?

If u want that then sure let me take pin point auto cannons instead, sound fair?

[Hades Trooper]

oneproduct, on 13 October 2014 - 07:20 AM, said:

Please take a moment to read what this thread is about. It's not about clan UACs being OP, because they are not. It's about the explosion FX they cause whey they hit you causing blindness. The same thing could be achieved when using 4x AC2 on an inner sphere mech and you can "nerf" the explosion FX on those as well.

We are not talking about making clan UACs weaker, we are talking about reducing the amount of blindness caused when being hit by these weapons.

Clan UACs are not supposed to have a random bonus by blinding the mech being fired at. The flamers in this game have the same problem, their best use is not transferring heat but blinding your opponent with all the flame effects. I was fighting an adder recently and was surprised just how hard it was to shoot back at him while he was strafing me with his flamer. Obviously the flamer is not OP, but being able to blind an enemy is a very powerful thing.

It's like the reverse argument from smoke grenades in counter strike. Smoke grenades are intentionally made to hide things from view but in the original version they were not very good at this so they intentionally made it more blinding. In mechwarrior clan UACs and clan LRMs were never meant to blind people but they do right now because the visual effects are too intense.

reducing there shake and explosions would be in effect making them weaker, your post is thus completely wrong

[Tincan Nightmare]

1453 R, on 13 October 2014 - 04:26 PM, said:

Neither does BattleTech.

Juan? Maybe next time don't entitle your thread "Nerf Clan ballistics", as most folks agree that Clan ballistics are horrid and not worth taking on most any 'Mech that isn't the Mired Whale. I get what you're saying and the issues you've got, but nevertheless, Clan ballistics are junk next to IS cannons, and it can very easily be said that they need all the help they can get.

The only Clan mech I currently have is a Nova-S, so I don't really mess with ballistics to much on it, but don't the Clans have the option to mount standard AC's that work just like IS ones? I need to load up the game and check this, but I thought that was there temporary answer to CLBX not being able to fire slug round along with the normal cluster shots. And aren't these weapons the same tonnage as Clan LBX? I really need to boot up the game now and go to the mechlab, but if so those Clan AC would be good at least.

[Xarian]

The impulse from the lower-damage shots is accurate - if you get hit by a 1 damage shot, your screen shakes like a 1 damage shot - not very much. Your screen shakes a lot harder from IS autocannons, but for a shorter duration than Clan autocannons (because multiple projectiles).

The explosion flash and the hit sound, however, are the same on the IS and Clan weapons. Since you get hit with more projectiles from Clan weapons, there's more flash and more hit sounds. Clan autocannons should use smaller projectiles. That would bring the sound/flash down to be comparable with its damage.

In general, however, please stop whining about Clan technology. A good chunk of Clan weapons are inferior to their IS counterparts: all the ACs, all of the lasers except arguably CERML and CERLL, all SRMs, no access to normal PPC at all. IS mechs are straight-up better brawlers than Clan mechs - every mech is required to have a Clan XL engine which, while great for light and medium mechs, is a huge liability on brawlers compared to a Std engine. The only thing Clans really have going for them are that some of the weapons are lower-weight, require fewer critical slots, and the mechs have more (and flexible) hardpoints. It's getting to the point where the "Clan Balance" is turning into "Nerf Clans so hard that every mech is unplayable except the Timberwolf and Direwolf - and the Direwolf only if your enemy is stupid".

Edited by Xarian, 14 October 2014 - 01:53 AM.

[SaltBeef]

No not in this game Clans do not have a PP auto cannon option. If they did the IS pilots would be crying so loud on the forum Pay to win BOO HOO ski wah!

[Sergeant Random]

Putting yourself in the line of fire shouldn't be considered smart to begin with.

If one learns how to fire while minimizing return fire, do you disrespect him? (By the way, the game rewards people who learn the intricacies.)

Not respecting the capabilities of the opposing force has led to many a warrior's downfall.

Or you could simply call for nerfs. Because you want to feel invincible (overconfident?) in your armored war machine.

[RustyBolts]

Oh hell no. If you remove it for Clan then remove it for IS too. Bunch of QQ

[LordKnightFandragon]

Buff UAC Jam rate? I was in a training room and my UAC10......it jammed on the 3rd shot, again after about the 5th, again after the 6th, then the 8th, then 9th, then 11th, then 12th, no joke either.........I was like holy good god. this is seriously happening? And its why I loathe UAC.....They are horribly unreliable....and thats not something you need in the heat of battle.....and no one can say just fire it slower when after 1 shot its jamming....slow, fast, moderate, single...idc, they jam to damn much.....

[Joseph Mallan]

Burktross, on 12 October 2014 - 06:38 PM, said:

You shouldn't experience "you can't play the game anymore" amounts of nightclub raving in your face from the sheer overload of autcannon rounds
we should make every weapon do this then.
especially mgs
mmmm

Funny I see my crosshairs turn red if I don't move my mouse and I am being hammered by a DakkaWolf! Can't see the Mech but if I had a bead on it before the dakka... I still hit it. I die anyway cause well... that's a lot of Dakka and I should die if I decide to stand my ground against the storm.

[Revis Volek]

Nightmare1, on 12 October 2014 - 06:20 PM, said:

Another thread about nerfing another great feature of the game? Really?

...If everything keeps getting nerfed, we'll eventually be reduced to being handed a manual on how to throw rocks at each other.

You mean the COMMUNITY will come up with a manual on "HOW TO THROW ROCK AT MECHS".....PGI make a manual...Pffff. If it doesnt start with the word NERF it isnt gonna happen. lolz

[Mcgral18]

Tincan Nightmare, on 14 October 2014 - 12:01 AM, said:

The only Clan mech I currently have is a Nova-S, so I don't really mess with ballistics to much on it, but don't the Clans have the option to mount standard AC's that work just like IS ones? I need to load up the game and check this, but I thought that was there temporary answer to CLBX not being able to fire slug round along with the normal cluster shots. And aren't these weapons the same tonnage as Clan LBX? I really need to boot up the game now and go to the mechlab, but if so those Clan AC would be good at least.

Same as the UACs, without the double tap functionality. Meant to be combined with the LBxs at some point.

LordKnightFandragon, on 14 October 2014 - 05:51 AM, said:

Buff UAC Jam rate? I was in a training room and my UAC10......it jammed on the 3rd shot, again after about the 5th, again after the 6th, then the 8th, then 9th, then 11th, then 12th, no joke either.........I was like holy good god. this is seriously happening? And its why I loathe UAC.....They are horribly unreliable....and thats not something you need in the heat of battle.....and no one can say just fire it slower when after 1 shot its jamming....slow, fast, moderate, single...idc, they jam to damn much.....

14%
15%
16%
17%

Jam chances, for UAC2-20s. Seems fair. UAC5s have already been buffed to the same jam rate as the Dakka Geddon of 30% off Muromets and Firebrands.

Can't get much better than that.

[Tincan Nightmare]

Xarian, on 14 October 2014 - 01:35 AM, said:

The impulse from the lower-damage shots is accurate - if you get hit by a 1 damage shot, your screen shakes like a 1 damage shot - not very much. Your screen shakes a lot harder from IS autocannons, but for a shorter duration than Clan autocannons (because multiple projectiles).

The explosion flash and the hit sound, however, are the same on the IS and Clan weapons. Since you get hit with more projectiles from Clan weapons, there's more flash and more hit sounds. Clan autocannons should use smaller projectiles. That would bring the sound/flash down to be comparable with its damage.

In general, however, please stop whining about Clan technology. A good chunk of Clan weapons are inferior to their IS counterparts: all the ACs, all of the lasers except arguably CERML and CERLL, all SRMs, no access to normal PPC at all. IS mechs are straight-up better brawlers than Clan mechs - every mech is required to have a Clan XL engine which, while great for light and medium mechs, is a huge liability on brawlers compared to a Std engine. The only thing Clans really have going for them are that some of the weapons are lower-weight, require fewer critical slots, and the mechs have more (and flexible) hardpoints. It's getting to the point where the "Clan Balance" is turning into "Nerf Clans so hard that every mech is unplayable except the Timberwolf and Direwolf - and the Direwolf only if your enemy is stupid".

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying nerf the Clans, but the Clan XL is hardly the major handicap most claim it is. Currently, there is no real handicap to it, save that both side torsos getting destroyed kills the mech, which makes it more effecient to just go for the CT in the first place. Considering that it only takes one side torso being destroyed to kill an IS mech mounting an XL engine, right now Clan XL engines are pretty decent, especially as they take 2 less crit slots (one to either side). Yes PGI is going to be giving them a heat 'penalty' when you lose one side torso in the future, but seeing as that comes with a possible corresponding loss of firepower (as you've just lost a whole side torso section plus attached arm) it will really be up to a players build to determine how 'harsh' that penalty is.

[ManDaisy]

So many people fail to realize back in the day when they took ac2 shake away people where complaining they were dying mysteriously. Turns out getting shaken actually lets you know your being sandblasted to death.

[Hoax415]

That me be true, this thread is mainly about being blinded by over-sized explosions for every shell from clan-AC's even when they aren't hitting near your cockpit at all.

Surely you aren't suggesting that without that blinding effect people just wouldn't know that DWF in front of them was shooting?