112 replies to this topic

[Vassago Rain]

Super glad I didn't turn on 30 days of prem now.

Maybe in january.

[Jazzbandit1313]

I don't understand all the griping. I've played around 50 matches since the patch without premium and usually without my heroes and i've been making bank 150K+ almost every one (wins (75% of the time))

Think about it this way, maybe it's a problem with the way you're playing.

[Joe Mallad]

The issue I see is that too many people got spoiled on making decent money even on a lose lol. I'm not saying we should make next to nothing but I also think the amounts we were making on a lose before, were I bit too accommodating for the losers.

As for people losing money on consumables, I do think they are priced a bit too high and always have been. The consumables IMO should be like 10K to 15K max.

[Feetwet]

Yoseful Mallad, on 22 October 2014 - 05:48 AM, said:

The issue I see is that too many people got spoiled on making decent money even on a lose lol. I'm not saying we should make next to nothing but I also think the amounts we were making on a lose before, were I bit too accommodating for the losers.

As for people losing money on consumables, I do think they are priced a bit too high and always have been. The consumables IMO should be like 10K to 15K max.

My god man you do realize that the MM system they have implemented is DESIGNED for you to lose around 50% of the time. And I don't believe the MM and ELO works AT ALL in the group queue. If it did, I don't think I would have to face the lords or 228 ever. Not complaining about the MM here but when half of my games are going to be a loss AND earn me nothing, my wins better earn me a CRAPTON. Like 100K for just figuring out how to turn the engine on.

Some of us aren't that good and don't have the time to 'get gud', now I can't even hope to dream that I might be able to buy a new shiny mech. Ever. (yes i know a bit of hyperbole)

S

[Fherot]

I was wondering why I got team killed like four times last night and everyone's running around with TAG.

I'm not sure what godly things people are doing to earn 250-300k after this patch because my average victory (hero/premium) was netting me -150k last night. Huh?

Losses didn't even pay for consumables.

I usually play brawlers and last night my jäger did a good few 500 and one 700+ match being.. A jäger. Fire support/sniping/suppression and even some delicate brawling like my other mechs. I might have gotten 200k once. Not sure what else I can do to coax more money out of a match.

I wish I could deactivate my premium until this is balanced.

[Jhaele]

I just logged into this mess this morning.

Wow is all I can say.

Losing is not an option. The monetary rewards are terrible but the XP rewards are insanely bad, particularly if you happen to be on the receiving end of a stomp.

The ideas are good but the numbers used in implementing this scheme are terrible.

[Fherot]

Yoseful Mallad, on 22 October 2014 - 05:48 AM, said:

The issue I see is that too many people got spoiled on making decent money even on a lose lol. I'm not saying we should make next to nothing but I also think the amounts we were making on a lose before, were I bit too accommodating for the losers.

As for people losing money on consumables, I do think they are priced a bit too high and always have been. The consumables IMO should be like 10K to 15K max.

Considering people who want to queue with a single friend (like me) get thrown against Smoke Jaguar / 228 / Lords Twitch stream with 6-10 puggers on our side... Losses shouldn't net you zilch.

I'm going to disable all my consumables, cool shot's become crutch anyhow.

[Gyrok]

http://www.reddit.co...omy_murderball/

Maybe that will help some of you...

Just FYI, you get more cbills/xp for doing the most damage to a mech before it dies, than you do for getting the kill shot. So, theoretically, kill stealing/friendly fire should settle down once people realize it is to their detriment to try to do so.

Under the new rewards:
Killing blow - 30 XP
Kill by most damage - 80 XP
Solo Kill - 280 XP (most damage and killing blow on same target).

Also, Flanking and many other bonuses pay over time, so being around your group and not being off in some corner by yourself is much more to your benefit.

I had a 700 damage 1 kill 10 assist match last night with a solo kill and several kill by most damage rewards and made over 300k cbills and over 2800 XP.

However, I spent the entire match next to my team mates and we were firing/taking damage for quite a while.

Edited by Gyrok, 22 October 2014 - 06:22 AM.

[CGB Behemoth]

As we see from screenshots it is theme for useless newbs to whine?
I like that in new reward system no one can win 145K for 45dmg+2 kill assists. Learn to play not whine loosers.

P.S. Try to communicate via chat with your teammates. Working together makes much more money in new system.
P.P.S. After patch i usually get about 130-200K for win. Not so good as it was, but thats fine.

[theta123]

Xarian, on 21 October 2014 - 05:57 PM, said:

Frankly I don't feel like playing this game right now. I lose money using my consumables; I can't break even unless I win, which is ~50% of the time. When I do win, I'm lucky if I bring home 50-60k C-Bills after using consumables.

Then dont use consumables. They are lame anyway

[Jazzbandit1313]

Feetwet, on 22 October 2014 - 05:59 AM, said:

My god man you do realize that the MM system they have implemented is DESIGNED for you to lose around 50% of the time. And I don't believe the MM and ELO works AT ALL in the group queue. If it did, I don't think I would have to face the lords or 228 ever. Not complaining about the MM here but when half of my games are going to be a loss AND earn me nothing, my wins better earn me a CRAPTON. Like 100K for just figuring out how to turn the engine on.

Some of us aren't that good and don't have the time to 'get gud', now I can't even hope to dream that I might be able to buy a new shiny mech. Ever. (yes i know a bit of hyperbole)

S

I ain't gunna be the "ok well L2P or uninstall," but come on...you should be good enough to average 100K

[Feetwet]

Jazzbandit1313, on 22 October 2014 - 06:42 AM, said:

I ain't gunna be the "ok well L2P or uninstall," but come on...you should be good enough to average 100K

Well I CAN in the solo queue. But I don't play there much. The group queue is an entirely different beast where casuals like me get brutally manhandled by more experienced and serious players. But it is the only place to group with my buddies.

[Dark Jackal]

20k C-bills vs. 120k C-bills
or
40xp vs. 500-1000xp.

Folks, if you want more people to play this game on a day-in and day-out basis you really cannot have such a vast gorge between winning and losing. It makes NO SENSE as I'm sure over time you will be put into a random unlucky drop and you will get into a losing streak (especially if you solo). There should not be a vast difference in rewards especially if the players are playing the same way ALL THE TIME (and not being dead heads). That's just for current way things are in a game that lacks social interactivity other MMOs have as their bread and butter (like global chat rooms and team finders).

Think of it this way, if you rewards folks with such generous rewards by winning then turn around and made losing extremely painful, then you've essentially just agreed the unlucky 12 folks that played and lost wasn't worth their time or effort even though they did what was expected of them. "Balancing out" between winning and losing is a cop op as you want people to play regardless of how many wins or losses they have in order to have FUN. This fun-gap is way too extreme and needs to be normalized properly so that less lucky players make some form of progress from all the time and effort was made while losing.

Also, the new people once they get their cadet bonuses are going to run into the same experience and probably going lose a lot more often.

Edited by Dark Jackal, 22 October 2014 - 09:49 AM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Yeah it is kind of a bummer on rewards right now. I am not seeing a major hit like some of you but I am seeing about a 30% average decrease. This really became apparent to me last night on one of my matches with the new Altas.

2 kills
5 assists
554 damage
Victory

Pay out was only 174k and this included a 50% premium bonus and a 30% mech bonus. Without premium and on a standard mech that would have been a 90k award for what for me is an above average game. This game would have easily got me over 200k maybe even to 225k prior to the changes That is alot of difference and quite frankly I was pretty shocked to see the reward come up so low.

So I have to agree with the OP, I kind of feel like I am getting ripped off on my premium time right now while they HOPEFULLY increase the rewards at least back up to what I was getting before (which I thought were a little too low in the first place).

[Xarian]

Gyrok, on 22 October 2014 - 06:15 AM, said:

http://www.reddit.co...omy_murderball/

Maybe that will help some of you...

Just FYI, you get more cbills/xp for doing the most damage to a mech before it dies, than you do for getting the kill shot. So, theoretically, kill stealing/friendly fire should settle down once people realize it is to their detriment to try to do so.

Under the new rewards:
Killing blow - 30 XP
Kill by most damage - 80 XP
Solo Kill - 280 XP (most damage and killing blow on same target).

Also, Flanking and many other bonuses pay over time, so being around your group and not being off in some corner by yourself is much more to your benefit.

Based on only the information that you're providing here, a mech will get the most C-Bills by:

• Engaging and killing a fresh target instead of focus-firing someone with the rest of their team
  
• Putting damage on a non-damaged mech instead of killing a nearly-dead mech
  
• Maximizing your flanking bonus by staying in the rear of the murderball, and refusing to be near the front

See any problem with that?

• Engaging fresh targets and not focusing fire is the worst possible way to perform in a team battle
  
• Prioritizing fresh targets over damaged targets likewise doesn't remove any threats from the board, and will get yoru team killed
  
• Everyone staying in the rear of the murderball means that the murderball never moves toward the enemy

[Xarian]

Behemothk, on 22 October 2014 - 06:17 AM, said:

As we see from screenshots it is theme for useless newbs to whine?
I like that in new reward system no one can win 145K for 45dmg+2 kill assists. Learn to play not whine losers.

P.S. Try to communicate via chat with your teammates. Working together makes much more money in new system.
P.P.S. After patch i usually get about 130-200K for win. Not so good as it was, but thats fine.

One team loses in every match. Often these matches result in lopsided results, like 12-2 or worse. The losing team will make next to no C-Bills on this match. The losing team can be extremely coordinated and still lose. What's so hard to understand about that?

Getting a low score doesn't make you a "useless newb", and it doesn't make you a bad player. It means that you got a low score. People shouldn't lose 90% of their C-Bills because they lost a match; the old system used about 50%, and that was perfectly fine. Meaning that the winning players usually made about twice as much C-Bills as the losing team.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Yoseful Mallad, on 22 October 2014 - 05:48 AM, said:

The issue I see is that too many people got spoiled on making decent money even on a lose lol. I'm not saying we should make next to nothing but I also think the amounts we were making on a lose before, were I bit too accommodating for the losers.

As for people losing money on consumables, I do think they are priced a bit too high and always have been. The consumables IMO should be like 10K to 15K max.

It is not about being spoiled, it is about having fun.

Let me give you an example. World of Tanks. I played this game for several years but that entire time and primary reason I don't play now is that when you lose the rewards is so small you don't feel like your progressing at all. Also heaven help you get stuck on a losing streaking (my record was 38 in a row once) because your only getting 100 XP a match as opposed to 1000+ in a win. Basically losing was miserable and ended up causing untold frustration and anger when it happened to the point at times the game was not fun at all.

Fast Forward to MWO. I typically at one point could manage about 100-150k a loss and 200-250k a win. It was definitely better to win but I never felt frustration or rage when I loss, mostly because the reward for a loss was half way decent. This made MWO alot more relaxing and fun which is how I want to feel when I play a game, not stressed and raging at my team when we lose.

However when you start widening that gap between a win and a loss, then frustration and rage become common when your team loses and just like WoTs, heaven forbid you go on a 10-15 match losing streak.

Anyway, the goal of any successful game should be to avoid situations where frustration and rage is the reaction. The other situation to avoid is boredom and grind. Both those situations are now part of the game with the new rewards. Losses have became painful, not just something that happens and just thinking ahead to just how long it is going to take you to grind to the next mech makes you groan and sigh. This is bad.

[AlmightyAeng]

El Bandito, on 21 October 2014 - 06:20 PM, said:

This case clearly shows the new reward bias. A victory with 10 assists would have given you +100K reward easily in the old system, even without premium time. Now people really need to deal a lot of damage to make the assist count as bigger reward. Your XP seems fine as you did not deal much damage.

It is still premature to say it, but the new rewards are indeed more role warfare specific. Overall though (when you lump together the wins and losses), we are getting ripped off of our C-Bill rewards. Especially the newbies--whom PGI needs to attract in the first place.

Lol, you ran around and shot 10 guys once each with 4 medium lasers (or painted 9 and shot 1 dude a few times). I'm sure you were a HUGE help to your team. Frankly I think 142k is a little high for that performance.

Edited by Ghost Badger, 22 October 2014 - 12:03 PM.

[Xarian]

Ghost Badger, on 22 October 2014 - 12:03 PM, said:

Lol, you ran around and shot 10 guys once each with 4 medium lasers (or painted 9 and shot 1 dude a few times). I'm sure you were a HUGE help to your team. Frankly I think 142k is a little high for that performance.

A small, hard-to-hit mech running around and being a nuisance is a huge help to the team - people shoot at him and miss, and they stop shooting at better targets. It's called being a team player.

[AlmightyAeng]

Xarian, on 22 October 2014 - 12:04 PM, said:

A small, hard-to-hit mech running around and being a nuisance is a huge help to the team - people shoot at him and miss, and they stop shooting at better targets. It's called being a team player.

If there's a tiny spider running around 'being a nuisance' I ignore it and deal with a real threat. If it becomes a threat, I shoot it in the face.

20 damage a piece on 10 different mechs is rarely helping. That match was over 8 minutes long...meaning, on average, he shot his 4 ML's about once every 50 seconds. Yeah...not helping

But, I've seen people with even less damage who spot EVERYTHING! I just didn't see any TAG/NARC/UAV spotting on that record, so I can only assume he wasn't being useful in other ways that particular game.

Edited by Ghost Badger, 22 October 2014 - 12:08 PM.