36 replies to this topic

[Greenjulius]

bluepiglet, on 23 October 2014 - 11:11 AM, said:

He convieneintly put the scroll bar in the mid to hide the bonus, without 30% for the Hero mech and 50% premium. What he actually recieved was:

1st round: 107,060 CB

2nd round: 124,736 CB

3rd round: 64,900 CB

4th round: 90,754 CB

5th round: 44,455 CB

6th round: 72,580 CB

7th round: 155,801 CB

8th round: 157,005 CB

Total: 817,291 CB for 8 games without bonus

Average: 102,161 CB each game

LOOL, not that impressing no more?

This is starting to depress me. Rewards without premium time and hero boosts are going to be even lower now. The extreme lows will be evened out with the patch, but overall income will be down. The tag direct fire bug was the only thing making me believe the new rewards would net me more c-bills.

Back to running mediums, heavies and assaults. Time to stop playing lights all over again.

[Sprouticus]

Greenjulius, on 23 October 2014 - 11:17 AM, said:

This is starting to depress me. Rewards without premium time and hero boosts are going to be even lower now. The extreme lows will be evened out with the patch, but overall income will be down. The tag direct fire bug was the only thing making me believe the new rewards would net me more c-bills.

Back to running mediums, heavies and assaults. Time to stop playing lights all over again.

Overreact much?

The system has been in place for 2 DAYS! Give them time to balance it. Heck, they have already done a balancing pass, I am sure more will take place.

[Mirkk Defwode]

Redshift2k5, on 23 October 2014 - 09:53 AM, said:

I've gotten plenty of matches with similar numbers, nearly 300k, without using NARC or TAG

I can do well without using those as well. It's just far rarer to encounter...

Edited by Mirkk Defwode, 23 October 2014 - 11:49 AM.

[bluepiglet]

Elizander, on 23 October 2014 - 11:12 AM, said:

Let me know how much you'd get before with sub 200 damage.

Next to nothing, before the hotfix. I knew Narc/Tag was almost the only way to net good reward.

The tinny patch seems to have made the this embarrassment a bit less painful though. It's now at least playable for average Joe.

Edited by bluepiglet, 23 October 2014 - 11:30 AM.

[RG Notch]

Greenjulius, on 23 October 2014 - 11:17 AM, said:

This is starting to depress me. Rewards without premium time and hero boosts are going to be even lower now. The extreme lows will be evened out with the patch, but overall income will be down. The tag direct fire bug was the only thing making me believe the new rewards would net me more c-bills.

Back to running mediums, heavies and assaults. Time to stop playing lights all over again.

Hmm, making it only worthwhile when you run a hero and premium.....No reason PGI would want that right?

[Elizander]

Still seems okay after the hotfix. I did 134 damage and without premium and hero it would've given me 147,442 c-bills for protecting the assault lance in my kitfox the entire game until I died near the end.

[Greenjulius]

Sprouticus, on 23 October 2014 - 11:26 AM, said:

Overreact much?

The system has been in place for 2 DAYS! Give them time to balance it. Heck, they have already done a balancing pass, I am sure more will take place.

Normally I would say yes, but in this case, my favorite mech, a C-bill/non hero Kitfox, is now a scrap pile. Hit reg fixes made it so damn fragile last night, I thought something was wrong. I comforted myself with the idea that it would still be a good narc/tag c-bill farmer, but now that I hear direct fire no longer applies to tag, that will remove almost any reason to run it. It was a high risk, high reward build that more often than not would get you killed.

Now I need to not only cower behind friendly assault mechs because my hitboxes make me glass-fragile, but make very little c-bills while doing it. The old assist system was my bread and butter in my Kit Fox before. That is now, even with the hotfix, at about half the previous c-bill income. It's 3500 cbills now, previously 6500. I used to average 4-600 damage, 10 assists, and somewhere around 120-240k with premium time. The early reward system jumped that closer to 200-275k. Things looked really bright.

Now the reward system has dropped that down to 90-150k with premium time, and my mech explodes the moment I see an enemy. I'll be patient and await fixes, but this is the death of the kitfox. Especially as a decent pug mech. We already knew it wasn't competitive.

Edited by Greenjulius, 23 October 2014 - 11:49 AM.

[Elizander]

Greenjulius, on 23 October 2014 - 11:42 AM, said:

Normally I would say yes, but in this case, my favorite mech, a C-bill/non hero Kitfox, is now a scrap pile. Hit reg fixes made is so damn fragile last night, I thought something was wrong. I comforted myself with the idea that it would still be a good narc/tag c-bill farmer, but now that I hear direct fire no longer applies to tag, that will remove almost any reason to run it. It was a high risk, high reward build that more often than not would get you killed.

Now I need to not only cower behind friendly assault mechs because my hitboxes make me glass-fragile, but make very little c-bills while doing it. The old assist system was my bread and butter in my Kit Fox before. That is now, even with the hotfix, at about half the previous c-bill income. It's 3500 cbills, previously 6500. I used to average 4-600 damage, 10 assists, and somewhere around 140-200k with premium time. The early reward system jumped that closer to 200-250k.

Now the reward system has dropped that down to 90-150k, and my mech explodes the moment I see an enemy. I'll be patient and await fixes, but this is the death of the kitfox.

I've been using my kitfox. My reward isn't that low with premium. All the games I posted here are with my kitfox. Checking my screenshots I'm getting 140k-155k on my wins before any bonuses are added and I don't have a single game where I broke 300 damage.

[Mercules]

bluepiglet, on 23 October 2014 - 11:11 AM, said:

He convieneintly put the scroll bar in the mid to hide the bonus, without 30% for the Hero mech and 50% premium. What he actually recieved was:

1st round: 107,060 CB

2nd round: 124,736 CB

3rd round: 64,900 CB

4th round: 90,754 CB

5th round: 44,455 CB

6th round: 72,580 CB

7th round: 155,801 CB

8th round: 157,005 CB

Total: 817,291 CB for 8 games without bonus

Average: 102,161 CB each game

LOOL, not that impressing no more?

For a Light mech prior to the changes especially one running escort duty for Assaults and Heavies? Yeah those would be excellent earnings. I don't think you understand how many 60-70k games most lights had unless they waited and swooped in to get component destructions and tapped every enemy mech for assist bonus. Basically the ONLY way to play a Light mech and profit before was to run past the enemy team and drag a LL or ML over them all then sit back and wait for opportunities to take component destructions and such from other mechs. In other words "ECM LL Sniper Raven" was awesome at it.

[Lily from animove]

Greenjulius, on 23 October 2014 - 11:42 AM, said:

Normally I would say yes, but in this case, my favorite mech, a C-bill/non hero Kitfox, is now a scrap pile. Hit reg fixes made it so damn fragile last night, I thought something was wrong. I comforted myself with the idea that it would still be a good narc/tag c-bill farmer, but now that I hear direct fire no longer applies to tag, that will remove almost any reason to run it. It was a high risk, high reward build that more often than not would get you killed.

Now I need to not only cower behind friendly assault mechs because my hitboxes make me glass-fragile, but make very little c-bills while doing it. The old assist system was my bread and butter in my Kit Fox before. That is now, even with the hotfix, at about half the previous c-bill income. It's 3500 cbills now, previously 6500. I used to average 4-600 damage, 10 assists, and somewhere around 120-240k with premium time. The early reward system jumped that closer to 200-275k. Things looked really bright.

Now the reward system has dropped that down to 90-150k with premium time, and my mech explodes the moment I see an enemy. I'll be patient and await fixes, but this is the death of the kitfox. Especially as a decent pug mech. We already knew it wasn't competitive.

actually, not your kit fox is a money printing machine, which in case of the hero just prints even more loads of money. Abuse tag and narc, even if you just hide the entire time to just pop out and tag/narc a mech before it dies, you get well rewarded.

Edited by Lily from animove, 23 October 2014 - 12:13 PM.

[AlmightyAeng]

[Mawai]

Elizander, on 23 October 2014 - 11:01 AM, said:

You don't seem to understand. I have always run Premium and Hero mechs. Before this change my rewards for playing the way I do now were under 90k for winning with premium and hero mechs.

But the point I am making is that is just not true ...

Look at the last couple of wins
1 kill
10 assists
200 damage
1 to 2 component destruction
2 to 5 spotting assists
wins

What were these games worth in the old system?

1 kill = 4300
10 assists = 65000
200 damage = 4200
2 component destruction = 4200
2 spotting assists = 4200
Win = 25000

Total ~= 107000 with premium and 30% bonus = 192k

I could not tell if you had any saviour kills or other bonuses ... typically with that many assists you would have had some and they can pay off substantially.

So ... are you earning more for a win under the new system? It would appear that you probably are but it is hard to tell without the full information. Were you making 90k previously for a win like those you show above? Absolutely not. The increase looks to be on the order of 80k for a good game in these examples ... after premium and bonus.

Elizander, on 23 October 2014 - 11:48 AM, said:

I've been using my kitfox. My reward isn't that low with premium. All the games I posted here are with my kitfox. Checking my screenshots I'm getting 140k-155k on my wins before any bonuses are added and I don't have a single game where I broke 300 damage.

I think that is part of the point perhaps ... when running your ECM kitfox you are staying with the group ... providing ECM cover and fire support ... you are fulfilling one of the ideal roles and you are receiving rewards for doing so. Not all mechs are as well suited to filling a particular role as the kitfox.

[Greenjulius]

Lily from animove, on 23 October 2014 - 12:12 PM, said:

actually, not your kit fox is a money printing machine, which in case of the hero just prints even more loads of money. Abuse tag and narc, even if you just hide the entire time to just pop out and tag/narc a mech before it dies, you get well rewarded.

That video would be relevant if this were yesterday. The patch removed direct fire tag bonuses. Clearly they are still in the video. It did indeed print money on Tuesday, and it was glorious. If the direct fire tag bonus is gone, so are most of the reward c-bills from the new reward system.

What you are saying is now counter-intuitive to the general advice for how to survive with a kitfox post hitreg fix. The kit fox is now paper thin and dies from general laser vomit faster than a garden variety 106kph Raven. The only way to survive with the kit fox now is to stay behind your teammates and occasionally harass. Now, the moment you are looked at by an enemy, you instantly lose an arm, (A whopping 20 armor) usually the large left arm. That's where your Tag and Narc would be. Now you are just a LPL or LL carrying ECM mech with paper armor, and no more bonuses.

I never had these survival problems. It seems to be because of the hit reg fix, as now I play every match at least losing an arm, leg, or worse. Kit Fox needs armor buffs to stay relevant.

Edited by Greenjulius, 23 October 2014 - 01:52 PM.

[Greenjulius]

Elizander, on 23 October 2014 - 11:48 AM, said:

I've been using my kitfox. My reward isn't that low with premium. All the games I posted here are with my kitfox. Checking my screenshots I'm getting 140k-155k on my wins before any bonuses are added and I don't have a single game where I broke 300 damage.

Your Kitfox is a Prime Invasion model, right? 30% bonuses stack really well with 50% premium. I didn't pay for the Kit Fox bundle because I didn't really believe this game would be worth sinking money into. Now that my confidence has been restored over the past month, I can't buy this hero mech without buying a $30 pack of mechs I already own.

Instead I've bought the resistance and clan wave 2 bundles.

[Sprouticus]

After playing some kitfox this afternoon I can say for sure that the rewards for kitfox escort duty is pretty poor, even when I did ok damage and got a few assists. I think my best was a win with ~250 dmg and 4 assists and I got 125k with both premium and hero bonus.

I understand that 0/4 is not great but I am pretty sure that I was doing a good job in my role (as an escort). After that I stopped using TAG to maximize dmg and kills. I did better but it was still weak,


I guess the big question here is: Is that a role PGI wants to encourage with rewards? If they don't that is fine Ill find other things to do with my kitfox.

[Krivvan]

I'm hitting around 180k average (200k for a win, 100k for a loss) at the moment with premium (without hero) as a light in solo queue. Less in group queue (since every enemy dies long before you get a chance to do anything).

Edited by Krivvan, 23 October 2014 - 04:35 PM.

[Elizander]

Sprouticus, on 23 October 2014 - 02:36 PM, said:

After playing some kitfox this afternoon I can say for sure that the rewards for kitfox escort duty is pretty poor, even when I did ok damage and got a few assists. I think my best was a win with ~250 dmg and 4 assists and I got 125k with both premium and hero bonus.

I understand that 0/4 is not great but I am pretty sure that I was doing a good job in my role (as an escort). After that I stopped using TAG to maximize dmg and kills. I did better but it was still weak,


I guess the big question here is: Is that a role PGI wants to encourage with rewards? If they don't that is fine Ill find other things to do with my kitfox.

You should check my screenshots and see if you are acquiring similar rewards bonuses and work on the ones you are missing out on.

Including results for my two most recent kitfox games for reference. I used Arty and UAV in the first game but I didn't have to use it for the other because we got cave rushed by lights and mediums from tunnel in Forest Colony (they left their assaults behind and we killed their medium light lance before the direwhales every got to fire a shot. Our whole team was balled up around the 2 ECM kitfoxes that stayed to guard them). It's like LRM spam isn't even an issue.

Forced to use Airstrike+UAV (Cause we got blindsided and started out 0-3 then I saw all the enemy assaults in one corridor in Mining Collective so I let the airstrike rip. Killed one and messed them up quite bad. Probably a 200+ damage airstrike since I really didn't shoot much and died 6 enemy kills in)




No airstrike or arty used because the lights/mediums of the enemy team rushed in to our deathball without their assaults on Conquest Forest Colony. Half the enemy team was dead before I even saw the first direwhale.





I've been winning about 80% of my matches since I started playing my kitfox due to the changes (and everyone relying on 10-20 tons of LRMs that become useless with proper kitfox 3x AMS ECM support, that includes scaring off anyone plinking the back armor of your assaults with whatever weapons you have).

145k unmodified earnings for supporting the team and dealing only 48 damage? Yes please.

Was trying to get another 200k to buy a discounted Shadowhawk 2k so I played one more game which ended up in a loss. We didn't get any 100 tonners (80-90 ton assaults only) and the enemy team had 2 Atlas and 1 Dire at least. The team split up into 2 and I stuck with the heavy and assaults. Did UAV and Airstrike since we were falling behind. Scared off Novas that were trying to snipe our assaults from the top of the buildings in Mining Collective. Did pot shots, the mechs I was supporting eventually died but they damaged the Atlas and Direwolf enough for me to finish them off by myself for those 2 kills. Was pretty close though ended 10-12. Our last timber didn't balance out his lasers so when he lost an ST he only had a UAC5 left with little ammo.






Assists were low because the team split into 2 early. Not much you can do about that in the solo queue sometimes.

Edited by Elizander, 24 October 2014 - 02:41 AM.