145 replies to this topic

[Onmyoudo]

DarthPeanut, on 30 October 2014 - 04:52 PM, said:

I am sure he is saying that cause some are all bent out of shape about the K2 not getting PPC quirks. Personally I am with you... ACs and mediums are better build but the lore PPC build apparently has quite the following.

Also the fact that the K2 has a buttload of negative torso twist and yaw quirks that they are not removing.

[Widowmaker1981]

The question is this: (how soon) are they going to nerf that dragon?

Because if not i need to start buying and XPing dragons, its dumb OP... thats the same thing as 5x AC2, only with no heat... i played the BNC-3E with 4x AC2 and that was pretty damn good, but just too hot to compete with the 3xAC5 version. this is Arm mounted, on a chassis that can move at 100 kph... literally insane.

PGI: you CANNOT put cooldown quirks of that magnitude on AC5s or AC10s.

[Kiiyor]

luxebo, on 30 October 2014 - 05:43 PM, said:

Alright, so when we have seen the Dragon 1N... Take a good look at this: https://docs.google....&pli=1&sle=true

Look at JM6-S. GGclose clans. While it won't be severe extreme fast fire, it still will wreck face with 4 of em in the best layout possible. Going to be honest but even Dragon isn't going to be the best layout (esp with an easily disarmable arm and that it's so huge.) It is truly quick though (both weapons and mech itself.)

Will it be able to stand in front of a Timber though, or exchange fire with a Whale?

[Widowmaker1981]

Kiiyor, on 31 October 2014 - 02:57 AM, said:

Will it be able to stand in front of a Timber though, or exchange fire with a Whale?

yes, it very much will - moving laterally in front of the whale, the whale will not be able to see anything through the shake. id be surprised if it even hit the dragon once unless it just stood still. The Timber might get one laser vomit off, but unless it takes the AC5 arm off with that, it will also not be able to see anything to shoot back.

The arm is effectively a PPC that shoots every 0.5s and makes no heat. It will be so very broken.

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

faster and more damage down range and some lights get a crappy +4 to legs.... This is going to well for lights . You might have left everything the same and halved all the armor and internals of all lights.

Edited by Funkadelic Mayhem, 31 October 2014 - 04:52 AM.

[Widowmaker1981]

that dragon might not be too bad - playing around in smurfys if it carries enough ammo to keep those cannons firing (6T minimum, more like 8T really) it will have no other weapons to speak of (2MLs or a single ERLL at best) - so it will be very vulnerable to having that arm shot off. Having said that i still think no ballistic rate of fire quirk should ever be more than 25%, and this thing will be disgustingly OP if no one shoots off its arm.

[Triordinant]

Cattra Kell, on 30 October 2014 - 01:58 PM, said:

Dragon is live

Hot Dang!

[Kiiyor]

Widowmaker1981, on 31 October 2014 - 03:06 AM, said:

yes, it very much will - moving laterally in front of the whale, the whale will not be able to see anything through the shake. id be surprised if it even hit the dragon once unless it just stood still. The Timber might get one laser vomit off, but unless it takes the AC5 arm off with that, it will also not be able to see anything to shoot back.

The arm is effectively a PPC that shoots every 0.5s and makes no heat. It will be so very broken.

I doubt that immensely. Also, moving laterally? It won't be much faster than a Dire, will be dead easy to target, will be toting an XL engine, and still won't have the DPS, screen shake or stunlock of a Dakka Whale.

I have a few thousand drops in Jagers, and I have a fair idea of their vulnerabilities. They're easily the most fragile IS heavy, with their immense side torsos, puny arms that protect nothing but a scant few pixels behind them, and an almost universal need to carry an XL engine.

The Yager has to seek cover the instant it starts receiving return fire. All the DPS in the world means nothing if you're cowering behind a rock. Having said that, the Yager excels if it plays to it's greatest strength: long range direct fire support.

A Yager engaging any other mech unopposed at range should have the upper hand, because that's what it's designed for. The Clans have their DireWolf as an area denial tool, that punishes everything within a narrow arc in front of it's mammoth guns. The Clans have the MadCat, that is a jack of all trades and pretty much master of all. The IS will have the Yager; a glass cannon that punishes any unobservant and careless mech that ventures too far out of it's comfort zone.

I'm not saying it won't be a big deal, because it very well might - but let's just see how it plays in reality before we start calling it broken.

[RockmachinE]

I realized one thing watching these videos.

The changes are so drastic this will literally make or brake the game. I can't call it. But after this, the landscape of MWO will be completely different. I hope its for the better, but major changes like this have to power to kill a game, we have plenty of precedent in the MMO world.

Hope this works...

[Widowmaker1981]

Kiiyor, on 31 October 2014 - 05:50 AM, said:

I doubt that immensely. Also, moving laterally? It won't be much faster than a Dire, will be dead easy to target, will be toting an XL engine, and still won't have the DPS, screen shake or stunlock of a Dakka Whale.

I have a few thousand drops in Jagers, and I have a fair idea of their vulnerabilities. They're easily the most fragile IS heavy, with their immense side torsos, puny arms that protect nothing but a scant few pixels behind them, and an almost universal need to carry an XL engine.

The Yager has to seek cover the instant it starts receiving return fire. All the DPS in the world means nothing if you're cowering behind a rock. Having said that, the Yager excels if it plays to it's greatest strength: long range direct fire support.

A Yager engaging any other mech unopposed at range should have the upper hand, because that's what it's designed for. The Clans have their DireWolf as an area denial tool, that punishes everything within a narrow arc in front of it's mammoth guns. The Clans have the MadCat, that is a jack of all trades and pretty much master of all. The IS will have the Yager; a glass cannon that punishes any unobservant and careless mech that ventures too far out of it's comfort zone.

I'm not saying it won't be a big deal, because it very well might - but let's just see how it plays in reality before we start calling it broken.

wont be much faster than a Dire.. WHAT? it will be 2x as fast (89kph with tweak at least)

Its got a CT the size of alabama, you can't really hit the STs, its one of the best mechs to use an XL in.

Its also MUCH more able to keep the DPS on target than a dakka whale (arm mounted, with lower arm actuators instead of torso mounted on the mech with by far the worst torso twist profile in the game), its guns cant jam either... bear in mind that it has the equivalent DPS of 6!! AC5s, yes a DW can mount 6UAC5s, but they are clan (burst fire) and they jam. It will be very close to a Dakka whale in DPS, and a TON more agile.

We are talking about a Dragon, not a Jager.

It *might* be ok, only because at that RoF 2xAC5 will be eating a ton of ammo in ~7 seconds, so it will have to carry a LOT of ammo to keep firing, which severely limits its ability to carry backup weapons - meaning if you shoot its arm off it will be a stick, or close to it.

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 31 October 2014 - 06:42 AM.

[Verdic Mckenna]

*REDACTED* To the point of turning the Awesome into a bloody Gundam. *REDACTED*. What an insane design idea. *exhales* Ok. I am good now.

Heffey, on 30 October 2014 - 02:30 PM, said:

I get that no one uses these chassis but these buffs seem a bit excessive.

50% cooldown reductions are insane. I'd be surprised if they don't tone down these quirks after they collect some data.

(Redacted for the children.)

Edited by Verdic Mckenna, 31 October 2014 - 06:49 AM.

[Summon3r]

ummm all i got is .... WOW!!.... somehow clan mechs were just turned to bunch of scrap heaps lol... dont get me wrong i love these quirks but the clan mechs need a serious looking at, good lord ac20 mayhem, lbx10 mayhem, ac5 machine guns literally... forever fire ppcs lol let the fun times begin... like my Summoner needed any more trouble HAHAHA

[CygnusX7]

Won't make assumptions until these quirks are released.
Even then I'm sure some will be nerfed and others buffed.
It's easy to forget how terrible some of these mechs are and will continue to be even with increased internal structure, armor, firing rates, ranges and cooldown.

Really wouldn't put too much into all this. I won't buy mechs I don't already have just for quirks that may or may not be altered after release.

Edited by CygnusX7, 31 October 2014 - 07:50 AM.

[Sean Lang]

Just a note to all viewers: this is recorded in training ground, no mechs are shooting back at me. Also to note, most mechs in the training grounds are lacking a good portion of 'max armor' thus sometimes it may seem they die really quickly.

Also, some of these are the most extreme Tier 5 mechs, such as the AWS-8Q. Please be patient, wait till they come out, do a bunch of drops & science with them and we will be listening to feedback.

[Sigilum Sanctum]

Verdic Mckenna, on 31 October 2014 - 06:45 AM, said:

*REDACTED* To the point of turning the Awesome into a bloody Gundam. *REDACTED*. What an insane design idea. *exhales* Ok. I am good now.



(Redacted for the children.)

I'd be ok with the Awesome becoming a Gundam. As it stands now the 8Q is just shy of having a Buster Rifle/Mega Particle Cannon/Beam Magnum.

I WILL be investing in Awesomes, even if these current quirks get a little diminished.

[Scratx]

Sean Lang, on 31 October 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

Just a note to all viewers: this is recorded in training ground, no mechs are shooting back at me. Also to note, most mechs in the training grounds are lacking a good portion of 'max armor' thus sometimes it may seem they die really quickly.

Also, some of these are the most extreme Tier 5 mechs, such as the AWS-8Q. Please be patient, wait till they come out, do a bunch of drops & science with them and we will be listening to feedback.

Yep, I am reserving judgement until I see it all in action for a while.

But damn if it doesn't feel like it's going to be June 17th all over again. The Revolution Cometh.

[Sean Lang]

Scratx, on 31 October 2014 - 08:16 AM, said:

Yep, I am reserving judgement until I see it all in action for a while.

But damn if it doesn't feel like it's going to be June 17th all over again. The Revolution Cometh.

I think there is also some misinterpretation that ALL of these weapons will act this way on ALL mechs, which is not the case at all. Some mechs do not receive any quriks, or very little buffs. These videos really highlight the extreme here, which are needed to make them 'viable' to compete for play time.

[MisterPlanetarian]

People seem to forget that the Dragon has a CT thats poking out more than Pinocchios nose at the C-PAC Convention.

[Verdic Mckenna]

Sean,

Science. Yes. Fair. Ok. But that 8Q looks to be capable of reversing a battlefield decision if used properly. We'll find out soon enough to be sure. I think my deep and passionate concern is - why did they do what they did to Clan mechs in the first place if they were going to turn the 8Q into a rapid fire lightning gun wielding sniper? Yes, we all know Clans overwhelmed Inner Sphere Mechs. These quirks could have come sooner and changed that perception entirely very early on. Maybe it is the timing that I have an issue with. Why now? Why not then? We will science this. I just do not believe that the verdict will be that different from what it is having seen these Testing Ground videos.

Sean Lang, on 31 October 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

Just a note to all viewers: this is recorded in training ground, no mechs are shooting back at me. Also to note, most mechs in the training grounds are lacking a good portion of 'max armor' thus sometimes it may seem they die really quickly.

Also, some of these are the most extreme Tier 5 mechs, such as the AWS-8Q. Please be patient, wait till they come out, do a bunch of drops & science with them and we will be listening to feedback.

[Karl Marlow]

Cattra Kell, on 30 October 2014 - 01:58 PM, said:

Dragon is live

Well hell


I guess I'm going to have to figure out what I did with my Dragons engine and put it back in.