44 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

zortesh, on 06 November 2014 - 12:05 PM, said:

Is kinda weird none of the firestarters got even one flamer quirk, i mean the weapon is useless and would of doomed that variant to nonuse.. but thats not a danger with the ember because its tier one, and theres no danger of it becoming op because switching out your mediums for flamers would be gimping yourself.

Go on, give the ember flamer quirks, for flavor reasons.... Id love a mech with flamer range and flamer heat gen reduction.

Firestarter yes, Ember no.

[UrsusMorologus]

Should give flamer quirk to the chassis and then negate it on the ember

Flamers are critseekers like MGs, ember already has MGs, its the other Firestarters that need the buff

[Prezimonto]

Rizzelbizzeg, on 06 November 2014 - 12:44 PM, said:

Twisted firestarter

FupDup, on 06 November 2014 - 01:37 PM, said:

Quirking a weapon that is nearly useless means that you still are carrying a weapon that is nearly useless. We need Flamers to actually be viable on their own merits before considering the addition of Flamer quirks to specific chassis.

I've been saying for a long time that Flamers need to work more like chemical weapons that continue to burn after a mech is hit with a stream if they're to be useful for most light mechs.

The firestarters are prime example of the potential utility of added ammo/fuel based flamers to the game, and then quirking the living daylights out of them.

[ShadowWolf Kell]

I just want flame streaks coming out of my Firestarter's behind. I knew I shouldn't have eaten those BBQ beans before dropping into combat.

Anyway yeah they need to fix flamers before anyone even thinks about talking about flamer quirks lol.

[Monkey Lover]

Bishop Steiner, on 07 November 2014 - 07:39 AM, said:

Firestarter yes, Ember no.

So much hate for the ember haha. Its sad now my ember is the worst of all my firestarters. It was nice getting the cbill boost

[S13gtastic]

Honestly I'd just give the firestarters a quirk to reduce heat on flammer use and then make it so flammers do the same damage as a machine gun but instead of a crit seaking weapon make it so the flammers have a chance(15% or 20%) to cause ammo explosions.

Then it would be different than a machine gun but have utility it needs as well as being unique.

[Bishop Steiner]

Monkey Lover, on 07 November 2014 - 12:22 PM, said:

So much hate for the ember haha. Its sad now my ember is the worst of all my firestarters. It was nice getting the cbill boost

No hate. Just prefer it to do what it does, as a Pay to play mech. FS-9H is a better Flamer candidate, as it has 6 energy hardpoints, letting you mix and match more flamers to lasers.

[ShadowWolf Kell]

S13gtastic, on 07 November 2014 - 01:42 PM, said:

Honestly I'd just give the firestarters a quirk to reduce heat on flammer use and then make it so flammers do the same damage as a machine gun but instead of a crit seaking weapon make it so the flammers have a chance(15% or 20%) to cause ammo explosions.

Then it would be different than a machine gun but have utility it needs as well as being unique.

Yes this please. LRM boat roasting here I come, muahaha!

Oh, hi Mr. SplatCa... BOOM

Edited by ShadowWolf Kell, 07 November 2014 - 03:13 PM.

[Wibbledtodeath]

"pay to win" mechs should be balanced like all others- not gimped. With MG uselessness after the patch to "improve" hitreg the ember could use something. Its OPness is but a lingering rumour as all other embers (and many other mechs besides) are much better.

But yes. I agree with the OP that a quirk to encourage flamer use would be good. Quirks should ideally promote variety and mech flavour- not just balance out top tier play.

Even a simple range boost, crit chance boost or damage boost would be something.

And quirks are being used in other mechs to make underpowered weapons viable (e.g. LB10x, IS LRM 20 - although they are not as broken as the flamer). Nothing wrong with a short term fix/quirk even if the weapon is not overall well designed.

[Duke Nedo]

Monkey Lover, on 07 November 2014 - 12:22 PM, said:

So much hate for the ember haha. Its sad now my ember is the worst of all my firestarters. It was nice getting the cbill boost

Flamer quirks on Ember would be rather wasted, with only 4 E hardpoints you'd need to make flamers better than MPLs for anyone to be able to equip them...

[Nothing Whatsoever]

For Flamers, I've thought about having them like other energy weapons where they have a beam duration and a cooldown period.

Could be spec'd:
2.00 Damage
3.00 Heat
0.67 Beam
2.25 Cooldown
0.68 DPS
1.03 HPS

Then it can have quirks applied (such as heat gen reduction), and at least be able to mixed in with other weapons.

[Thunder Child]

I've always thought the Flamer should have the same DPS as a Small Laser, but instead of a Beam time and Cooldown, it's damage is averaged over the same period. Effectively, a continuous beam small laser, but it generates higher heat as a drawback. The advantage is you can use it on demand, rather than 'burning' it and then waiting for a cooldown.

NO extra heat on the target, and NO exponential heat for the firer for running it continuously. So, DPS of 1, HPS of 1.5. Done.

Also, +10 for the Ember getting an 880m range quirk for the (current) Flamer. It'd be worth it for the Lolz.

Edit: Also, although I could see the potential for it to be a burst weapon, like you're suggesting Praetor, If that were the case I think it should continue to apply damage over time. A burn effect, if you will (or heat, although I'm partial to the damned things just doing damage, as having them deal Heat was an "optional" rule).

Personally I think that they will never be able to figure it out if they are a Heat based control weapon. Just turn it into an acetylene (plasma) torch and be done with it.

Edited by Thunder Child, 13 January 2015 - 01:12 AM.

[StraferX]

Firestarters need fireball capability with the Flamer. Sort of a pointless weapon at this time but turn it into a sniping ball of fire and there ya got something, something like a napalm blob of death melting your face off.

[Ghogiel]

Swapping some of the laser quirks to flamer quirks is basically a nerf.

[Jaeger Gonzo]

zortesh, on 06 November 2014 - 12:05 PM, said:

Is kinda weird none of the firestarters got even one flamer quirk, i mean the weapon is useless and would of doomed that variant to nonuse.. but thats not a danger with the ember because its tier one, and theres no danger of it becoming op because switching out your mediums for flamers would be gimping yourself.

Go on, give the ember flamer quirks, for flavor reasons.... Id love a mech with flamer range and flamer heat gen reduction.

Its kinda weird non of the Kintaros hace SRM6 quirk, kinds weird QKD-5K not have ML&LL etc. etc.

[Aethon]

Destoroyah, on 06 November 2014 - 11:29 PM, said:

well that moment wouldn't be far off as there is bound to be someone that will make the claim the flamer is OP in it's current state.

No, no, no. The Clan Flamer is the one that is OP! Which, I might add, is why the Adder is so OP.

Edited by Aethon, 13 January 2015 - 02:33 AM.

[Cyborne Elemental]

TBH, I would rather see flamers fixed in general and not just for the FS.

[Ashrahm]

if flamers did damage like lava in terra therma does.
i'd buy me some embers for lulz.

[Bluefalcon13]

A cool idea for flamers would be if they could cause ammo cook off through armor. Think about it.... Its a flame thrower toasting an ammo box......

I wouldn't put an ammo can of 5.56 ball ammo in an oven.....

[GreyNovember]

Bluefalcon13, on 13 January 2015 - 06:58 AM, said:

A cool idea for flamers would be if they could cause ammo cook off through armor. Think about it.... Its a flame thrower toasting an ammo box......

I wouldn't put an ammo can of 5.56 ball ammo in an oven.....

Granted an ammo box with functioning heat sinks cooling all limbs.