209 replies to this topic

[0bsidion]

It doesn't matter if the TT ACs fired 1 round or 1 billion, they only struck one hit location. The only ACs that potentially spread damage were LBX with cluster rounds, and ultras would roll for two on a double tap. I'm not sure why this keeps coming up except as a faulty premise to advocate the conversion of all ACs to the way clan ACs work. Normal TT ACs with normal rounds did not roll for spread damage.

[Ultimax]

Kassatsu, on 12 November 2014 - 11:05 AM, said:

I'd be ok with near hitscan projectiles for fully automatic autocannons, or 40-round bursts over a second or two. Less BOOM TWENTY DAMAGE IN YOUR FACE and more dakka.

Unfortunately Clan UACs were gimped as their tiny projectiles were given equivalent speeds to much larger IS projectiles.


It really makes no sense for the CUAC 20 to have projectiles travelling at 650m/s and be small hits, the same speed as a huge impact 20 point IS AC round.



If they increased UAC 5s to 2000m/s, UAC 10s & 20s to 1300m or 1500m/s and then decreased the total time to fire a burst I could at least make peace with these, even if it's not 100% what I wanted.

[Triordinant]

Ultimatum X, on 12 November 2014 - 01:05 PM, said:

Unfortunately Clan UACs were gimped as their tiny projectiles were given equivalent speeds to much larger IS projectiles.

This is why.

[Ultimax]

Triordinant, on 12 November 2014 - 01:07 PM, said:

This is why.

What you've posted is irrelevant to what I've posted.

They would remain different, they would still be burst fire, they just wouldn't as be bad as they are now.

Multiple small projectiles fired in bursts should travel at similar speeds to other similar projectiles.


For CUAC 5 & 10, that's right around the size of an AC 2.

For CUAC 20, that's right around the size of an AC 5.


They should travel at those speeds.

Edited by Ultimatum X, 12 November 2014 - 01:10 PM.

[Triordinant]

Ultimatum X, on 12 November 2014 - 01:09 PM, said:

What you've posted is irrelevant to what I've posted.

They would remain different, they would still be burst fire, they just wouldn't as be bad as they are now.

Multiple small projectiles fired in bursts should travel at similar speeds to other similar projectiles.


For CUAC 5 & 10, that's right around the size of an AC 2.

For CUAC 20, that's right around the size of an AC 5.


They should travel at those speeds.

Details: Clan ACs of all kinds are lighter, generate less heat, take up less space and have more range than their IS equivalents (some don't even have IS equivalents). To balance them against IS ACs, Clan ACs were nerfed with burst fire. Increasing their projectile speeds would buff them again and counteract the nerf (and some believe Clan ACs need even more nerfing).

[Ultimax]

Triordinant, on 12 November 2014 - 01:23 PM, said:

have more range than their IS equivalents (some don't even have IS equivalents).

They have a higher listed range, but they aren't even close to that effectiveness at even IC AC ranges.

So the listed range is basically "a lie".

Triordinant, on 12 November 2014 - 01:23 PM, said:

To balance them against IS ACs, Clan ACs were nerfed with burst fire. Increasing their projectile speeds would buff them again and counteract the nerf (and some believe Clan ACs need even more nerfing).

They would still be burst fire.

People who believe they need more nerfing are delirious, if you gave players a choice every single smart player would always choose the heavier IS ACs.

Edited by Ultimatum X, 12 November 2014 - 01:28 PM.

[Tombstoner]

Strum Wealh, on 12 November 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

Again, the basic TT gameplay rules are an abstraction, an extreme simplification designed to facilitate minimized space & time requirements for TT gameplay.

Taking all of that into consideration how did MWO arrive at single shot for IS?
Where does the fun reside, in the sound of the auto cannon or the sparks caused by a successful hit. I don't think it can be all attributed to FLD. I would like to thing PGI tried both vertions burst vs. single shot, but for the life of me i cant figure out why they went with single shot. particularly since it added to inter-weapon balance complexity.

One option is server load. simply having too many shots to calculate.

I'm not sure if the effect is still present but you used to see sparks fly off and a change in heat with every hit. I find that sort of thing rewarding.

Edited by Tombstoner, 12 November 2014 - 01:30 PM.

[Captain Stiffy]

CITYTECH pp. 67 published by FASA in 1997

Quote

"An autocannon is a rapid-firing, auto-loading weapon that fires high-speed streams of high-explosive, armor-piercing shells."

[Triordinant]

Ultimatum X, on 12 November 2014 - 01:27 PM, said:

They would still be burst fire.

They were made burst fire so they would spread their damage. If their projectile speeds were increased, they would spread their damage less in burst fire. That's why it won't be done. They won't counteract a nerf they already have with a buff that would lessen the impact of the nerf.

[FupDup]

Ultimatum X, on 12 November 2014 - 01:05 PM, said:

Unfortunately Clan UACs were gimped as their tiny projectiles were given equivalent speeds to much larger IS projectiles.


It really makes no sense for the CUAC 20 to have projectiles travelling at 650m/s and be small hits, the same speed as a huge impact 20 point IS AC round.



If they increased UAC 5s to 2000m/s, UAC 10s & 20s to 1300m or 1500m/s and then decreased the total time to fire a burst I could at least make peace with these, even if it's not 100% what I wanted.

Don't forget the UAC/2, which is in just as sorry of a state as the rest...