23 replies to this topic

[GreyNovember]

I propose that, while retaining 12 players on each side, we drop in one lance, and for every one of us that dies, a replacement mech spawns back at base, or we spawn in full lances as each lance dies. This way we have at most 400 tons of mech shooting one another per side.

Spawn order would be Alpha first, Charlie last, with lights and mediums in alpha by default. You can rearrange yourselves as you will before the drop begins.

Edit: suppose instead of waiting for death, you dropped after each other in 30 second intervals?

Now then, Criticisms? Improvements?

Edited by Eonai, 01 December 2014 - 08:06 PM.

[101011]

Yes, yes, that would be super exciting. I totally want to spend 6 minutes watching a lance of lights duel.

[Kilo 40]

No

[Squally160]

[Captain Stiffy]

LOL yeah cause I want to sit around in a match doing nothing at all for 20 minutes.

NO.

[Tekadept]

The only improvement I can see in this suggestion is playing this card.

[GreyNovember]

Okay. So the initial reaction is " I dont want to wait and watch."

Any thoughts on making the system better then?

[Brody319]

>Alpine peaks
>Light lance goes first
>They all hide in the corners
>Tie
>gg

[hybrid black]

Eonai, on 01 December 2014 - 07:01 PM, said:

I propose that, while retaining 12 players on each side, we drop in one lance, and for every one of us that dies, a replacement mech spawns back at base, or we spawn in full lances as each lance dies. This way we have at most 400 tons of mech shooting one another per side.

Spawn order would be Alpha first, Charlie last, with lights and mediums in alpha by default. You can rearrange yourselves as you will before the drop begins.

Edit: suppose instead of waiting for death, you dropped after each other in 30 second intervals?

Now then, Criticisms? Improvements?

Eonai, on 01 December 2014 - 07:52 PM, said:

Okay. So the initial reaction is " I dont want to wait and watch."

Any thoughts on making the system better then?

well the same thing but on a timer lance one drops in at 0:00 lance 2 drops at 1:30 lance 3 drops at 3:00 slows the game down a bit, i would also say only on small maps

[Zapier]

I would say, if you're wanting to increase TtK, dropping in waves wouldn't be the way to go... the first step would be to try and address the reason why TT Battletech mechs tend to live longer. Remove pinpoint damage with most weapons, add some bloom or variance to many weapons to better address the fact that almost all weapons can be used to hit the same location at the same time to easily snipe and strip mechs from any distance with any weapon (that is assuming it's within it's range).

That way, just because I'm using 6 medium lasers at 400m when I have an optimal range at 300m doesn't mean all 6 lasers can easily pinpoint the head, LT, RL or whatever. Maybe that RT aim I went for, 4 of the lasers were able to hit and the other 2 maybe hit CT or RA. This would make brawling more effective since shorter ranges would be more accurate and long ranges would be better suited to things like PPCs and Gauss which should have the benefit of being more accurate.

It would be a relatively small tweak that could add much needed TtK in many situations without totally revamping gameplay.

[Inappropriate018]

Zapier, on 01 December 2014 - 09:44 PM, said:

I would say, if you're wanting to increase TtK, dropping in waves wouldn't be the way to go... the first step would be to try and address the reason why TT Battletech mechs tend to live longer. Remove pinpoint damage with most weapons, add some bloom or variance to many weapons to better address the fact that almost all weapons can be used to hit the same location at the same time to easily snipe and strip mechs from any distance with any weapon (that is assuming it's within it's range).

That way, just because I'm using 6 medium lasers at 400m when I have an optimal range at 300m doesn't mean all 6 lasers can easily pinpoint the head, LT, RL or whatever. Maybe that RT aim I went for, 4 of the lasers were able to hit and the other 2 maybe hit CT or RA. This would make brawling more effective since shorter ranges would be more accurate and long ranges would be better suited to things like PPCs and Gauss which should have the benefit of being more accurate.

It would be a relatively small tweak that could add much needed TtK in many situations without totally revamping gameplay.

Pretty much this. Note sure how dropping in waves affects TtK at all.

[Wrathful Scythe]

My Direwolf would still almost oneshot every mech in this game.
Don't know why it should increase ttk because you can still be shot at by 4 mechs. If you get shot by more than 4 mechs in a normal match, well, you've done something wrong and deserve to be shredded.

[Karl Marlow]

Zapier, on 01 December 2014 - 09:44 PM, said:

I would say, if you're wanting to increase TtK, dropping in waves wouldn't be the way to go... the first step would be to try and address the reason why TT Battletech mechs tend to live longer.

Mechs in TT Don't last longer. It just takes a long time to resolve turns. One of the longest matchs I've had in TT was around 40 turns. That is 400 seconds or around 6 and a half minutes. An average game is probably closer to 12 turns which is 2 minutes.

TTK in TT is extremely fast when you compare it to MWO. It's just a matter of scale. In TT you are standing around the table talking and joking with the other players and even if you lose you still had a good time. In MWO you dont' really have that even with VOIP. Everything is frantic and simultaneous. In TT you have the suspense of seeing your oponent line up that Gauss shot and rolling the dice to see if he gets that snipe kill. In MWO you just get a lose screen and have to wait around 10 minutes for the match to finish and get relaunched into a match.

TTK Isnt a discussion we should have in relation to the TT game. TTK needs to be a discussion about what is best for MWO as its own unique entity. I personally am very interested how people will feel about TTK when CW dropship mode is released. Dieing in MWO right now is annoytihng because you have a longish wait before you get back into the action. With 3 respawns to get your right back into the action and potentially redeem yourself in the same match might make people feel alot different about TTK.

[Zapier]

ThomasMarik, on 01 December 2014 - 11:18 PM, said:

Mechs in TT Don't last longer. It just takes a long time to resolve turns. One of the longest matchs I've had in TT was around 40 turns. That is 400 seconds or around 6 and a half minutes. An average game is probably closer to 12 turns which is 2 minutes.

Hmm, maybe you're right. Perhaps it's just me remembering more games where I had like a Hermes II being chased by three mechs for about 6 turns that couldn't seem to kill it no matter how many times they hit it because they kept hitting the non-critical locations... which allowed my support units to catch my opponent's from behind for crippling and killing shots.

There really is that missing thrill for me of knowing there's that mech that might or might not hit me. In MWO, I know a good pilot will always land his shots no matter the distance and almost always where he wants to hit me. Once you're critical or have a key wounded location anyone paying attention will take that out and in TT it was just harder and less reliable to do so in my experience.

That aside, CW dropship mode doesn't feel like the answer to the game as a whole either. Getting a second shot with a second mech won't always change some of the inherit problems. Just as dropping in waves doesn't change TtK, just delays it for some. Maybe my concern is that barring optimal range, most maps every weapon system is always in killing range of the enemy. Lacking good and proper role warfare just removes the need for weapons that are better and worse at engaging at various ranges. If a Gauss can hit PP at 1000m or 10m it's just always going to excel over a small laser.

Maybe I just miss alphas of every weapon system being more of a last resort or a bet on a sure thing rather than every volley. And just not for one or two volleys, but dozens. That was where the fun of vehicles were where mechs could do more brawling. Either way, I still think some accuracy variance wouldn't be a bad thing, and then maybe we could revert the armor changes from way back. I could also win some secret sweepstakes that PGI selectively opt-ed me into and give me everything I wanted. I think both are equally likely to occur.

[NextGame]

we wait long enough already. ttk is fine. play cw when it comes out which will have a sort of wave like system you are on about as everyone gets 4 mechs and drop again up to 30 seconds after they die.

[Quaamik]

Fixed convergence.

Think like the guns on WWII fighter plane. They were set to converge at some fixed distance, they didn't instantly adjust.

If an MLs have a best range of 300 m have them converge so that at any distance out to 300 m they will all hit the same section. Beyond that they start to spread outside a given section. It would limit multiple weapon hits to the same spot at longer distances.

The drawback would be increased brawling and increased use of LRMs at longer ranges.

LRMs could be countered by a tweak to accuracy and / or a improvement to AMS.

[Joseph Mallan]

Squally160, on 01 December 2014 - 07:14 PM, said:

I'll see your Vincent, and raise you...

[P H O X]

There needs something to be done for TTK. Its just ridiculous. Everybody is hiding in a ball behind something. Because if you walk out u are pretty much instant killed. Thats just plain stupid. The guys wo actually ran out to deal some damage, get instant killed, then the hiders and fast mechs lurk around to get a kill. I want some longer fights, some brawl, some possibilities to retreat somwhere if my lance movement fails a bit.

This shouldnt be that much of a action shooter. The curent gameplay is just boring. Trying to pick 2-3 with sniping and then stomp the rest in a headless rush.

And please stop referencing the TT ... we are not playing TT...
And also for the sake of gameplay:
Please dont always swing the "Mighty Lore-Hammer of Doom" (Buff: +10 for ending productive discussions)

[Kdogg788]

The only reason TT mechs last longer is because TT can be one LONG FREAKING GAME. Add to it the fact that it is a pretty unwieldy game that takes ages to go through the different initiative, movement, and weapon phases and it's obvious why we choose to play MWO and not TT. Good teams will focus you down and TTK will be super fast no matter what you do. I mean what do you suggest, triple armor and not double? I think the game is fine as is, especially with the upcoming dropship mode.

-k

[Burktross]

ThomasMarik, on 01 December 2014 - 11:18 PM, said:

Mechs in TT Don't last longer. It just takes a long time to resolve turns. One of the longest matchs I've had in TT was around 40 turns. That is 400 seconds or around 6 and a half minutes. An average game is probably closer to 12 turns which is 2 minutes.

TTK in TT is extremely fast when you compare it to MWO. It's just a matter of scale. In TT you are standing around the table talking and joking with the other players and even if you lose you still had a good time. In MWO you dont' really have that even with VOIP. Everything is frantic and simultaneous. In TT you have the suspense of seeing your oponent line up that Gauss shot and rolling the dice to see if he gets that snipe kill. In MWO you just get a lose screen and have to wait around 10 minutes for the match to finish and get relaunched into a match.

TTK Isnt a discussion we should have in relation to the TT game. TTK needs to be a discussion about what is best for MWO as its own unique entity. I personally am very interested how people will feel about TTK when CW dropship mode is released. Dieing in MWO right now is annoytihng because you have a longish wait before you get back into the action. With 3 respawns to get your right back into the action and potentially redeem yourself in the same match might make people feel alot different about TTK.

I've always struggled to properly word what you've just said. Do you mind if I keep this quote copied for the next "TTK" thread?